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Old January 7th, 2019, 02:40 PM   #41
tgold
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MOTM - Nov '15
Quote:
Originally Posted by SpotTheDogg View Post
A few iterations of the ZZR250GP since I last checked in, Paul build a Honda NSF250R Moto3 inspired under tail exhaust.







We had the ZX-6R front end on it for a while, but Paul said it was incredibly harsh. he abandoned it for the stock fork and we didn't look at it again. Only this weekend did he tell me it had come from a stunter's bike, doh! The compression circuit was probably modified. I had just done a refresh and springs, couldn't understand why it was un-rideable.



I did a ZX6R front end on a very light (285 lb) project bike and I had the same issue. Did you go lower on the spring rate? I had to do that with my 290lb 250 Ninja with the stock front end with emulators. Even though I weigh around 190 lb I had to use springs that were close to the stock spring rate.
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Old January 7th, 2019, 03:46 PM   #42
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Old January 7th, 2019, 04:11 PM   #43
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Adding those under seat pipes to the bike increased the system length quite a bit, did you notice any difference in the power or where peak power is now ? More or less torque ?
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Old January 8th, 2019, 09:06 PM   #44
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohawk View Post
Adding those under seat pipes to the bike increased the system length quite a bit, did you notice any difference in the power or where peak power is now ? More or less torque ?
I don’t own, and never rode the bike. Paul seemed happy with the result. He chose to do two into two with this system, no crossover.
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Old January 9th, 2019, 02:01 AM   #45
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MOTM - Feb '18
Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohawk View Post
Have a look at a KR1-S swingarm, its the same weight as the steel oem, but much bigger section. See pic's here.

KR1-S Picture
https://upload.wikimedia.org/wikiped...saki_KR1-S.jpg

My ZZR250
https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kcg0auipy...fWBY3anya?dl=0

Loving it, just passed annual inspection today YEAH.
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Old January 9th, 2019, 04:02 PM   #46
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Try this https://www.dropbox.com/sh/kcg0auipy...fWBY3anya?dl=0
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Old January 9th, 2019, 04:03 PM   #47
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Looks like Dropbox has a fault !
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Old January 10th, 2019, 07:49 AM   #48
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How easy was that swingarm to swap in? The Ninja600R swap took 5 minutes
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Old January 10th, 2019, 08:26 AM   #49
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If I hadn't changed all the bearing & had the arm blasted & powder coated then, it would have been a 5 minute job.

Points to note;-

1. The ZZR swingarm pivot is 16mm, KR-1S is 20mm, solution, is a piece of od20/id16 stainless steel pipe cut to length to suit.

2. The KR-1S swingarm has sufficient room for 4x neddle roller bearings, but only 2 are fited as standard. I used 4 works a treat should last longer than the bike.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 02:03 PM   #50
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohawk View Post
If I hadn't changed all the bearing & had the arm blasted & powder coated then, it would have been a 5 minute job.

Points to note;-

1. The ZZR swingarm pivot is 16mm, KR-1S is 20mm, solution, is a piece of od20/id16 stainless steel pipe cut to length to suit.

2. The KR-1S swingarm has sufficient room for 4x neddle roller bearings, but only 2 are fited as standard. I used 4 works a treat should last longer than the bike.
In the Ninja600R swap I just used the ZZR pivot rod and one of the 600R pivot rods in the bell crank. I tapped the bearings in about 2mm and ground off about 1.5mm in width. I do think the PO may have already narrowed it to fit an EX500 frame though. We got two 600R swingarms in the EX500 pile of parts we bought so we will stick with that.
However, we won't put one on this bike as the stock swingarm must be retained in LWSS250 Class.
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Old January 10th, 2019, 03:49 PM   #51
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The ZZR & KR-1S frames are very similar, I think Kawasaki just retasked the production from KR to ZZR by changing the extruded side rails & internal cross bracing to suit the ZZR.

My little motorcycle party quiz question is what was the most powerful 4-stroke motorcycle by HP for the longest time ? Answer the GPZ/GPX/ZZR/Ninja 250. Rated at 45hp by the factory, for 180bhp/Litre !!!!! They all say what, but it was launched in 1984 (Japan only) and was still in production until the 300 took its place, but still exists in parts of the world as a 250, but based on the 300 engine. It took until around 2005/06 before a litre bike made a claimed 180hp ! So for 20 years the baby Ninja’s were the most powerful engines you could buy.

The 4 cylinder 250’s didn’t make any more power due to Japanese regulations & the 600’s never quite matched the HP per litre on the baby Ninjas until the very late 90’s or early 2000’s but they never surpassed them. . Interesting that the engine tech for these kinds of power levels existed way back in the 80’s.

Interestingly, rumour has it that Kawasaki May be planning to launch a new 250 4-cylinder !!!
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Old January 10th, 2019, 06:37 PM   #52
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Paul’s only dyno’d at 33hp. He used to have a KR-1S when he lived in England
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Old January 10th, 2019, 07:20 PM   #53
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MOTM - Nov '17
I think there's lots of errors in online specs and repeated mistakes in copying those errors site-to-site. Only 4-cylinder 250s got 45hp and to get it, they had to redline @ ~19000 RPMs+ !!! The ZXR-250a and ZXR-250c (1988-2004) 4-cyl models were only Kawi 250s that had 45hp and used 4x CVK-D30 downdraft carbs to flow enough air and fuel. That's twice as many same-sized carbs as we have on our Ninjettes! One of the few correct spec-sheets for ZXR250 that didn't confuse it with an EX/GPz250 or ZZR250 (note sportier frame specs): https://www.motorcyclespecs.co.za/mo...r250r%2089.htm

I was eyeing mid-90s CBR250RR 4-cyl for sale in SF for while. Just worried about getting parts for it.

Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; January 11th, 2019 at 02:42 AM.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 01:23 AM   #54
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SpotTheDogg View Post
Paul’s only dyno’d at 33hp. He used to have a KR-1S when he lived in England
As did everyone elses, the 45hp is Kawasaki claimed figure for the rest of the world & measured at the crank as was the way in the past. Even at 40hp, that equals 160hp per litre, still took 1K bikes till the early 200x before they reached that power level.

I'm going to get mine dyno'd before I add the big bore & then after to see how they compare.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 02:31 AM   #55
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All manufacturers specify HP at crank. It's more consistent and the higher numbers without drivetrain losses is better for marketing. A newgen has ~29hp at crank and typically dyno-tests with 25-26hp at wheel.

Here's the 250s I want: https://www.cycleworld.com/250cc-two...omparison-test
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Old January 11th, 2019, 02:53 AM   #56
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You & me both, but they are really expensive now. People over here (UK) have added Banshee snowmobile engines to some of these. They are based on what was the RD/RZ350 from the mid 80's, but can be taken to 500 or 550cc, with 80-90hp from a leightweight parallel twin 2-stroke !

My plan was to supermono the ZZR, but I liked the little Ninja emgine so much I decided to keep it. I have Versys-X 300 which uses the 300 Ninja engine, so the big bore plan was hatched to try to make 40hp at the rear wheel. We'll see how I get on

Last futzed with by Mohawk; January 11th, 2019 at 04:09 AM.
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Old January 11th, 2019, 06:09 AM   #57
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Quote:
Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
All manufacturers specify HP at crank. It's more consistent and the higher numbers without drivetrain losses is better for marketing. A newgen has ~29hp at crank and typically dyno-tests with 25-26hp at wheel.

Here's the 250s I want: https://www.cycleworld.com/250cc-two...omparison-test
We’ve been seeing 29-31 on the dyno with new generation depending on mods
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Old Yesterday, 10:42 AM   #58
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Fantastic work!!! Beautiful bikes! I'm considering attempting a 2006 SV650 fork swap on my 2013 300 Ninja. This could get interesting. lol
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