Cornering

[JMcDonald]

Originally Posted by Misti

YAY!!!!



YAY!!!





YAY!!!!

Glad you guys are all able to put some of this stuff into practice and that you are able to see the benefits and are noticing a difference! It pays to take a good hard look at your own riding and to work on improving aspects of it every day!

Sweet

Misti

Thanks for pointing us in the right direction!

[Misti]

Originally Posted by JMcDonald

Thanks for pointing us in the right direction!

Anytime, and please, if you have any specific questions that you want answered feel free to ask. Just start a thread and invite me to join or PM me or whatever!

Cheers and Happy Holidays!

Misti

[rockNroll]

Originally Posted by Misti

Anytime, and please, if you have any specific questions that you want answered feel free to ask. Just start a thread and invite me to join or PM me or whatever!

Cheers and Happy Holidays!

Misti

You do realize that knowing all this stuff makes you hawt..... right?

[Francis]

Originally Posted by areifel

Don't quote me. But, I believe you lean more and accelerate a little. You'd be surprised how far the bike will lean. Make sure to look through the turn and not at the ground.

Hey, guys. The riding course isn't available at the moment, but would like some info since info's always good, right?

Anyways.. Can someone tell me the science behind this whole 'looking through the turn'?

At the moment, the only reason I can think of that makes looking at the ground bad is because you're not aware what's in front of you (hazards?).

I read somewhere that you look through the turn, and when you look at where you want to go with proper speed/control, you will end up getting there.

Thanks o.O

[tapdiggy]

I got a bit ADD about halfway down page 1, so don't hate me if this is already posted:

This might be obvious but, if you get in trouble in a corner, Do not pull the clutch all the way out. Ask me how I know.

[ally99]

Originally Posted by Francis

Anyways.. Can someone tell me the science behind this whole 'looking through the turn'?

At the moment, the only reason I can think of that makes looking at the ground bad is because you're not aware what's in front of you (hazards?).

I read somewhere that you look through the turn, and when you look at where you want to go with proper speed/control, you will end up getting there.

Welcome Francis! "Looking where you want to go" is the KEY to making it through most any maneuver on our bikes, whether it is a low speed U-turn or a high speed corner. For some reason, your brain sends your body in the direction of your nose, so always keep your nose pointed where you want to end up. A thing called "target fixation" is when you look at the wrong thing (like looking down at the ground, at a curb, etc), you'll go there instead...trust me. This principle holds true for horseback riding, mountain bike riding, etc. Welcome to the forum, by the way.

[backinthesaddleagain]

^^ Just like in skiiing. If you look at that hazard you want to avoid you find yourself getting closer and closer to it. If you look where you want to go you will avoid the hazard. Lead with your eyes and everything else will follow.

[wvninja]

My MSF instructor yelled at me constantly about this. He said I should turn my head to point in the direction I want to go. I may turn my head slightly but I look with my eyes on where I want to go.

Shrug... I've never had a problem and don't see the point in turning my whole head to fixate on "where I want to go" when I should be also watching conditions around me. Just my 2 cents.

[Misti]

Originally Posted by Francis

Hey, guys. The riding course isn't available at the moment, but would like some info since info's always good, right?

Anyways.. Can someone tell me the science behind this whole 'looking through the turn'?

At the moment, the only reason I can think of that makes looking at the ground bad is because you're not aware what's in front of you (hazards?).

I read somewhere that you look through the turn, and when you look at where you want to go with proper speed/control, you will end up getting there.

Thanks o.O

When you look where you want to go you gain information about what is coming so you are able to take that information and use it to decide what to do with the control inputs on the bike. If you look into a turn before you actually turn the bike then you can see the shape of the turn and you then know how hard and how much you need to press on the bar to get the bike to go there.

When you look through the turn it gives you information on what the turn is doing, is it tightening up or opening up, and once again it allows you to decide what to do, like roll on the gas. Looking through the turn not only helps you KNOW what to do with the controls but as you said it enables you to scan for hazards.

Also, by looking up and through the turn your perception of speed changes. If you look down at the ground or only a few feet in front of you then your sense of speed is different than if you look 20 or 30 feet in front of you.

How come some people seem to be able to look through the turn without even thinking about it while other people have to really train themselves to do so? What kinds of things will help you improve your visual skills?

Misti

[coondog]

Originally Posted by Havok

I push the bars a bit more, give a tad bit of throttle to get stable and trust the bike will hold.

right on bro, saved my bacon last time i thought i owned this s turn. only thing to do, plus that trust and pray stuff. i usually pray after cleaning my shorts however.

[cynicalkit]

Originally Posted by randomwalk101

Most of crashes (rider's fault) occurs in corner. Mostly hitting them too fast. So when you enter a corner a little too fast, what do you do?

Lean more?
Rear brake?
Engine brake?
Soft front brake?
Abandon bike and bail?
Pray?

This is Shane (Not Kit)


If you enter a corner hot, have good trajectory, and have room to adjust I recommend you trail.



Trail braking is not the easiest thing to learn but is something that anyone can try once you trust your basic skills and the bike you are riding. Some riders trail with the rear brake (Typically Offroad First Riders who are very familiar with rear braking in loose traction) but it is more common with road racers to use the front brake to trail.


Trailing the brakes lightly with even just the weight of your first two fingers on the brake lever will cause enough drag on the lever to create resistance in the brake system from the pads dragging on the rotors (Keep in mind the rotors are almost touching even when not being used).

This drag is enough to slow the bike and the result is a tighter turn. The decrease in the arch of your radius brings the bike back into a course you prefer and once you are back on course you can get maintain throttle and prepare to accelerate out of the corner.



If you have questions about the technique, check Keith Code's instructional videos.

[demp]

Originally Posted by cynicalkit

Trailing the brakes lightly with even just the weight of your first two fingers on the brake lever will cause enough drag on the lever to create resistance in the brake system from the pads dragging on the rotors (Keep in mind the rotors are almost touching even when not being used).

I had no idea there was a name for that! I actually found myself doing that a few times, just seemed like the safest way to slow down without upsetting the angle of the bike

edit: I really need that book.

["A"]

No body positioning is going to save you from these:

Link to original page on YouTube.

[Alex]

Complete dumbass in that last video, but at least it's somewhat instructional. See how he panicked, locked up the rear wheel, the bike slid straight where he didn't want to go, right off the road. Even though it looked like he was going so much faster than the video bike and the slow bike ahead, the dumbass still could have reeled things in easily with more front brake and just steering rather than locking up the rear and praying.

[rusninja]

Originally Posted by "A"

Link to original page on YouTube.

I really got to say that was the cleanest fail i have ever seen, like a cat that man is. :S

[GeorgiaHooligan]

Slow in Fast out.

[GeorgiaHooligan]

Im glad the slow bike didnt get rear ended in the mix of everything.

[oroboros]

I spend the majority of my time on this road. Bottom line is that it is a great place to ride. However, I will not go on the weekend (unless its really early). I am not worried about my ability but you see this sh*t all of the time! There are lots of people riding well beyong their skill level. It is a bit comical riding behind some bagger watching them drag parts trying make some of these turns. It's not so funny when they are coming at you in your lane.

The skies parted breifly on Thursday after days of rain. You would think this place was Sturgis there was so many bikes.

[oroboros]

actually watched the vid. They were going way too slow. No wonder they got passed. The guy came around a blind corner to find a bike practically stopped in the road. Thought he might slip on the inside while the guy went wide. Douche move passing on the inside and he paid for it.

I would have passed them.

BTW, dont forget the Ninja 250 gathering at Deal's Gap!

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showt...=dragon&page=2

[oroboros]

Who's the dumb ass now?

ME!

["A"]

Went down at the same spot?

[bdavison]

Let me put it to you this way. Unless the pegs are scraping pavement, the bike has not reached it limit of turning performance.


If you hit the brakes and run wide, or dump it on purpose cause you chickened out...dont blame the bike or the road later.

If you hit it too hot, ride that sucker for all its worth.

[oroboros]

Nope, not the same spot.

I was leaned over nicely and carving a line, everything felt great and I was sticking to the road no problem.

I dragged the kickstand safety switch on the pavement and upset the bike.

[oroboros]

removed the peg feelers a while back. I scrape the foot pegs often and have hit the kickstand switch before but this time it was enough to pick up the rear tire. Luckily I was practically on the ground before I hit it.

[austexjg]

This is my fear since going with the rear set plates. Glad your okay.

[oroboros]

Thanks!
I'm gonna take it off and grind it down. I know someone here recommend it to me previously and I should have...
Posted via Mobile Device

[Liber]

Originally Posted by bdavison

Let me put it to you this way. Unless the pegs are scraping pavement, the bike has not reached it limit of turning performance.


If you hit the brakes and run wide, or dump it on purpose cause you chickened out...dont blame the bike or the road later.

If you hit it too hot, ride that sucker for all its worth.

Basically what my MSF instructor told my class. "If you are on a sportbike and you come into a turn too fast, just lean and keep looking through the turn, and you will probably make it."

My balls aren't big enough to put this to the test yet, but I have leaned the bike over pretty far past my comfort zone and come out of it just fine. My comfort zone keeps growing...

[CC Cowboy]

Originally Posted by Liber

My balls aren't big enough to put this to the test yet,

My balls aren't big enough to decide crashing is the thing to do. I would rather ride out the turn than give up and go down!

Don't ever give up!

[Liber]

^ O I won't, just got back from a sweet ride south of town on some winding backroads. If anything, I feel like my skill at judging curves is improving.

My MSF instructor also told us about the number of people he hears saying "don't worry about counter-steering, just lean into the curve." Taking turns on a sportbike, I don't know how anyone could ever ride a motorcycle without counter-steering. I took my MSF on a provided cruiser, but counter-steering was one of the few skills that came to me naturally. The amount of control you retain when your bike feels like it could go over at any second is insane. I like it.

[Alex]

Ouch! You OK?

[ally99]

My hubby and I ride through Deal's Gap and the NC Smokies fairly often. We love it up there! Cornering is such an exciting yet controlled rush! It can be heart-pumping just as easily as it can be meditative.
Unfortunately, I've had the experience of dropping my bike in a corner at Deal's Gap. My form was great, my line was good, and all felt right...until an unexpected dip bottomed out my suspension and I was over. My egregious errors were: using 100% of my traction rather than leaving enough in reserve for "unexpecteds", as one should always do on public roads. The other costly mistake was not seeing the dip. I was already looking all the way up the hill and around the corner that the dip completely sneaked up on me.
Long story short, I got up and rode away after hubby and I got Lil' Ninj out of a ditch, so I was fine. My ego was bruised pretty badly. It was my very first auto accident ever.
Learned from it. Cornering is still the most fun thing to do on our 250s!

[BISH]

Originally Posted by ally99

"Looking where you want to go" is the KEY to making it through most any maneuver on our bikes, whether it is a low speed U-turn or a high speed corner. For some reason, your brain sends your body in the direction of your nose, so always keep your nose pointed where you want to end up. A thing called "target fixation" is when you look at the wrong thing (like looking down at the ground, at a curb, etc), you'll go there instead...trust me. This principle holds true for horseback riding, mountain bike riding, etc. Welcome to the forum, by the way.

[oroboros]

Looking forward to seeing you out there ally. At least my slide was to the right. Didn't have worry about being run over or taking anyone else out (or going off the edge of the hill).
Posted via Mobile Device

[oroboros]

After my lowside this morning I decided to go right out and buy me a new bike.





I have a feeling that with this ground clearance I will have no problem dragging parts.










I present: Biketard












ugh, next picture will not be until I loose 20#'s

[Alex]

Does it come standard with a little bell?

[oroboros]

Nope, but I picked out a cute one with flowers. brrrringggg, brrrringgggg!

[Liber]

you should buy some of those plastic things that fit on the spokes.

[CC Cowboy]

Do you have baseball cards in the spokes yet?

[oroboros]

I just got it. The mods are coming!

[Jinx250]

I don't get why everyone is preaching to roll on the throttle. I though the original premise is that the newb rider is going into a turn "too hot" from their perspective. I think we can all agree that the sentiment is that it's too hot for the rider's skill level, and not relative to the bike's performance envelope.

IMO The best answer is to use the throttle to modulate the speed, by rolling off ever so lsightly, while maintaining or increasing the lean angle. Most new riders (and some "veteran" riders) do not have a solid grasp on how much (how little) it takes to lock up a rear brake, so having them trail brake (and yes, I know that's not true trail braking) is probably not a good idea. In an Oh S**T moment, where you're going into a turn too hot, how is going *faster* going to make that situation any better? When I was a newb, I usually ended up standing the bike up to hit the brakes and running into the next lane, albeit briefly. Never once did accelerating seem like a better option than slowing down. I still feel the same way, except now, on the rare instance where I go in too hot, I have the experience to do more than just stand her up and hope for the best. And the choices still do not include more speed.

JMO, YMMV