Air to Fuel ratio problems?

FUAFUA · August 23rd, 2009, 01:16 PM

I'm not really sure how to explain my problem so I am just going to throw everything out there that I have noticed that doesn't seem right with my bike or that's different than before. First off, if I have the bike in neutral or in gear with held in clutch w/e -the acceleration is exaggeratedly sluggish, It takes maybe 4 and a half seconds to go from 2k to its max(That's in neutral, it takes much longer if the engine has to rotate the tire) and the bike will not reach red line; in any gear, at any speed, or even in neutral. I thought maybe I should shim my needles, but my bike has no problem starting up from cold and it has no problem accelerating from a stop, that is to say if I am in first gear I can let the clutch out and the bike will drive "normally" until it hits maybe 5 or 6k then it loses all power, then if I switch in to second gear and I'm in the low rpm range it still has no power, so its weird that I only have power in the very low rpms in first gear and then in all other gears it seems like it has no power at all(not enough torque?). I should say that I removed my snorkel about a year ago and I was going to put it back but it seemed like a lot of work and seeing as this is a recent problem and I've had my snorkel removed for a very long time and it was fine before I don't think that's the problem. Unless over time that has done some kind if permanent damage to my bike and that would suck. Other than that my main problem is that my bike accelerates slower than a pedal bike and its new max speed is 55mph. It's weird, I'll be at high rpms in maybe 4th gear going 55 and then I'll switch to 5th gear and the bike will not speed up it will just lower its rpms as if it had to work harder in a higher gear to maintain the same speed, but alas it wont go faster than 55mph and I'm not driving it because when I do theirs always soccer moms in their minivans honking their horns at me because it takes me two minutes to go from 0 to 45 mph then I hit a stop light and I have to start over again. I got a brand new air filter(didn't help, maybe made it worse) and I was looking into how to check my fuel filter, make sure it's not full of gunk, I'm pretty sure my problem is that my bike is getting to much air and not enough fuel because it has no pulling power whatsoever. I just don't know where to start on how to fix it, as I said I was going to shim my needles but Idk if theirs a simpler solution. I would put the snorkel back in, that would probably help but the snorkel doesn't affect air flow that much, I covered the little hole where the snorkel should be and it did not make a huge difference, there was a little more accelerating power but I still maxed at 55mph. I just need to find out how to waste more petrol I guess. Any help will be appreciated, I'd like to start riding again, Thanks.

kkim · August 23rd, 2009, 01:32 PM

did this start all of a sudden or was the bike stored for a few months or so and the problem started?

maybe a bad tank of gas? have you flushed and refilled the tank since having the problem?

FUAFUA · August 23rd, 2009, 01:42 PM

It's been happening for a while it was like a slowly progressing problem, before it would have problems accelerating until i hit 7k and then it would accelerate like a little speed demon, so I would just make sure the rpms never went below 7k when i was riding. So the problem was there before, then I went on a vacation and did not ride it for a week and when I came back I had to use the bike to go to the store and it was having some serious acceleration problems, I thought it was because it wasn't warmed up properly as sometimes, ever since the bike was new if I didn't warm it up it would do that, that's normal. but then at the store I warmed it up for a very long time and I took it for a ride in the parking lot and it was better but then, as I was riding it kept changing between riding normally and the slow acceleration problem I am having now. At the time, I was riding two up so I thought that maybe there was to much weight. Now it seems to only ride slow all the time, I have changed the gas in it twice and same thing so if it's a gas problem I suspect it will be the fuel filter is clogged which I am going to check out tomorrow.

kkim · August 23rd, 2009, 01:47 PM

okay... fuel filter is on the end of the fuel line from the tank right where the line enters the carbs. for now, remove the filter and run w/o one and see if the problem improves. Later, buy a small plastic inline filter and install it halfway up the fuel line so you can easily see crud that it catches.

how many miles so the bike? any mods to it other than snorkel removal?

FUAFUA · August 23rd, 2009, 01:52 PM

It has 4700 miles on it and no mods other than the snorkel removal.

kkim · August 23rd, 2009, 01:59 PM

pull a spark plug and take a look at the insulator color. from what you say, I'd guess your bike is running lean from running w/o the snorkel and not shimming to compensate. possible some damage from prolonged running like this.

the plugs should will tell you a lot.

FUAFUA · August 23rd, 2009, 02:51 PM

They seem fine to me, the only problem I can see is that it seems like part of the spark plug is stuck in that little black tube. I don't think it's supposed to be like that but I couldn't get the other part out of the tube. I wanted to try riding it without the fuel filter but this is Florida so of course it started raining. Plus I couldn't find any pictures of it in my google search so I don't really know which part it is X P

kkim · August 23rd, 2009, 02:57 PM

err... macro setting on your camera??

either that or I'm going blind.

what color is the insulator inside the plug?

I think the black thing you talking about is supposed to be there inside the plug socket.... it's there to hold the plug inside the socket down those deep plug wells in the engine.

edit... which does your plug look like? Have you checked both?

FUAFUA · August 23rd, 2009, 03:15 PM

No I just couldn't get the darned thing to focus on the spark plug, it kept focusing on my hand or the floor or my foot, I only looked at one but it looked brand new. I don't remember the color of the insulator but since I only did one I guess I'll do the other one if it stops drizzling. I had to use an umbrella to do this one and that was a hassle x D. I think it was the same colour as the tip of the screw in the picture which is like brownish blackish? Haha, I'll have to check the other one as soon as I can. brownish blackish not a good description..

FUAFUA · August 24th, 2009, 09:51 PM

I took out the same spark plug this time and looked at it again, tried to get some pictures but they all came out blurry, guess I'm not a photographer. It looked brand new, the insulator inside the plug was the color of the normal one in the picture except the top of the tip was a little black. I didn't get the other one because it looked like I would have to take the tank off or something else off to get to it. There was also a tube coming out of the carbs -right between the two circular rubber things you have to take off to shim the carbs- that had the other end not plugged in to its rightful place, it was just hanging around. I plugged that in to the little black box on the bottom of the gas tank(I have pictures of that and I'll put them up at another time), I feel like that made a positive difference in acceleration, I don't really know what it does but I'm guessing it's some kind of air exit or suction thingy or something because I never noticed any leaking fluids from it, I probably would have never noticed it if I didn't check my spark plugs. The bike does accelerate faster I also changed the oil but it's still super slow and maxes at like 60mph now. I think if I shove the snorkel back in that might make another little positive difference but it's sucking in waay to much air. If I pull on the throttle I can hear the air growling as it rushes in the whole where the snorkel used to be but theres no acceleration and the rpms go up slowly, very slowly. It didn't used to make such a big growling noise before, so I was thinking that if I did the shimming the needles thing that might help? I am not sure if that gives the engine more gas less gas?

August 23rd, 2009, 01:16 PM	#1
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	Air to Fuel ratio problems? I'm not really sure how to explain my problem so I am just going to throw everything out there that I have noticed that doesn't seem right with my bike or that's different than before. First off, if I have the bike in neutral or in gear with held in clutch w/e -the acceleration is exaggeratedly sluggish, It takes maybe 4 and a half seconds to go from 2k to its max(That's in neutral, it takes much longer if the engine has to rotate the tire) and the bike will not reach red line; in any gear, at any speed, or even in neutral. I thought maybe I should shim my needles, but my bike has no problem starting up from cold and it has no problem accelerating from a stop, that is to say if I am in first gear I can let the clutch out and the bike will drive "normally" until it hits maybe 5 or 6k then it loses all power, then if I switch in to second gear and I'm in the low rpm range it still has no power, so its weird that I only have power in the very low rpms in first gear and then in all other gears it seems like it has no power at all(not enough torque?). I should say that I removed my snorkel about a year ago and I was going to put it back but it seemed like a lot of work and seeing as this is a recent problem and I've had my snorkel removed for a very long time and it was fine before I don't think that's the problem. Unless over time that has done some kind if permanent damage to my bike and that would suck. Other than that my main problem is that my bike accelerates slower than a pedal bike and its new max speed is 55mph. It's weird, I'll be at high rpms in maybe 4th gear going 55 and then I'll switch to 5th gear and the bike will not speed up it will just lower its rpms as if it had to work harder in a higher gear to maintain the same speed, but alas it wont go faster than 55mph and I'm not driving it because when I do theirs always soccer moms in their minivans honking their horns at me because it takes me two minutes to go from 0 to 45 mph then I hit a stop light and I have to start over again. I got a brand new air filter(didn't help, maybe made it worse) and I was looking into how to check my fuel filter, make sure it's not full of gunk, I'm pretty sure my problem is that my bike is getting to much air and not enough fuel because it has no pulling power whatsoever. I just don't know where to start on how to fix it, as I said I was going to shim my needles but Idk if theirs a simpler solution. I would put the snorkel back in, that would probably help but the snorkel doesn't affect air flow that much, I covered the little hole where the snorkel should be and it did not make a huge difference, there was a little more accelerating power but I still maxed at 55mph. I just need to find out how to waste more petrol I guess. Any help will be appreciated, I'd like to start riding again, Thanks.

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August 23rd, 2009, 01:32 PM	#2
kkim Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.	did this start all of a sudden or was the bike stored for a few months or so and the problem started? maybe a bad tank of gas? have you flushed and refilled the tank since having the problem?

August 23rd, 2009, 01:42 PM	#3
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	It's been happening for a while it was like a slowly progressing problem, before it would have problems accelerating until i hit 7k and then it would accelerate like a little speed demon, so I would just make sure the rpms never went below 7k when i was riding. So the problem was there before, then I went on a vacation and did not ride it for a week and when I came back I had to use the bike to go to the store and it was having some serious acceleration problems, I thought it was because it wasn't warmed up properly as sometimes, ever since the bike was new if I didn't warm it up it would do that, that's normal. but then at the store I warmed it up for a very long time and I took it for a ride in the parking lot and it was better but then, as I was riding it kept changing between riding normally and the slow acceleration problem I am having now. At the time, I was riding two up so I thought that maybe there was to much weight. Now it seems to only ride slow all the time, I have changed the gas in it twice and same thing so if it's a gas problem I suspect it will be the fuel filter is clogged which I am going to check out tomorrow.

August 23rd, 2009, 01:47 PM	#4
kkim Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.	okay... fuel filter is on the end of the fuel line from the tank right where the line enters the carbs. for now, remove the filter and run w/o one and see if the problem improves. Later, buy a small plastic inline filter and install it halfway up the fuel line so you can easily see crud that it catches. how many miles so the bike? any mods to it other than snorkel removal?

August 23rd, 2009, 01:52 PM	#5
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	It has 4700 miles on it and no mods other than the snorkel removal.

August 23rd, 2009, 01:59 PM	#6
kkim Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.	pull a spark plug and take a look at the insulator color. from what you say, I'd guess your bike is running lean from running w/o the snorkel and not shimming to compensate. possible some damage from prolonged running like this. the plugs should will tell you a lot.

August 23rd, 2009, 02:51 PM	#7
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	They seem fine to me, the only problem I can see is that it seems like part of the spark plug is stuck in that little black tube. I don't think it's supposed to be like that but I couldn't get the other part out of the tube. I wanted to try riding it without the fuel filter but this is Florida so of course it started raining. Plus I couldn't find any pictures of it in my google search so I don't really know which part it is X P

August 23rd, 2009, 02:57 PM	#8
kkim Join Date: Nov 2008 Posts: Too much.	err... macro setting on your camera?? either that or I'm going blind. what color is the insulator inside the plug? I think the black thing you talking about is supposed to be there inside the plug socket.... it's there to hold the plug inside the socket down those deep plug wells in the engine. edit... which does your plug look like? Have you checked both?

August 23rd, 2009, 03:15 PM	#9
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	No I just couldn't get the darned thing to focus on the spark plug, it kept focusing on my hand or the floor or my foot, I only looked at one but it looked brand new. I don't remember the color of the insulator but since I only did one I guess I'll do the other one if it stops drizzling. I had to use an umbrella to do this one and that was a hassle x D. I think it was the same colour as the tip of the screw in the picture which is like brownish blackish? Haha, I'll have to check the other one as soon as I can. brownish blackish not a good description..

August 24th, 2009, 09:51 PM	#10
FUAFUA ninjette.org member Name: Joshua Location: Orlando, FL. Join Date: Aug 2009 Motorcycle(s): Kawasakin Ninja 250 (2008) Posts: 10	I took out the same spark plug this time and looked at it again, tried to get some pictures but they all came out blurry, guess I'm not a photographer. It looked brand new, the insulator inside the plug was the color of the normal one in the picture except the top of the tip was a little black. I didn't get the other one because it looked like I would have to take the tank off or something else off to get to it. There was also a tube coming out of the carbs -right between the two circular rubber things you have to take off to shim the carbs- that had the other end not plugged in to its rightful place, it was just hanging around. I plugged that in to the little black box on the bottom of the gas tank(I have pictures of that and I'll put them up at another time), I feel like that made a positive difference in acceleration, I don't really know what it does but I'm guessing it's some kind of air exit or suction thingy or something because I never noticed any leaking fluids from it, I probably would have never noticed it if I didn't check my spark plugs. The bike does accelerate faster I also changed the oil but it's still super slow and maxes at like 60mph now. I think if I shove the snorkel back in that might make another little positive difference but it's sucking in waay to much air. If I pull on the throttle I can hear the air growling as it rushes in the whole where the snorkel used to be but theres no acceleration and the rpms go up slowly, very slowly. It didn't used to make such a big growling noise before, so I was thinking that if I did the shimming the needles thing that might help? I am not sure if that gives the engine more gas less gas?