Switch to DOT 5 brake fluid...

[DanteCoal]

So I'm wanting to switch out to DOT 5 brake fluid, not 5.1 just to clarify.

I've done some research, searching, etc. And know I'll be good on my lines since they'll be brand new, untouched SS lines. I'd have to replace my caliper seals, and dust boots, as well as thoroughly flush the system with denatured alcohol.

Question is; has anyone here done this? Any other problems for me to look for?

I don't really care about the cost of it, or the work I'll be putting in if I can do it. I've got a sour past with the old corrosive brake fluids, and I'd love to wave goodbye to them for good.

[Motofool]

Copied from
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOT_5

"DOT 5 brake fluid is not compatible with anti-lock brake systems."

Copied from
http://collision.alldata.com/online2...ot_3_or_41.htm

"As a rule, vehicles equipped with anti-lock brakes (ABS) should not use DOT 5 brake fluid........
Silicone also has slightly different physical properties and compressibility, making it unsuitable for ABS systems calibrated to work with DOT 3 or 4 brake fluid."

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by Motofool

Copied from
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOT_5

"DOT 5 brake fluid is not compatible with anti-lock brake systems."

Copied from
http://collision.alldata.com/online2...ot_3_or_41.htm

"As a rule, vehicles equipped with anti-lock brakes (ABS) should not use DOT 5 brake fluid........
Silicone also has slightly different physical properties and compressibility, making it unsuitable for ABS systems calibrated to work with DOT 3 or 4 brake fluid."

Yup, dis.

Get a high quality brake fluid like Motul or something similar.

[DanteCoal]

Originally Posted by Motofool

Copied from
https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/DOT_5

"DOT 5 brake fluid is not compatible with anti-lock brake systems."

Copied from
http://collision.alldata.com/online2...ot_3_or_41.htm

"As a rule, vehicles equipped with anti-lock brakes (ABS) should not use DOT 5 brake fluid........
Silicone also has slightly different physical properties and compressibility, making it unsuitable for ABS systems calibrated to work with DOT 3 or 4 brake fluid."

Awwwww, didn't come across that when researching. Thanks a ton! Sucks that I won't be able to convert to DOT 5, but I suppose I'll just have to be careful with some good DOT 4, and not allow anyone else to mess with my brakes.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by DanteCoal

Awwwww, didn't come across that when researching. Thanks a ton! Sucks that I won't be able to convert to DOT 5, but I suppose I'll just have to be careful with some good DOT 4 or 5.1, and not allow anyone else to mess with my brakes.

Any Glycol Ether based fluid is good.
The main problem is the slow but sure absorption of humidity from the air.
That water that enters the system causes more than one problem (corrosion, vapor bubbles, etc.).
Periodical replacement of the fluid, at least as recommended by the manufacturer, is the only way to keep those problems away.

Then, fully cleaning the pistons of the calipers when replacing pads, will keep those moving freely and the surface of the cylinders smooth.

[HoneyBadgerRy]

This is the second or third thing I have heard of switching from dot 4 to dot 5 in the past month. What is the advantage of Dot 5 brake fluid?

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by HoneyBadgerRy

What is the advantage of Dot 5 brake fluid?

Heat! Or specifically boiling point. It really means squat at sane street paces unless you're really after feel, but for top pace track riders, brake fade is real and this can help along with top quality pads and rotors.

[DanteCoal]

Originally Posted by HoneyBadgerRy

This is the second or third thing I have heard of switching from dot 4 to dot 5 in the past month. What is the advantage of Dot 5 brake fluid?

The advantage for me would be that DOT 5 brake fluid is silicone based, and non corrosive. Won't mess up paint, plastic, etc. Besides that, each subsequent grade of brake fluid has higher heat resistances. However as csmith12 pointed out, that isn't something that tends to matter under normal conditions.

[dcj13]

A disadvantage of DOT 5 brake fluid is that it is slightly more compressible than DOT 3 and DOT 4.

[Ghostt]

This is the one I use, but regardless which one chooses, they all need to be flush and filled with new fluid at regular intervals.

I do mine with every pad change, along with servicing the calipers.

Here more information

http://www.epicbleedsolutions.com/re...1-brake-fluid/





https://m.motul.com/ca/en-us/product...-1-brake-fluid

[DanteCoal]

After doing some more research and finding why DOT 5 doesn't work with ABS systems, it makes sense now. The difference in compression is a slight issue, however the big one seems to be that DOT 5 likes to foam up and create lots of air bubbles when run through an ABS system.

Almost makes me regret getting the ABS model... Almost. 99.999% of all my riding is in the city, or on the highway. The closest I get to putting my bike through it's paces is when I take a ride through the country and manage to open the throttle a bit more. Given that, I'll probably just stick with DOT 4 fluid, since I'd never get close to the boiling temps where I'd need to think about fade.

Guess I'll just waste my money elsewhere on the bike. =P

[2fiddy-trackpair]

I have run several different bikes at the track and never had a problem. Even running the mountains in Arkansas at some very spirited paces I can say that a well maintained brake system will never give you any problems. Just stick with what the manufacture calls for.

[Ghostt]

That's one of my major points, proper maintenance is the key, and sometimes overlooked in my experience.

I have help friends who have issues with brakes, and most of the time just a service of the components and flush and fill fixes the issues. The amount of neglect I have found over the years is is disturbing, and alarming, considering the importance of brakes.

Whenever I get a used bike, brake system service is the first item on my list, just like oil change would be.

[2fiddy-trackpair]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

That's one of my major points, proper maintenance is the key, and sometimes overlooked in my experience.

I have help friends who have issues with brakes, and most of the time just a service of the components and flush and fill fixes the issues. The amount of neglect I have found over the years is is disturbing, and alarming, considering the importance of brakes.

Whenever I get a used bike, brake system service is the first item on my list, just like oil change would be.

Amen, if the fluid is even slightly discolored it is time for a flush.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by 2fiddy-trackpair

Amen, if the fluid is even slightly discolored it is time for a flush.

As I've stated, I do mine when I do my pads, along with servicing the calipers.

[APEmike]

Motul RBF if you are REAAAAALY worried about it. But if you are only doing street riding, you wont need anything more than FRESH fluid. Once a year, flush the system with new fluid.

I havent had issues with brake fade yet, even when I was testing/experimenting with how hard I could brake on a flat straight road when I first got the bike. 30-40 (I lost count after 20...) HARD stops repeatedly didnt fade them horribly, and thats with whatever Kawasaki put in there and stock pads. You are worrying over nothing, honestly.

[Mohawk]

WHY ? DOT4 is a fantastic brake fluid & was developed for the very purpose you are using your bike. DOT5 does NOT improve braking performance, it was created at a time when hoses, seals etc were rubber (as in the real stuff) to stop water ingress to the brake fluid, because its NOT hydroscopic like ormal brake fluids.

Time has moved on, all seals are man made polymers now, so water absorption is no longer a real issue. Chnage the DOT4 every 2-3 years & service your calipers & everything will be fine. You don't need to change caliper seals when you strip & rebuild a caliper unless they are misshapen, swollen or distorted in some way. Use brake cleaner on them regularly & they will stay working better longer.

[DanteCoal]

Originally Posted by Mohawk

WHY ? DOT4 is a fantastic brake fluid & was developed for the very purpose you are using your bike. DOT5 does NOT improve braking performance, it was created at a time when hoses, seals etc were rubber (as in the real stuff) to stop water ingress to the brake fluid, because its NOT hydroscopic like ormal brake fluids.

Time has moved on, all seals are man made polymers now, so water absorption is no longer a real issue. Chnage the DOT4 every 2-3 years & service your calipers & everything will be fine. You don't need to change caliper seals when you strip & rebuild a caliper unless they are misshapen, swollen or distorted in some way. Use brake cleaner on them regularly & they will stay working better longer.

The single reason for wanting to switch to DOT 5 (which I've since learned I can't do, due to the way the ABS system works) is because of the corrosive properties of other brake fluids. No other reason at all. Just me not wanting to risk getting a drop anywhere on my precious.

[choneofakind]

Shop towels.

[Racer x]

My two cents.
Don't do it.
It foams and is a bitch to blead,plus all the other disadvantages. It is hydrophobic that is good. But not worth the trouble. Dot 3 just plain works.

It is easy to remove the top of the master cylinder . Stuff a rag on and wipe out all the old fluid. Then refill the master cylinder. Just do that at the end of the season or when ever and forget it.

[Mohawk]

The simple answer is water in a spray/mister thing, before I start work on bleeding brakes, I spray water over the whole area where fluid may potentiall drip or run, the water neutralises the brake fluid instantly & stops it damaging paint or finishes !

YMMV

[DanteCoal]

Originally Posted by Mohawk

The simple answer is water in a spray/mister thing, before I start work on bleeding brakes, I spray water over the whole area where fluid may potentiall drip or run, the water neutralises the brake fluid instantly & stops it damaging paint or finishes !

YMMV

I can't believe I never thought to do that! Well, that fixes all my issues right there, lol. Thanks for the tip!