ninjette.org

Go Back   ninjette.org > 2008 - 2012 Ninja 250R > 2008 - 2012 Ninja 250R Tech Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old October 16th, 2020, 03:14 PM   #1
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
Trying to pop start my bike

Howís is it going ninjas in a little bit of a dilemma I am trying to pop start my bike due to the fact that when I laid my bike down the housing for the starter crank or stater broke off inside my crank case. I clean the carburetor add a new oil cleaned out my crank case put everything back together but Iím getting no fire. My battery does seem to be a bit low so Iím going to charge it other than that Iím out of ideas as to why it wonít turn over Any suggestions Iím willing to do appreciate it
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote




Old October 16th, 2020, 05:38 PM   #2
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Battery also powers ECU and ignition-coils. If battery is weak, you won’t get any spark even if you can push-start it quickly enough. Don’t just charge battery, measure its voltage:

1. Key off, measure battery voltage
2. Measure battery voltage while cranking
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 16th, 2020, 06:47 PM   #3
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
Dannoxyz

So after letting it charge For a little bit it was showing 11 1/2 and then I tried popping it a couple times as well checking my blinkers tested it again and it read 10 1/2 . Would be clutch relay or kickstand have anything to do with it not firing
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 16th, 2020, 06:50 PM   #4
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
No, battery is way too weak. Should be about 13.8v off charger and about 12v when cranking.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 16th, 2020, 06:51 PM   #5
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤦🏻🤷🏻🤷🏻🤷🏻🤷🏻🤷🏻

This is so frustrating!!! I feel resistance while in first and clutch lever engaged . Which I never felt before while popping it ! Itís as if my clutch isnít fully engaged. It used to feel like when my clutch was engaged in first like I was in neutral until I released it and then it would fire
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 17th, 2020, 07:01 AM   #6
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Stop trying to pop start bike! You’ll cause more damage and end up destroying engine!!

Do it properly and fully charge battery and/or get new one.

Now let’s backtrack and post photos:

1. What exactly broke? Show us the pieces.
2. How was this repaired? Did you get new case cover and starter?
3. Did you fish out ALL broken pieces from crankcase? Matched them up to broken case and starter to confirmed you got EVERY broken chunk out? Show us the pictures!

I’m thinking there’s metal bits and pieces that wan’t recovered and they found their way into clutch. I would completely disassemble clutch and clean to verify it’s in good condition. There’s never enough time to do job right first time, but there’s always time to do it again! Often on side of road in complete darkness.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 01:59 PM   #7
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
Update

So this is the starter crank the housing that is attached to is what broke off which has made my electric start non-usable so Iíve had to resort To pop starting it. So I replace the battery replace the spark plugs drained the crank case made sure that I got all the metal shavings out refilled with new oil new coolant. I had to replace the handle bar and clutch lever with an aftermarket bracket. The clutch relay that attaches to bottom of the bracket wonít fit so Iíve left it off . Would that keep it from firing and if so how can I bypass it ? Itís still not firing. Could it be the kickstand or the clutch relay keeping it from firing up
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 02:09 PM   #8
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Clutch switch only deals with starter circuit. You need to measure and come up with some numbers for fast and efficient troubleshooting:

1. Key ON, put transmission in neutral. Does neutral light on clocks come on?
2. Key OFF, what is battery voltage?
3. Key ON, what is voltage at each red-wire terminal of each ignition coil?
4. kickstand switch. How much resistance/ohms from each kickstand-switch wire to chassis ground?
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 02:24 PM   #9
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
So battery reads 13 in key off position, when I turn key on all dash lights come on and are bright . It reads 12 while key is on. Like I said itís a brand new battery
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 02:26 PM   #10
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
As far as question 3 and 4 . Iím exactly sure how to check that . I apologize for being so green .
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 03:24 PM   #11
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
Also I wasnít sure if I was clear the side that I laid my bike down was on the left side of the bike kickstand side and the kickstand did receive some minor damage
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 04:05 PM   #12
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
Reply

Iím getting 12. On the red terminal wire on each side.
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 05:34 PM   #13
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood314 View Post
So battery reads 13 in key off position, when I turn key on all dash lights come on and are bright . It reads 12 while key is on. Like I said it’s a brand new battery
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood314 View Post
I’m getting 12. On the red terminal wire on each side.
Bad battery. Should not drop when key ON. Should stay at 13v.
Just because it's new doesn't mean it's good. Over 1/2 of stuff from auto-parts stores are bad right out of box and needs to be tested.

ALL batteries needs to be charged before use. Did you charge it? Put battery on trickle-charger for 24-hrs and if it's not over 13v and stays over 13v when key ON, you'll need new battery.

Here's how to use multimeter: https://learn.sparkfun.com/tutorials...multimeter/all

Update on #4: unplug kickstand from harness.
4a. measure resistance between terminals of kickstand switch with stand UP
4b. measure resistance betweem terminals of kickstand switch with stand DOWN

5. pull every fuse and measure resistance between legs. Measure every fuse and list results here.

DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
Old October 22nd, 2020, 05:44 PM   #14
Hollywood314
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Steven
Location: 9313 Althea Ave
Join Date: Oct 2020

Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawasaki ninja 250r

Posts: 11
I wasnít getting anything out of the kickstand safety. I measured both the from the female to the wiring connected to the kickstand . Iím going to look to try and bypass the safety killswitch . And conduct the test of the fuses .
Hollywood314 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 22nd, 2020, 07:00 PM   #15
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood314 View Post
I wasn’t getting anything out of the kickstand safety. I measured both the from the female to the wiring connected to the kickstand . I’m going to look to try and bypass the safety killswitch . And conduct the test of the fuses .
How many ohms did you measure? Post photo of how you measured and what meter display shows.

Did you charge new battery? For how long?
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 06:09 AM   #16
jkv45
Rev Limiter
 
jkv45's Avatar
 
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 SV650n project, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood314 View Post
So battery reads 13 in key off position, when I turn key on all dash lights come on and are bright . It reads 12 while key is on. Like I said itís a brand new battery
If it's 12.0V - it's junk - like Danno said.

A 12 volt battery reads 12.7V when 100% charged. A reading of 12.0V is about 40% charged.

Your most important reading is under load (cranking) which should stay about 10.0V minimum.

Sounds like a bad battery to me as well.
jkv45 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 08:36 AM   #17
SibSerge
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Sergey
Location: Ontario, GTA
Join Date: Oct 2019

Motorcycle(s): Ninja ZZR250 (EX250H)

Posts: 119
I would charge the battery regardless but that's probably no the culprit. I was able to push start my bike when I purchased it and the battery on that was totally shot after 12 years of usage. I think it was reading about 10v. If the neutral and oil pressure lights come up and are not dim that should allow the ignition to work. The electric starter would obviously not work. I saw that on many bikes of the 80ies that had a kick starter. Sometimes they would even start when the lights are half dim. Ninja is of a newer tech but my experience with the bat confirmed they are still capable to start on a garbage batt. I would not run it with a shot batt, however, as it will overheat the rectifier.
SibSerge is online now   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 08:53 AM   #18
jkv45
Rev Limiter
 
jkv45's Avatar
 
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 SV650n project, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
Quote:
Originally Posted by SibSerge View Post
I would charge the battery regardless but that's probably no the culprit. I was able to push start my bike when I purchased it and the battery on that was totally shot after 12 years of usage. I think it was reading about 10v. If the neutral and oil pressure lights come up and are not dim that should allow the ignition to work. The electric starter would obviously not work. I saw that on many bikes of the 80ies that had a kick starter. Sometimes they would even start when the lights are half dim. Ninja is of a newer tech but my experience with the bat confirmed they are still capable to start on a garbage batt. I would not run it with a shot batt, however, as it will overheat the rectifier.
Ours wouldn't.

Trying to get it to run right with a questionable battery is going to complicate the troubleshooting process, but whatever...
jkv45 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 09:12 AM   #19
SibSerge
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Sergey
Location: Ontario, GTA
Join Date: Oct 2019

Motorcycle(s): Ninja ZZR250 (EX250H)

Posts: 119
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkv45 View Post
Ours wouldn't.

Trying to get it to run right with a questionable battery is going to complicate the troubleshooting process, but whatever...
I do not disagree Jay, I would address the battery regardless.
SibSerge is online now   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 09:45 AM   #20
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
On old style points-style analogue ignition, you can probably get by with 10v battery charge.

But with new style digital ignition like on Ninjette, ECU won't work on anything less than 12v.

I wonder if there's issue with 100-ohm resistor here...
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old October 23rd, 2020, 09:47 AM   #21
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer,Ninja250R street EX250F#1 EX250F#2 EX250E CBR250R(MC19) CBR250RR(MC22) VF500F CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Hollywood314 View Post
I wasnít getting anything out of the kickstand safety. I measured both the from the female to the wiring connected to the kickstand . Iím going to look to try and bypass the safety killswitch . And conduct the test of the fuses .
How many ohms did you measure? Post photo of how you measured and what meter display shows.

Did you charge new battery? For how long?
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Reply




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Bike won't start and backfires when trying to start TrickyTriggs General Motorcycling Discussion 30 April 16th, 2018 08:35 PM
If you have started or want to start building a project bike, what bike would it be? Wanderer General Motorcycling Discussion 37 June 4th, 2017 02:17 PM
Bought first bike and 1 day later it won't start: do I have a junk bike? brendandubs 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 43 May 11th, 2014 07:59 AM
Bike would not start, then.. 2003ninja 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 6 May 19th, 2012 02:07 PM
HELP. Cant get bike to start billybobjoeiv 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 15 April 6th, 2010 08:15 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Motorcycle Safety Foundation

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 08:50 PM.


remote server monitor
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2020, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2020 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Except where otherwise noted, all site contents are © Copyright 2020 ninjette.org, All rights reserved.