Extreme elevations (aka Heaven to Hell)

NevadaWolf · July 29th, 2013, 02:23 PM

Ok, so I think maybe my brain has been cooked... or I have the long-distance bug.

I live at 4000ft. Routinely ride up to 8000ft, and even go over 10,000ft passes. There is a slight loss of power that I have always chalked up to just the grade and, ya know, going up a mountain.

Now, there is a ride that goes from Mt. Evans in Colorado at 14,240 ft (Heaven) to Badwater in Death Valley, CA at -282 ft (that is a negative sign there, aka Hell). And to top all that off, this 1,000+ mile ride has a 24 hour time limit stamped onto it.

Has anyone taken their stock Ninja to these extremes and how does it perform? Will it be a debate between who is having the harder time breathing (me or the bike) or will my bike leave me on the side of the road as she merrily pulls off this impressive feat?

Is there anything that can/should be done to help the bike not succumb to the punishment I am contemplating? Is there anything that should be done so the rider doesn't end up in a mental institution?

fishdip · July 29th, 2013, 02:29 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

Ok, so I think maybe my brain has been cooked... or I have the long-distance bug.

I live at 4000ft. Routinely ride up to 8000ft, and even go over 10,000ft passes. There is a slight loss of power that I have always chalked up to just the grade and, ya know, going up a mountain.

Now, there is a ride that goes from Mt. Evans in Colorado at 14,240 ft (Heaven) to Badwater in Death Valley, CA at -282 ft (that is a negative sign there, aka Hell). And to top all that off, this 1,000+ mile ride has a 24 hour time limit stamped onto it.

Has anyone taken their stock Ninja to these extremes and how does it perform? Will it be a debate between who is having the harder time breathing (me or the bike) or will my bike leave me on the side of the road as she merrily pulls off this impressive feat?

Is there anything that can/should be done to help the bike not succumb to the punishment I am contemplating? Is there anything that should be done so the rider doesn't end up in a mental institution?

I have taken the 300 and the pregen 250 up Mt Evans and the lack of air made the power drop But they still made it up. I pass out when I was 8 at the top of Evans so lack of air is a risk if you start to feel dizzy/funny pull over asap.

JohnnyBravo · July 29th, 2013, 02:31 PM

I would start at the top!

NevadaWolf · July 29th, 2013, 02:38 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishdip

I have taken the 300 and the pregen 250 up Mt Evans and the lack of air made the power drop But they still made it up. I pass out when I was 8 at the top of Evans so lack of air is a risk if you start to feel dizzy/funny pull over asap.

I've hiked to 10,880ft and could feel the lack up air up there. Never got dizzy but my speech was affected. I'm thinking of maybe adding a day or two to hang out at the 10k mark before setting off for the 14k as I've never been that high before.

Quote:

Originally Posted by JohnnyBravo

I would start at the top!

And how would you get to the top?

fishdip · July 29th, 2013, 02:42 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

I've hiked to 10,880ft and could feel the lack up air up there. Never got dizzy but my speech was affected. I'm thinking of maybe adding a day or two to hang out at the 10k mark before setting off for the 14k as I've never been that high before.

And how would you get to the top?

Or just get a oxygen tank.

JohnnyBravo · July 29th, 2013, 02:43 PM

Haha... I'd drive my truck, no no I'd get Ryan to drive my truck, then I wouldn't have to ride back up the hill

I'm scared of heights and get dizzy on stairs

NevadaWolf · July 30th, 2013, 07:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishdip

Or just get a oxygen tank.

That might actually be an idea,...

fishdip · July 30th, 2013, 07:32 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

That might actually be an idea,...

They have rentals for them.

ChaoSS · July 31st, 2013, 06:46 AM

Spending a few days above 8000 feet would be a good idea. I used to live at that elevation, and the 14000 ft mountains didn't bother me much. Now that I live barely over sea level, altitudes kick my ass. But then, you are riding a motorcycle, not a bicycle, so it shouldn't be that big a deal.

JustRidin · July 31st, 2013, 07:30 PM

Yea, riding up on a motorcycle shouldn't be any big deal at all. I'm from Missouri, have spent the summer in downtown Denver, and frequently make trips up to 13,000' plus w/o problems. If you aren't acclimated hiking or biking might take its toll, but certainly not just riding.

NevadaWolf · July 31st, 2013, 08:19 PM

Wile I think I will be ok, I just want to make sure Mt Evans and my asthma don't get into a shouting match as my lungs would lose.

Runeknight95 · July 31st, 2013, 09:18 PM

Meh get some EPO shots haha

yea id wait a day or 2 at the 8-10k mark before hitting 14k especially on a vehicle

ChaoSS · August 1st, 2013, 04:37 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

Wile I think I will be ok, I just want to make sure Mt Evans and my asthma don't get into a shouting match as my lungs would lose.

If you have asthma make sure you have your inhaler, or whatever you use to control it.

And spending time at higher altitude could be fun, anyway. Colorado has some awesome scenery.

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 07:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by ChaoSS

If you have asthma make sure you have your inhaler, or whatever you use to control it.

And spending time at higher altitude could be fun, anyway. Colorado has some awesome scenery.

Oh I won't deny that.

In regards to acclimating myself it'll have to be done locally in the Sierras as my vacation time is almost dry. Hence why I am looking at these great 24 hour rides.

fishdip · August 1st, 2013, 07:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

Oh I won't deny that.

In regards to acclimating myself it'll have to be done locally in the Sierras as my vacation time is almost dry. Hence why I am looking at these great 24 hour rides.

Go to the top of mammoth MT

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 07:28 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by fishdip

Go to the top of mammoth MT

There's no road to the top. Ski runs don't make the best street bike rideable courses.

fishdip · August 1st, 2013, 07:30 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

There's no road to the top. Ski runs don't make the best street bike rideable courses.

You can ride up to the gondola and take that to the top with bike in side

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 07:35 AM

Or I can just go to any of the passes around here that are at 8 or 10k.

DaBlue1 · August 1st, 2013, 08:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

....Is there anything that can/should be done to help the bike not succumb to the punishment I am contemplating?

Jet your bike accordingly. Given the extreme in temps and elevation, a smaller jet may be in order. http://www.motorcyclecarbs.com/carbs101.pdf

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 09:05 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaBlue1

Jet your bike accordingly. Given the extreme in temps and elevation, a smaller jet may be in order. http://www.motorcyclecarbs.com/carbs101.pdf

Having never touched anything on my engine before, is that something that would be worth it for a 2 hour trip at those extremes? Or is it something that can be done on the fly as I ascend or descend (like turning the idle adjuster)?

Or is that something that is set beforehand and then not touched during the ride? If so, wouldn't the setting for high altitude be the exact opposite needed for low altitude? As far as I know everything in the engine is the exact way it came out of the factory.

Sorry for the clueless questions, all I know is I sit on a magic box that makes the bike go.

ChaoSS · August 1st, 2013, 05:09 PM

No, you don't want to rejet the bike for a couple of hours, you would have to redo it when you come back down.

If your bike runs ok at 10k feet, you should be fine.

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 05:20 PM

Yeah she does run ok at 10k. So the extra four shouldn't be too much of an issue because I'm there for so short of a time?

DaBlue1 · August 1st, 2013, 05:43 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

Having never touched anything on my engine before, is that something that would be worth it for a 2 hour trip at those extremes? Or is it something that can be done on the fly as I ascend or descend (like turning the idle adjuster)?

Or is that something that is set beforehand and then not touched during the ride? If so, wouldn't the setting for high altitude be the exact opposite needed for low altitude? As far as I know everything in the engine is the exact way it came out of the factory.

Jetting is done before hand. If you take a look at the link I posted, you'll see a section on Altitude, Humidity and Air Temperature. In that section there is a correction factor chart from Kawasaki. The formula they use is simple. It helps you find the correct pilot and main jet size for a given altitude and temperature. Correction factors can also be used to find correct needle jet, needle and air screw settings.

A stock bike has #98 main jets. Use that, to figure out if your jetting could optimized based on your elevation

NevadaWolf · August 1st, 2013, 05:55 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DaBlue1

Jetting is done before hand. If you take a look at the link I posted, you'll see a section on Altitude, Humidity and Air Temperature. In that section there is a correction factor chart from Kawasaki. The formula they use is simple. It helps you find the correct pilot and main jet size for a given altitude and temperature. Correction factors can also be used to find correct needle jet, needle and air screw settings.

A stock bike has #98 main jets. Use that, to figure out if your jetting could optimized based on your elevation

ok, so you are more talking about for my home elevation vs this trip.

From what I read on the adjusting the jetting in the DYI this is anything but a quick adjustment. So not something that I can do to adjust it for 14K, then adjust it again for -200 all while maintaining the minimum speed that I need to do to make it from point A to B in 24 hours.

I'll look more into that after the trip. I've never had problems with power before so never looked into fiddling with the engine.

fishdip · April 10th, 2014, 10:14 AM

Did you ever take the trip?

NevadaWolf · April 10th, 2014, 10:20 AM

Yep!

Ride report is here: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=146311

July 29th, 2013, 02:23 PM	#1
NevadaWolf Certified looney toon Name: Teri Location: 39°52'40.7"N 118°23'53.8"W (Northern NV) Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250, 102k+ miles -- 2014 CB500X, 42k+ miles Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 16 MOTM Jul '13, Jul '14	Extreme elevations (aka Heaven to Hell) Ok, so I think maybe my brain has been cooked... or I have the long-distance bug. I live at 4000ft. Routinely ride up to 8000ft, and even go over 10,000ft passes. There is a slight loss of power that I have always chalked up to just the grade and, ya know, going up a mountain. Now, there is a ride that goes from Mt. Evans in Colorado at 14,240 ft (Heaven) to Badwater in Death Valley, CA at -282 ft (that is a negative sign there, aka Hell). And to top all that off, this 1,000+ mile ride has a 24 hour time limit stamped onto it. Has anyone taken their stock Ninja to these extremes and how does it perform? Will it be a debate between who is having the harder time breathing (me or the bike) or will my bike leave me on the side of the road as she merrily pulls off this impressive feat? Is there anything that can/should be done to help the bike not succumb to the punishment I am contemplating? Is there anything that should be done so the rider doesn't end up in a mental institution? __________________________________________________ <-- Linky Hey Unregistered! The code [you] shows the username currently logged in. IBA # 56020 AMA # 521481 Fun Rides! ][ My Videos ][ My Gear Hold yourself to the same rules you expect others to follow.

July 29th, 2013, 02:31 PM	#3
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	I would start at the top! __________________________________________________

July 29th, 2013, 02:43 PM	#6
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	Haha... I'd drive my truck, no no I'd get Ryan to drive my truck, then I wouldn't have to ride back up the hill I'm scared of heights and get dizzy on stairs __________________________________________________

July 31st, 2013, 07:30 PM	#10
JustRidin ninjette.org member Name: Nick Location: Denver, CO Join Date: Jul 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2007 R6, 2015 KTM 250XC - Past: 2011 KTM 150XC, 2009 Ninja 250r, 2012 Ninja 650, 2007 CRF250R Posts: 194	Yea, riding up on a motorcycle shouldn't be any big deal at all. I'm from Missouri, have spent the summer in downtown Denver, and frequently make trips up to 13,000' plus w/o problems. If you aren't acclimated hiking or biking might take its toll, but certainly not just riding. __________________________________________________ Try it, you might like it.

July 31st, 2013, 08:19 PM	#11
NevadaWolf Certified looney toon Name: Teri Location: 39°52'40.7"N 118°23'53.8"W (Northern NV) Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250, 102k+ miles -- 2014 CB500X, 42k+ miles Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 16 MOTM Jul '13, Jul '14	Wile I think I will be ok, I just want to make sure Mt Evans and my asthma don't get into a shouting match as my lungs would lose. __________________________________________________ <-- Linky Hey Unregistered! The code [you] shows the username currently logged in. IBA # 56020 AMA # 521481 Fun Rides! ][ My Videos ][ My Gear Hold yourself to the same rules you expect others to follow.

July 31st, 2013, 06:46 AM	#9
ChaoSS ninjette.org sage Name: Tim Location: Goshen CA Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 red 250 ninja Posts: 740	Spending a few days above 8000 feet would be a good idea. I used to live at that elevation, and the 14000 ft mountains didn't bother me much. Now that I live barely over sea level, altitudes kick my ass. But then, you are riding a motorcycle, not a bicycle, so it shouldn't be that big a deal.

July 31st, 2013, 09:18 PM	#12
Runeknight95 ninjette.org member Name: Derek Location: Boynton Beach Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 08 cbr1000rr, 2008 + 2012 ninja 250, 06 zx6r (636!) track only Posts: 150	Meh get some EPO shots haha yea id wait a day or 2 at the 8-10k mark before hitting 14k especially on a vehicle __________________________________________________ http://www.1000rr.net/forums/showthread.php?t=90412 http://www.8thcivic.com/forums/ http://www.facebook.com/profile.php?id=1209877267

August 1st, 2013, 07:35 AM	#18
NevadaWolf Certified looney toon Name: Teri Location: 39°52'40.7"N 118°23'53.8"W (Northern NV) Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250, 102k+ miles -- 2014 CB500X, 42k+ miles Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 16 MOTM Jul '13, Jul '14	Or I can just go to any of the passes around here that are at 8 or 10k. __________________________________________________ <-- Linky Hey Unregistered! The code [you] shows the username currently logged in. IBA # 56020 AMA # 521481 Fun Rides! ][ My Videos ][ My Gear Hold yourself to the same rules you expect others to follow.

August 1st, 2013, 05:09 PM	#21
ChaoSS ninjette.org sage Name: Tim Location: Goshen CA Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 red 250 ninja Posts: 740	No, you don't want to rejet the bike for a couple of hours, you would have to redo it when you come back down. If your bike runs ok at 10k feet, you should be fine.

August 1st, 2013, 05:20 PM	#22
NevadaWolf Certified looney toon Name: Teri Location: 39°52'40.7"N 118°23'53.8"W (Northern NV) Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250, 102k+ miles -- 2014 CB500X, 42k+ miles Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 16 MOTM Jul '13, Jul '14	Yeah she does run ok at 10k. So the extra four shouldn't be too much of an issue because I'm there for so short of a time? __________________________________________________ <-- Linky Hey Unregistered! The code [you] shows the username currently logged in. IBA # 56020 AMA # 521481 Fun Rides! ][ My Videos ][ My Gear Hold yourself to the same rules you expect others to follow.

April 10th, 2014, 10:14 AM	#25
fishdip ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Fish Location: co Join Date: Apr 2013 Motorcycle(s): 250/300 Posts: A lot.	Did you ever take the trip? __________________________________________________ Hey Unregistered never go faster than your brakes can be applied...

April 10th, 2014, 10:20 AM	#26
NevadaWolf Certified looney toon Name: Teri Location: 39°52'40.7"N 118°23'53.8"W (Northern NV) Join Date: Jun 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250, 102k+ miles -- 2014 CB500X, 42k+ miles Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 16 MOTM Jul '13, Jul '14	Yep! Ride report is here: https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=146311 __________________________________________________ <-- Linky Hey Unregistered! The code [you] shows the username currently logged in. IBA # 56020 AMA # 521481 Fun Rides! ][ My Videos ][ My Gear Hold yourself to the same rules you expect others to follow.

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