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Old December 8th, 2015, 08:07 AM   #1
VaFish
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MOTM - Jan '16
Loose Wire, thoughts on where?

So I have something loose, but what.

Here is what happens, running down the road at speed is fine, but at slow speeds now several times, most of them when I go over a bump in a parking lot or in heavy traffic, the bike just shuts off, headlight off, no oil or gear indicator lights, nothing.

I turn the key off and on a few times and suddenly it starts working again, starts up and I ride off.

Battery cables are tight at the battery, haven't checked anything else.

I'm thinking maybe ground wire where it connects to the frame/engine.

What else could it be?

I'm not blowing the main fuse, but I guess it might be loose too. Is there a main circuit breaker that resets automatically?

I did check the kickstand switch, it doesn't seem to be connected at all because I can put the bike up on the center stand with the kickstand down and it runs just fine.
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Old December 8th, 2015, 08:41 AM   #2
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Broken wires are famous for this behavior and can be elusive andtough to track down.
The wire connection can be intermittent and can also be affected by the wire heating due to the high resistance created or expansion from heat of the wire harness which creates the broken wire separation.
But yes; first clean your ground connections.
It may also be in the key assembly if jiggling the lock seems to provide a degree of success.

Edit: everything I've written above sounds obtuse! (I haven't had my coffee yet!) Hope you can make out what I'm blathering about! I'll maybe try to rewrite it later today!
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Old December 8th, 2015, 08:45 AM   #3
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Quote:
Originally Posted by SLOWn60 View Post
Broken wires are famous for this behavior and can be elusive andtough to track down.
The wire connection can be intermittent and can also be affected by the wire heating due to the high resistance created or expansion from heat of the wire harness which creates the broken wire separation.
But yes; first clean your ground connections.
It may also be in the key assembly if jiggling the lock seems to provide a degree of success.

Edit: everything I've written above sounds obtuse! (I haven't had my coffee yet!) Hope you can make out what I'm blathering about! I'll maybe try to rewrite it later today!
I'm pretty sure you said:

Check and clean ground connection

Check for broken wires (may be difficult to find)

Check Key assembly
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Old December 8th, 2015, 08:48 AM   #4
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MOTM - Nov '15
Quote:
Originally Posted by VaFish View Post
I'm pretty sure you said:

Check and clean ground connection

Check for broken wires (may be difficult to find)

Check Key assembly
My search for an editor is over!
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Old December 8th, 2015, 09:38 AM   #5
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MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
Because you said it happens when you go over a bump, I would read through this section on safety switches to get some idea of which one may be causing the issue and how to check it -

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Underst...afety_switches

A battery with an internal short might also cause that type of problem I would think. If you could test the battery voltage when it quit it would tell you.
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Old December 8th, 2015, 09:45 AM   #6
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Quote:
Originally Posted by jkv45 View Post
Because you said it happens when you go over a bump, I would read through this section on safety switches to get some idea of which one may be causing the issue and how to check it -

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Underst...afety_switches

A battery with an internal short might also cause that type of problem I would think. If you could test the battery voltage when it quit it would tell you.
The reason I'm thinking it is not safety switches is that all power goes out, if it was the safety switches wouldn't the engine just die and the lights would stay on?
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Old December 8th, 2015, 09:50 AM   #7
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaFish View Post
The reason I'm thinking it is not safety switches is that all power goes out, if it was the safety switches wouldn't the engine just die and the lights would stay on?
That sounds right.

I guess I would start at the battery and go from there, focusing on wires and connections that supply power to the entire system.

A lot easier to diagnose when you actually have the problem than when you don't.
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Old December 8th, 2015, 01:51 PM   #8
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Quote:
Originally Posted by VaFish View Post
The reason I'm thinking it is not safety switches is that all power goes out, if it was the safety switches wouldn't the engine just die and the lights would stay on?
I agree. If it was only one system, that could be the case. It sounds like the ignition switch or circuit, as that is you main power feed. There Is a chance it could be a loose internal battery connection, but I would focus on the connector off the ignition switch, which is underneath your gas tank, or the actual switch itself. There is a fusible link, or main fuse, and that wiring should be checked for continuity, or corrosion. Replace the main fuse just because it IS old, and needs to be replaced anyway... I have seen them look good, but have a break from vibration inside the fuse.
I know that you can track it down, just be methodical, and eliminate one thing at a time. Good luck and hope you get it figured out!
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Old December 8th, 2015, 07:28 PM   #9
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Provided you did not do any extensive re-wiring over the years, you should have white wires that comes from your main fuse and run to your fuse box, ignition switch, and regulator. As Yamahawk said put some focus on that separate 30 amp fuse, and go from there.
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Old December 9th, 2015, 07:09 AM   #10
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MOTM - Jan '16
Quote:
Originally Posted by quarterkawa View Post
Provided you did not do any extensive re-wiring over the years, you should have white wires that comes from your main fuse and run to your fuse box, ignition switch, and regulator. As Yamahawk said put some focus on that separate 30 amp fuse, and go from there.
I have not done any re-wiring other than plugging in new turn signals, but I have only owned the bike since July. Who knows what previous owners have done over the last 14-15 years.

Probably won't have a chance to tear things apart until Friday.

Of course I have several other things to do on Friday too, and would really love to get the café racer running for Sunday's ride.
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Old December 9th, 2015, 05:34 PM   #11
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MOTM - Aug '15
What they said. The safety switches kill the engine, but not all the power on the bike. If EVERYTHING goes out, it has to be one of the components common to all circuits. That means the white Main wire, possibly the brown switched power wire from the ignition to the junction box, or a major ground. Problems with those could kill pretty much all the power.

If playing with the key actually helps, I would suggest looking at the ignition switch first. But that could be a red herring if it's just coincidence with a hot wire cooling, a broken wire wiggling back to a working state, etc.


Quote:
Originally Posted by VaFish View Post
I did check the kickstand switch, it doesn't seem to be connected at all because I can put the bike up on the center stand with the kickstand down and it runs just fine.
FYI, the kickstand switch will kill the engine if it's down and you don't have the bike in neutral or the clutch pulled in. In normal usage, it will kill the engine as you start to ride off - after you've put it in gear, as you let the clutch out to start moving. If you have the bike running and in gear on the centerstand, putting the sidestand down should kill the engine. But the engine will run just fine as long as you're pulling the clutch lever or have it in neutral.
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Old December 10th, 2015, 10:18 AM   #12
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MOTM - Aug '15
What everyone is saying. Also diddle around with the ignition switch and see if you can tease a failure.
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Old December 11th, 2015, 08:23 AM   #13
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It's Friday, so please let us know what you did and what ya found.
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Old December 11th, 2015, 08:34 AM   #14
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I'm betting on the kickstand switch, I went through that myself. after finding the bike on the floor in a parking lot.. while riding around it would do something similar to this, ended up changing the spring and that solved it
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Old December 11th, 2015, 02:04 PM   #15
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MOTM - Jan '16
Think I found it, everything goes out when I wiggle the cable to the ignition switch. Right in this area.
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Old December 11th, 2015, 02:09 PM   #16
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MOTM - Nov '15
A'hem....
Nailed it in post #2
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