DIY Valve Adjustment Video

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by peperino

Hey guys, I hope you can help me. I couldn't measure the right cylinder.

I rotate the engine until the camshafts were aligned in the flywheel with the 2T mark and in the camshaft gears the two lines were even, like

https://goo.gl/photos/E2qgyuFsYw5N95tK6
https://goo.gl/photos/Mpv5q5zEjqsjTM2N7

With this position, I couldn't fit almost any feeler gauge, I tried 0.15 and 0.10 but they won't go in. What I'm doing wrong here?

Then, I measured left cylinder, by aligning 1T mark with the lobes pointing away from the bucket like this

https://goo.gl/photos/royJ7vcphG6ZSbjQ6


This gave me a reading, but weird one, as folows:

Intake1: 0.21mm
Intake2: 0.22mm

Exhaust1: 0.20mm
Exhaust2: 0.20mm

Are my intakes close to the upper limit and my exhausts way off the lower limit?

Help!

Since your camshafts are in place, my advice is not to worry about engine timing YET (unless you remove them to make an adjustment), and just rotate them until you know the cam lobes are not pressing down on the buckets. Make sure your feeler gauges have a film of oil on them, and take it slow. Measure many times until your confident in the accuracy of your measurements. It took me a while to get the feel, and I still question myself sometimes, but consistent measurements will mean you're probably close enough.

You may find this spreadsheet helpful in getting the right shim (it's all in metric though): https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=73240

[peperino]

Thank you!
I will take a look

My concern is that I'm not being able to measure the right cylinder. Gonna keep trying in the following days. I'm taking my time as theres not rush

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by peperino

Thank you!
I will take a look

My concern is that I'm not being able to measure the right cylinder. Gonna keep trying in the following days. I'm taking my time as theres not rush

Start with feeler gauges you KNOW are too thin to make sure your technique is good. It can be hard to get a good reading on #2 due to all the junk in the way. The feeler gauges that are bent may make it easier too.

[peperino]

You are right, the angled gauges might be a lifer saver for #2.

Another question, I'm getting a micrometer to measure the shims.
This one is ok?

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by peperino

You are right, the angled gauges might be a lifer saver for #2.

Another question, I'm getting a micrometer to measure the shims.
This one is ok?

Yes, that will be more than adequate. You can you is to measure your brake rotors as well.

[peperino]

Alright thank you.
I'll get that and the angled gauges as well.
Better to have the appropiate tools for the job

[peperino]

Ok, please support me guys

Is this the correct position to measure cyl #1 ?
I don't have any marks on the flywheel at that position but I'm guessing it's ok because valves are closed. Please confirm

At that position, i got this readings from #1

IN1: 0.21
IN2: 0.23

EX1: 0.18
EX2: 0.18

These sound reasonable? Would seem exhausts need adjustment while intakes are mid/up of the range.

[peperino]

It is ok if I just measure when the lobes are up disregard what position the engine flywheel is?

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by peperino

It is ok if I just measure when the lobes are up disregard what position the engine flywheel is?

Yes.

[peperino]

Alright! Thank you! Here's what I did.

I rotated the engine so I see the lobes move. When they just release the buckets (I see the bucket go up) I continue rotating until the lobe is pointing straight up, and measure those 2 valves (every lobe moves the same 2 buckets).

Here's my triple reading:

Cyl #1
IN1 0.20
IN2 0.20

EX1 0.20
EX2 0.21

Cyl #2
IN1 0.18
IN2 0.19

EX1 0.165
EX2 0.14

Dang! Seems like those #2 cyl exhaust are really tight!
I need to replace the shims for all 4 exhaust valves it seems.

I won't touch the intakes as they are ok I think!
Any comments on this ?

Thanks people!

[RacinNinja]

Only one thing....adjust the valves so that they are at the higher end of the gap spec. This way you can get more life out of the adjustment.

IE, exhaust is 0.22-0.29, get them closer to 0.29.
Intake is already at the higher end so those should be good.

[peperino]

Gotcha

Bike has 19k miles and valves were never checked

[peperino]

I'm confused about the manual. It says that the IN and EX marks should be like this

http://i.imgur.com/qaoqXtU.jpg

If I make the white marks face each other, the ex and in marks are turned over. I don't understand

Also in this position, no feeler gauge will enter between #2 cylinder bucket and camshaft.

I need help

[RacinNinja]

The marks go towards the outside of the heads, not the inside. That's your problem.

[peperino]

You mean the white marks ?
Then this tutorial is wrong?

http://www.theyeagergroup.com/2008_n..._clearance.htm

pic from there
http://www.theyeagergroup.com/2008%2...t/DSCN1033.JPG

Ok. If I put the marks like this: http://i.imgur.com/qaoqXtU.jpg
I get a different reading on #2 exhaust valves from the one I took with the lobes just pointing up:

EX1: 0.20
EX2: 0.17

Which one is correct?
Thank you!

[RacinNinja]

If you are just trying to check the valve clearance, then simply make sure the lobes are pointing away from the follower. No need to futz with marks......

The marks are there for reassembly. Note in the second pic you posted all of the cam bolts are loose, presumably for reassembly.

If you're just checking, point the lobes away.

[peperino]

Ok, I'm checking but I'll be reassembling too after changing the shims.

I'm not sure why I get two different readings from camshaft with the lobes up and camshaft in the 2T mark and EX and IN pointing to outside.

Anyway, I guess I'll keep the readings from the lobes up.

Now, when dissasembling/reassembling, should I make the white marks point outside right? Like the manual says and not the tutorial

Thank you

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by peperino

I'm confused about the manual. It says that the IN and EX marks should be like this

http://i.imgur.com/qaoqXtU.jpg

If I make the white marks face each other, the ex and in marks are turned over. I don't understand

Also in this position, no feeler gauge will enter between #2 cylinder bucket and camshaft.

I need help

I dare say all the answers to your questions have been given. You seem to be only looking at each step without understanding that step or the bigger picture.

May I suggest you follow the advice in this:
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/show...6&postcount=52

and study this until it makes sense:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What_is...t_procedure%3F

Valve adjustments are really pretty simple once you thoroughly grasp the concept & procedures. That just takes study and then a little practice.

You will get there if you stop and take the time to understand the instructions. Note that there two different procedures: The Official Kawasaki way as described in the manual and the shop way which is simpler and faster if you know what to do. Part of your confusion is reading the manual and getting correct advice here but based on two different methods. Study and you will understand the differences and how they both get you to the finish.

Or like so many do; get a shop to do it but I'm guessing you'll have no problems if you prepare yourself properly which probably won't take more than an evening or two.

[RacinNinja]

For reassembly, the crank on the 2T mark, and cam marks to the outside, yes, per the manual, Chapter 5.

[peperino]

Believe me that I'm reading stuff since 10 days ago, and some information is ambiguous or not 100% clear, plus it is my first time and I don't want to mess my engine that's why I keep bothering you guys

The video for this thread is gone right?

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by peperino

Believe me that I'm reading stuff since 10 days ago, and some information is ambiguous or not 100% clear, plus it is my first time and I don't want to mess my engine that's why I keep bothering you guys

The video for this thread is gone right?

Lots of videos on youtube. search on youtube "Ninja 250R Valve Adjustment"

[peperino]

All the videos I've found refer to the pregens that use rocker arms with nuts and bolts for adjustment, but haven't found any with shims like mine

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by peperino

All the videos I've found refer to the pregens that use rocker arms with nuts and bolts for adjustment, but haven't found any with shims like mine

The only real difference is you may need to remove the camshafts if you need to remove a bucket to change shims. Follow the instructions for the alignment marks etc so you don't have a cam opening a valve while your removing or replacing a camshaft/cam cap.

[peperino]

Ok so I removed the exhaust cam cap bolts (the one I need the shims replaced) and it won't budge. Is there any trick to take it out? I'm pulling straight up and no luck.

[RacinNinja]

The other side is held in place by dowels in the cylinder head. The cam cap is now cocked on the dowels.....try installing bolts on the inside and tightening them up until the gap is half what it is now, then lightly prying on the other side to get it lift on the dowels a bit.

[peperino]

No luck.
Thanks for the help, gonna keep trying tomorrow, I'm too burned today

[peperino]

Now I'm thinking if I should try the way it is explained in the tutorial with the two white marks facing each other. In there, the pic shows the lobe for the #1 exhaust valve pointing up while mine is pointing down, and that must be putting pressure on the cap making the removal harder. What do you think.

[SLOWn60]

Javi! What do you think? If they're pointing down, what are they doing?

This goes back to what I said earlier: you need to study and understand what the parts do and how they work. If the camshaft lobe is compressing a valve spring; it's going to put pressure on the cap and if it's pressure on one corner of the cap it's going to bind.

As for marks inside/outside; the diagram and photo you showed are different: the diagram is of the outside view and the photo is the inside view. I don't know if the marks relate or not but the diagram is clear.
What service manual are you using? Is it the genuine Kawasaki manual? I ask because it's very clear ( if you take the time to read & understand) how to do the job. Not perhaps simple but clear if you slowly study and think about each step. Clear your mind and begin reading carefully again.
Frustrating I'm sure but it's the only way to your success if you want to do the work yourself which I strongly encourage you to do.

[peperino]

Ye don't kill me please, I'm learning

The drawing is from the service manual, page 5-18.

So that confuses me, If I make the white marks face each other, I don't get the ex and in marks line up, they are backwards, but the service manual tells you to do it that way!
In the end I'm not sure what procedure to follow!

But yes, now seeing the lobes down, I'm gonna put everything back together, give the chain some tension (i have the APE tensioner) and turn it so the white marks face each other before removing the cap. Let's see if that help. Tomorrow of course

[peperino]

Ok I finally could take everything apart.

My shims for the exhaust valves have these measurements:

2.77
2.79
2.77
2.77

Are these common values?

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by peperino

Ye don't kill me please, I'm learning

The drawing is from the service manual, page 5-18.

So that confuses me, If I make the white marks face each other, I don't get the ex and in marks line up, they are backwards, but the service manual tells you to do it that way!
In the end I'm not sure what procedure to follow!

But yes, now seeing the lobes down, I'm gonna put everything back together, give the chain some tension (i have the APE tensioner) and turn it so the white marks face each other before removing the cap. Let's see if that help. Tomorrow of course

Javi; do you see anywhere on pages 5-17, 5-18 or 5-19 that refers to white marks? Stop mixing two different sets of instructions and follow the manual.

Now your first problem is to get the camshaft caps retightened withouit distorting them!

First: figure out which lobe is contacting a valve then tighten the cap bolts next to that lobe but only one turn. Those would be bolts 5&7 or 6&8 or 9&11 or 10&12 refered to in the diagram on page 5-17. Then tighten the rest of the cap bolts ONLY FINGER TIGHT. go back to the bolts next to the lobe with contact and tighten 1 turn. tighten the rest of the bolts finger tight. You should be now able to tighten all the bolts one turn at a time following the bolt tightening sequence (read the instructions!)
What you are trying to do is retighten the caps evenly so you don't put a twist in the caps or worse; crack them.

You don't have to torque them now because you'll be removing them again if you are changing shims. Just have them lightly snug when the caps are properly in place.

Now start back at the begining of page 5-17 and go slowly, step by step, making sure you follow the instructions and the diagrams. forget about white marks and other methods etc.

[headshrink]

To add to what SLOWn60 said above, the tightening sequence is also printed on the cam caps themselves. Hint: it is a unique sequence (not a star pattern). It makes sense if you consider how it's designed, with one side higher than the other. You're likely feeling the alignment dowels binding up. I often give my caps a GENTLE tap with a rubber mallet to overcome this.... but if something is really out of alignment you can damage something, so take your time and go slow.

This comment is just a side, so listen to SLOWn60 above first, as I understand he's having you undo something first.

[peperino]

Well, the thing happened, its cracked

What now, new cap right?
I ****ed up

[peperino]

pic

[SLOWn60]

Yup
That's too bad.
But while you're waiting for it; you can study how cam shafts work so you understand each step and not just follow the instructions.
I'll post later (no time now) and try to walk you through what to do next
But only if you post an explanation of how cam shafts work

[peperino]

Thank you, I appreciate it.

While looking for the cover, I see the kawasaki diagrams do not show its part number or price. I only found it used on ebay. Kawasaki does not sell it separately or I'm looking in the wrong place?

http://www.kawasakipartshouse.com/oe.../cylinder-head

http://www.ebay.com/itm/Kawasaki-Nin...ZUVoHi&vxp=mtr

[Dsheumaker]

I followed the thread that have been posted for you to follow.. they are complete. I would do what was suggested and do some more research. Anytime i a m about to do work that i have never one, i read and read and read and then ask the questions on the gray areas. IF everyone's responses are the same then its safe to say that that is how it works. Best of luck to you.

[SLOWn60]

Javi; I'm on my phone so I may not be seeing clearly but it looks like you're right: can't buy camshaft caps seperately without buying a whole new head.
Therefore; before I spent money on a used and unknown cap: I would reassemble the cam shafts & caps (using lots of moly grease like the instructions say) but without the cam chain on the cam shafts and slowly, carefully and evenly tighten the bolts finger tight as you go while tapping on the caps with a soft rubber mallet and rotating the cams with your fingers to see if there's any binding or difference in rotational friction between the two cam shafts. You may be able to reuse the cracked cap if it can be successfully assembled.
A second hand cap may have wear or machining differences that cause a poor fit between the used cap and your camshaft. Worth a try anyhow and what I would try first.

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by SLOWn60

Javi; I'm on my phone so I may not be seeing clearly but it looks like you're right: can't buy camshaft caps seperately without buying a whole new head.
Therefore; before I spent money on a used and unknown cap: I would reassemble the cam shafts & caps (using lots of moly grease like the instructions say) but without the cam chain on the cam shafts and slowly, carefully and evenly tighten the bolts finger tight as you go while tapping on the caps with a soft rubber mallet and rotating the cams with your fingers to see if there's any binding or difference in rotational friction between the two cam shafts. You may be able to reuse the cracked cap if it can be successfully assembled.
A second hand cap may have wear or machining differences that cause a poor fit between the used cap and your camshaft. Worth a try anyhow and what I would try first.

The reason for this is that the caps are machined to the cylinder head. The head and the cap are the bearing surface. You can't just go slapping a new cap on this head and expect things to work properly.

They are a matched set. You're on the right track.

[peperino]

So what I do?