335cc

bruce71198 · July 1st, 2014, 10:06 PM

Well it's official, at 11:59 pm, Tuesday July 1, the first 335cc Ninja 250, that I know of, fired up in my shop. Crisp throttle response, a little buzzy as I am not running a balance shaft. I will finish prepping it for the race weekend at Road America and post the results.

csmith12 · July 1st, 2014, 10:22 PM

Somchai · July 1st, 2014, 11:08 PM

Congrats

PS: Edited because of my bad - the am/pm always makes me crazy, but I hope you'd take with a smile (or maybe more)

Klondike1020 · July 1st, 2014, 11:33 PM

Say what?. I want to know more !!!!

Singh2jz · July 1st, 2014, 11:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmith12

Gonna need way more popcorn for this one!

supersport · July 1st, 2014, 11:57 PM

psych0hans · July 2nd, 2014, 12:19 AM

Olie · July 2nd, 2014, 12:42 AM

I miss road America....June sprints were always a blast. Keep us posted!

Racer x · July 2nd, 2014, 03:42 AM

Way to go . Can't wait for the dyno results.

The extra 6 cc making it above 349cc put not of my class.

Thank you so much for that.

Kscreations08 · July 2nd, 2014, 03:56 AM

crazymadbastard · July 2nd, 2014, 04:28 AM

Ninjinsky · July 2nd, 2014, 05:04 AM

.

bruce71198 · July 2nd, 2014, 05:17 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmith12

Chris, were where you this past weeken? I came down to Gateway to run MCRA and fully expected to clank swords with you!

sharky nrk · July 2nd, 2014, 06:01 AM

we need pics/vids

bruce71198 · July 2nd, 2014, 08:34 AM

Honestly the pics look just like all the engine build pics. Without a micrometer you won't be able to tell what's different. I will post a dyno video as soon as I can. That will be a first as well as I have never been able to post a video...

csmith12 · July 2nd, 2014, 08:52 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bruce71198

Chris, where where you this past weekend? I came down to Gateway to run MCRA and fully expected to clank swords with you!

I was racing with MotoSeries @Beaver Run (PitRace). I am leading the points chase, so can't miss the rounds ya know... Video of race 2 here.

As much as I wanted to, it don't look like imma get out to Gateway this season, running outta time and money.

LittleRedNinjette · July 2nd, 2014, 09:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Ninjinsky

http://gph.is/QRH5XU

ps Help an old guy out, How do you post animated gifs ? Putting it in img brackets didn't work with the above

Right click the image and select "copy image URL":

cbinker · July 4th, 2014, 05:41 PM

you have my attention.

NinjaZX6R123 · July 4th, 2014, 05:53 PM

Video please. I want to hear it.

cbinker · July 4th, 2014, 07:00 PM

I need details, i want this!

Baron · July 4th, 2014, 07:20 PM

Go on

cbinker · July 7th, 2014, 10:41 AM

Its monday, where is the report!!!! I NEED INFO!!!

DCMoney · July 7th, 2014, 10:53 AM

Tag for interest!

I was at gateway, you were on a white 250, crazy fast?

sharky nrk · July 7th, 2014, 03:42 PM

dyno? video? something?

micoulisninja · July 8th, 2014, 04:29 AM

this is the kind of post I've been craving for...
Bruce I really need some tech spec... I guess that is a 300 crank and rods in 250 casings along with some 66mm JE pistons, right ?
or is it a whole 300 transplant with 250's block bored with sleeves ?
what about the head ? 300 or 250 ported and larger valves ?
fuel delivery ?? 300's thottle bodies and wiring, european 250's, ecotron kit or carb stuff with needles etc?
you got there before me !! Congrats !! I am both jealous and proud of you !! hope it runs fine for a long time and show what this little engine is capable of...
ps...factory rods ??

bruce71198 · July 8th, 2014, 05:58 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCMoney

Tag for interest!

I was at gateway, you were on a white 250, crazy fast?

The white bike was a stocker, 29hp. That's the bike that won the Wera GNF, they tore it down to the pistons and found no violations including the air box snorkel. It was the same way at Gateway sans the snorkel .

The 335 was a HUGE success. Road America is a long track, 4 miles around, many elevation changes. The front straight has a big hill at the beginning, they call t the asphalt dyno. On a 250 you need to up shift into 5th befor the hill, carry it up the hill then hit 6th. With the new engine it didn't mater, it would pull it in any gear. I had to drop the rear sprocket 4 teeth and could have gone 6 easy as it pulled through the gears so easy I was hitting redline in 6th at the ends of the straights. I can't tell you the hp figure yet but may lap times where about 9 seconds faster this time over last season.
One thing to note, with the added speed the brakes started getting soft towards the end.
As far as the build, it's stock 250 cases. 300. crank, wisco pistons, stock head, cams, carbs.

DCMoney · July 8th, 2014, 06:03 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by bruce71198

The white bike was a stocker, 29hp. That's the bike that won the Wera GNF, they tore it down to the pistons and found no violations including the air box snorkel. It was the same way at Gateway sans the snorkel .

The 335 was a HUGE success. Road America is a long track, 4 miles around, many elevation changes. The front straight has a big hill at the beginning, they call t the asphalt dyno. On a 250 you need to up shift into 5th befor the hill, carry it up the hill then hit 6th. With the new engine it didn't mater, it would pull it in any gear. I had to drop the rear sprocket 4 teeth and could have gone 6 easy as it pulled through the gears so easy I was hitting redline in 6th at the ends of the straights. I can't tell you the hp figure yet but may lap times where about 9 seconds faster this time over last season.
One thing to note, with the added speed the brakes started getting soft towards the end.
As far as the build, it's stock 250 cases. 300. crank, wisco pistons, stock head, cams, carbs.

You're a hell of a rider!

9 second differences is incredible!

cbinker · July 8th, 2014, 06:15 AM

Ok, I am extremely interested in this up grade, any chance you can give an exact list and where each part can be found?

The way I am reading your post, you were able to just change the crank and pistons?

Which Pistons did you?

choneofakind · July 8th, 2014, 06:50 AM

More info mang! You've got my interest as well, and I'm just an armchair reader here.

bruce71198 · July 8th, 2014, 06:56 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by DCMoney

You're a hell of a rider!

9 second differences is incredible!

That was all engine, the amount of time spent on straightaways is huge at RA,

subxero · July 8th, 2014, 07:41 AM

So bored and stroked it, what do you think you have into it cash wise to make this happen?

what were the hiccups in getting this done?

bruce71198 · July 8th, 2014, 08:44 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subxero

So bored and stroked it, what do you think you have into it cash wise to make this happen?

what were the hiccups in getting this done?

Less than $1000 out of pocket as long as you do your own labor.
Keeping the pistons below deck is the biggest issue. Went together once, after the math was done, hasnt been apart since.

crazymadbastard · July 8th, 2014, 05:49 PM

nice!

Racer x · July 8th, 2014, 05:56 PM

I love it.

garth285 · July 8th, 2014, 06:17 PM

Very nice! Post Dyno numbers when ya can!

Did you wind up having to run a spacer for the deck height?

JohnnyBravo · July 8th, 2014, 08:20 PM

Kscreations08 · July 8th, 2014, 11:15 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by subxero

So bored and stroked it...

Don't worry, it's normal

supersport · July 9th, 2014, 12:32 AM

what kind of cams? stock?

micoulisninja · July 9th, 2014, 01:59 AM

sounds fine Bruce and must be a little beast in mid range torque-wise...
I guess you also used the 300 rods to keep the same engine height...
however a couple of things still make me wonder... stock head has tiny intake ports and valves for oem displacement...if still stock there, with the extra cc doesn't it "choke" on the high end ?? unless you mean 300 stock... did you need to evaluate anything concerning mean piston velocity or is it safe (250 18,23m/sec 300 cranking on 250 electrics 21,64m/sec for the piston at 13250rpm...)wiseco piton lighter than stock (stock is 124grams, 130 with rings plus 36 with oem pin)??
I bet you still have some upgrades to go...well done !!

can't wait for those figures from the dyno...

bruce71198 · July 9th, 2014, 08:38 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by micoulisninja

sounds fine Bruce and must be a little beast in mid range torque-wise...
I guess you also used the 300 rods to keep the same engine height...
however a couple of things still make me wonder... stock head has tiny intake ports and valves for oem displacement...if still stock there, with the extra cc doesn't it "choke" on the high end ?? unless you mean 300 stock... did you need to evaluate anything concerning mean piston velocity or is it safe (250 18,23m/sec 300 cranking on 250 electrics 21,64m/sec for the piston at 13250rpm...)wiseco piton lighter than stock (stock is 124grams, 130 with rings plus 36 with oem pin)??
I bet you still have some upgrades to go...well done !!

can't wait for those figures from the dyno...

Even with the 300 rods the pistons stick up past the deck. Ideally the 250 rods are better for torque production but are about 7.9mm to long. I might try these on the next build. I think the timing chain will be long enough and I will have custom rods made.
As far as the head, I went with the stock cams, valves and 250 head just to see what the power increase was on a budget. After all there is something to be said for port velosity and power production. I dont think im at the flow limimt of this head as the engine pulls HARD to the rev limiter.
My bike is much faster than the 250's I run with at the track, so much so that I will probably end up running up a class with the SV650 and such. When I get to a point that I need some more HP I will go to the longer rods, 300 head and 32mm flat slides.

July 1st, 2014, 10:06 PM	#1
bruce71198 ninjette.org sage Name: bruce Location: northern illinois Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): Race bikes:08 Ninja 250,11 R6,16 ZX6,SV650.3 HD-1947,2-2003,2010. 1946 Indian and a lot of dirt bikes.2 Posts: 999	335cc Well it's official, at 11:59 pm, Tuesday July 1, the first 335cc Ninja 250, that I know of, fired up in my shop. Crisp throttle response, a little buzzy as I am not running a balance shaft. I will finish prepping it for the race weekend at Road America and post the results.
	2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.

July 1st, 2014, 10:22 PM	#2
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	__________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

July 1st, 2014, 11:08 PM	#3
Somchai Freedom for Germany Location: This World Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250R-FI Posts: A lot.	Congrats PS: Edited because of my bad - the am/pm always makes me crazy, but I hope you'd take with a smile (or maybe more) Last futzed with by Somchai; July 2nd, 2014 at 12:13 AM.

July 1st, 2014, 11:33 PM	#4
Klondike1020 Intrepid Adventurer Name: Josh Location: Rochester/Buffalo NY Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2004 GSXR 750 , 71 cb350streettracker, 07 Polaris Predator 500 Posts: A lot.	Say what?. I want to know more !!!! __________________________________________________ LIFE IS NOT FOR REGRETS OR EXCUSES. Breath deep, seek peace. Embrace the Madness. Life is good, let it be

July 2nd, 2014, 12:19 AM	#7
psych0hans ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Hansveer Location: Bombay, India Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250r - Track whore, Ninja 300 - SOLD, KTM RC390 - Orange Hulk, Ducati 899 Panigale - Red Devil. Posts: A lot.	__________________________________________________ GETTING BACK INTO RIDING? Read this.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

July 1st, 2014, 11:57 PM	#6
supersport ninjette.org member Name: Lee Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300 Posts: 97

July 2nd, 2014, 12:42 AM	#8
Olie New Old Guy Name: Olie Location: Oahu, Hawaii Join Date: Mar 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2011 250R SE Posts: 57 Blog Entries: 1	I miss road America....June sprints were always a blast. Keep us posted!

July 2nd, 2014, 03:42 AM	#9
Racer x ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Eric Location: Iowa City Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 54 MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16	Way to go . Can't wait for the dyno results. The extra 6 cc making it above 349cc put not of my class. Thank you so much for that. __________________________________________________ Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja

July 2nd, 2014, 03:56 AM	#10
Kscreations08 Fresh Deli Meat Name: Kevin Location: Wilkes-Barre, Pennsylvania Join Date: Feb 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2009 250R Ninja -Neener- Posts: 678	__________________________________________________ We shall call thee "Seahorse." -Antiant on Couvade Syndrome

July 2nd, 2014, 04:28 AM	#11
crazymadbastard I'm crazy,your excuse is? Name: Winston Location: Connecticut Join Date: May 2013 Motorcycle(s): 250 2007 ninja Posts: A lot.	__________________________________________________ My Cafe Racer Build My intro post

July 2nd, 2014, 05:04 AM	#12
Ninjinsky ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Paul Location: UK Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250, Yamaha RS200 (classic) Posts: A lot.	. Last futzed with by Ninjinsky; July 11th, 2014 at 08:38 AM.

July 2nd, 2014, 06:01 AM	#14
sharky nrk Fighting Texas Aggie '05 Name: Neil Location: Hutto, TX Join Date: Feb 2009 Motorcycle(s): '07 ZX6R, '08 Versys, '09 250R Track, '93 F2/F3 Track Posts: A lot.	we need pics/vids __________________________________________________ Keep it rubber side down and enjoy the ride Get healthy - Get Fit - Change Your Life Click Here Or PM Me To Find More - Advocare

July 2nd, 2014, 08:34 AM	#15
bruce71198 ninjette.org sage Name: bruce Location: northern illinois Join Date: Jan 2012 Motorcycle(s): Race bikes:08 Ninja 250,11 R6,16 ZX6,SV650.3 HD-1947,2-2003,2010. 1946 Indian and a lot of dirt bikes.2 Posts: 999	Honestly the pics look just like all the engine build pics. Without a micrometer you won't be able to tell what's different. I will post a dyno video as soon as I can. That will be a first as well as I have never been able to post a video...

July 4th, 2014, 05:41 PM	#18
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	you have my attention. __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com

July 4th, 2014, 05:53 PM	#19
NinjaZX6R123 ninjette.org guru Name: Ninja Location: USA Join Date: Mar 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2013 Ninja ZX6R, 2009 Ninja 250R Posts: 256	Video please. I want to hear it.

July 4th, 2014, 07:00 PM	#20
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	I need details, i want this! __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com

July 4th, 2014, 07:20 PM	#21
Baron Urban Legend Name: Baron Location: Brampton, ON Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): 09 Ninja 250R SE - Circe Posts: 542	Go on __________________________________________________ "Life is like riding - *You can either tear the fastlane in half or stay in the slipstream trying to play catch up*." -Baron

July 7th, 2014, 10:41 AM	#22
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	Its monday, where is the report!!!! I NEED INFO!!! __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com

July 7th, 2014, 10:53 AM	#23
DCMoney ninjette.org guru Name: Andrew Location: St Louis Join Date: Sep 2013 Motorcycle(s): Ducati 1198s, Triumph D675, Suzuki SV1000s, `08 Ninja 250, `11 Ninja 250, Suzuki GS750 Posts: 368	Tag for interest! I was at gateway, you were on a white 250, crazy fast? __________________________________________________ MCRA.com

July 7th, 2014, 03:42 PM	#24
sharky nrk Fighting Texas Aggie '05 Name: Neil Location: Hutto, TX Join Date: Feb 2009 Motorcycle(s): '07 ZX6R, '08 Versys, '09 250R Track, '93 F2/F3 Track Posts: A lot.	dyno? video? something? __________________________________________________ Keep it rubber side down and enjoy the ride Get healthy - Get Fit - Change Your Life Click Here Or PM Me To Find More - Advocare

July 8th, 2014, 04:29 AM	#25
micoulisninja modaholic junkie Name: Nick Location: Athens, Greece Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2001 ZX-12R, 2009 ninja 345cc and plenty of others in the past... Posts: 438 Blog Entries: 2	this is the kind of post I've been craving for... Bruce I really need some tech spec... I guess that is a 300 crank and rods in 250 casings along with some 66mm JE pistons, right ? or is it a whole 300 transplant with 250's block bored with sleeves ? what about the head ? 300 or 250 ported and larger valves ? fuel delivery ?? 300's thottle bodies and wiring, european 250's, ecotron kit or carb stuff with needles etc? you got there before me !! Congrats !! I am both jealous and proud of you !! hope it runs fine for a long time and show what this little engine is capable of... ps...factory rods ?? __________________________________________________ If noone has tried it before, I will !!!

July 8th, 2014, 06:15 AM	#28
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	Ok, I am extremely interested in this up grade, any chance you can give an exact list and where each part can be found? The way I am reading your post, you were able to just change the crank and pistons? Which Pistons did you? __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com

July 8th, 2014, 06:50 AM	#29
choneofakind ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: . Location: . Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: Too much. MOTM - Feb '13, Feb '14	More info mang! You've got my interest as well, and I'm just an armchair reader here.

July 8th, 2014, 07:41 AM	#31
subxero dirty boy Name: Joe Location: Johnstown, PA Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): I don't even know anymore?? Posts: A lot. MOTM - Apr '14	So bored and stroked it, what do you think you have into it cash wise to make this happen? what were the hiccups in getting this done? __________________________________________________ I love the smell of burning pre-mix in the morning I don't think I'm a lot dumber than you thought that I think that I thought I was once.

July 8th, 2014, 05:49 PM	#33
crazymadbastard I'm crazy,your excuse is? Name: Winston Location: Connecticut Join Date: May 2013 Motorcycle(s): 250 2007 ninja Posts: A lot.	nice! __________________________________________________ My Cafe Racer Build My intro post

July 8th, 2014, 05:56 PM	#34
Racer x ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Eric Location: Iowa City Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): 2008 Kawmeracchi 350 2010 Project X Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 54 MOTM - Sep '18, Feb '16	I love it. __________________________________________________ Top speed 123.369mph. Ohio mile Worlds fastest 250 ninja

July 8th, 2014, 06:17 PM	#35
garth285 KAWASAKI GURU Name: Shawn Location: Florida Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): Turbo Ninja 250 Posts: 863	Very nice! Post Dyno numbers when ya can! Did you wind up having to run a spacer for the deck height?

July 8th, 2014, 08:20 PM	#36
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16

July 9th, 2014, 12:32 AM	#38
supersport ninjette.org member Name: Lee Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300 Posts: 97	what kind of cams? stock?

July 9th, 2014, 01:59 AM	#39
micoulisninja modaholic junkie Name: Nick Location: Athens, Greece Join Date: Sep 2012 Motorcycle(s): 2001 ZX-12R, 2009 ninja 345cc and plenty of others in the past... Posts: 438 Blog Entries: 2	sounds fine Bruce and must be a little beast in mid range torque-wise... I guess you also used the 300 rods to keep the same engine height... however a couple of things still make me wonder... stock head has tiny intake ports and valves for oem displacement...if still stock there, with the extra cc doesn't it "choke" on the high end ?? unless you mean 300 stock... did you need to evaluate anything concerning mean piston velocity or is it safe (250 18,23m/sec 300 cranking on 250 electrics 21,64m/sec for the piston at 13250rpm...)wiseco piton lighter than stock (stock is 124grams, 130 with rings plus 36 with oem pin)?? I bet you still have some upgrades to go...well done !! can't wait for those figures from the dyno... __________________________________________________ If noone has tried it before, I will !!!