I did it.. dropped my Ninja at 0 MPH today.. grrrr

[Rosie]

So it finally happened. Not like I was looking forward to it, but I kind of figured it would happen eventually..
Today I had just finished filling up my first tank of gas religiously following all the advice given on this forum.. started up my Ninja, slowed/stopped at the corner of the gas station ready to get back out on the road.. and.. I drop it!

What the heck??!? I didn't do anything different than I normally do, or at least that's what I thought, except I was going like 1 mph ready to get back out on the road and as I slow down more.. I have no clue what happened. I just dropped it. Bike suffered minor injuries, just a scratched decal I can easily replace, but my pride took the hardest hit. What on earth have I done wrong to drop it? My hubby suspects I was just going too slow as I was trying to prepare to turn right and slowed down at the same time and I should have put my feet down at that speed and didn't.
I honestly can't remember much as it happened so fast, but I do remember I didn't have time to put any of my feet down until it was too late.
A guy in his cage pulled up and offered help and even tried to cheer me up by saying "don't worry, it happens all the time!".. but I was so sad!
After the "incident" it took a little while before I could start the bike back up, but then we were able to move on with our planned ride without problems.

Now I need to figure out what I've done wrong and correct it, so it doesn't happen again. It would be nice if I'd actually remember what caused all this, but the more I think about it, the less sense it makes..

[Cuongism]

I think most low speed/no speed drops are from stopping the bike while it's not completely upright. Even a slight lean angle makes it exponentially heavier to hold up.
Were you on a decline to enter back into the street? Declines lowers your front end so your feet won't reach the floor as normal (higher height). Just some ideas, but luckily you're ok and you got right back on! Your carbs were just flooded so it takes some throttle to start it up. Good luck and keep riding

[welcome2thedawn]

my first real trip out on the main road was to a friend's house...pull into the driveway, which was a fairly steep decline...my boyfriend was already stopped, and lets me know that the bike doesn't have reverse...i'm just trying to figure out what his point was, as i get off the bike...i learned 2 lessons that day...parking on a hill is not the same as flat ground...oooops....and since you can't just reverse up and out of a steep driveway, it's good to park so that you can jump on, and ride up and out aahhhh, the little things you learn along the way

[johnjohn]

Slow or stopped and your wheel is turned for the exit. Down you go. Start your turn when you are moving.

[ally99]

I'm so sorry Rose, but it truly does happen very often to nearly all riders, particularly us who are on the smaller side. I've found that at turtle-like parking lot speeds, I favor the rear brake as it's more forgiving if I use it while the bars are turned, even a little. The front brake + any amount of bar turn - speed = meeting the ground. Lesson I learned the hard way too. I won't lie, gas stations are my least favorite place to go with Lil Ninj. There's so much going on w/ traffic every which way, slick pavement, and 2MPH riding...not fun for me either.
Get out there in a parking lot and relive the situation several times to practice. Don't let it discourage you too much.

[spooph]

great advice and ideas!

Keep at it Rose. Indeed, it happens to the best, and to the rest of us too! :P

I've found, especially with gas stations, gravel, dirt, or dust film are usually present at gas station exists. I was in Washington, and there was this ridiculously fine film of dust on an exit, and it made the front wheel go all squirmy. So I think with the combo of ultra-slow speed, maybe a slight jerk on the front wheel, a possible dip in the pavement making it difficult to stretch a leg out all the way, or maybe something simply distracting happening on the road holding your full attention for just a moment too long.... All possibilities.

However, don't beat yourself up too much over it. If you can't figure it out, don't worry about it. The more you ride, the less this will happen...

[Flashmonkey]

Originally Posted by ally99

I'm so sorry Rose, but it truly does happen very often to nearly all riders, particularly us who are on the smaller side. I've found that at turtle-like parking lot speeds, I favor the rear brake as it's more forgiving if I use it while the bars are turned, even a little. The front brake + any amount of bar turn - speed = meeting the ground. Lesson I learned the hard way too. I won't lie, gas stations are my least favorite place to go with Lil Ninj. There's so much going on w/ traffic every which way, slick pavement, and 2MPH riding...not fun for me either.
Get out there in a parking lot and relive the situation several times to practice. Don't let it discourage you too much.

+1. The mastery of slow speed maneuvering is what separates the posers from the truly skillful street riders in my opinion. Don't sweat it too much, it could've easily happened to anybody.

A lot of good advice has already been given, so I won't repeat it. I will say, though, that confidence is paramount when it comes to staying balanced on the bike while it's practically standing still. Keep riding!

[RedCromwell]

Sorry about the drop. I've heard many tales of slow speed mishaps. The combination of the bike weight and slow turns can be quite tricky.

I agree that it was probably stopping with your handle bars turned that did you in.

Ally99's tip to use the rear brake for slow speed operation is great. I find it easier to balance using my knees to grip the tank while applying light pressure to the rear brake.

Don't get me wrong I definitely need tons more practice on slow speed riding. I'd love to be able to stay balanced on the bike at a standstill for an extended period of time. Such skills come in handy riding in stop-and-go traffic.

[Blackwidow]

aww Rosie, don't feel too bad, i've had my bike for 3 weeks and dropped it twice already.

now any of the experts can correct me if i'm wrong, but I think its also crucial in learning how to save the bike while its almost trying to fall? This past weekend, the bf held the bike for me as I leaned it and got use to the weight so when it does tip, I react quickly and learn the trick in keeping it up. Us chicks don't really have the strength to keep it up like the boyz do....but i learned that If I quickly put my knee against the tank and my foot on the ground, it helps me control the bike and pull it back in it position.

[DAKINECHICk]

So sorry this happened to you!! When I had my R6 I did the exact same thing... 0 mph and down it went. I just put one foot down and it went the opposite way, couldn't save it. Too heavy!
All the advice given so far is right on, so I won't repeat it.
Though, something you can practice is in a parking lot doing super slow maneuvers as to get the feeling of when to put your feet down and when you don't really need to. Also helps with getting comfortable with balance at slow speeds. I just say this because it helped me in the long run with my R6, so now with the ninja I can keep the bike up with very little speed, no feet, and balance. Keep at it and whatever you do...do NOT get discouraged. It's part of the learning curve!

[Rosie]

Thank you all for great advice! That's why I post on this forum, you guys are the BEST!

I felt so bad yesterday I couldn't find peace of mind but now I feel much better knowing how I can avoid this in the future.
Definitely what happened was that as I was ready to do my right turn from the gas station, I had my handlebars turned, going 1 mph and had the really bad idea to break some more (because I wasn't going slow enough.. duh!!) and there it was.. bike on the floor. I managed to keep my leg out of the way and it didn't get hurt.. as a matter of fact I didn't even fall, just my poor lil Ninja did

Lesson learned.. I don't have the ability to manage a turn in very slow speeds, so I'll just put my foot down next time (I'm 5'7" so luckily I can keep both feet on the floor without issues).

Blackwidow, you made a good point though.. I'm 123 lbs.. and pretty much no muscles, so how am I going to keep the bike up if it goes past its center of gravity next time? Did you manage to keep it up with your knee when you practiced with your BF? I think I'll try the same thing as well.

Also I was lucky my hubby was there and picked the bike up like it was made of feathers, but I did try to pick it up at first and wasn't able to What's the proper way to bike up a bike if you're not exactly very strong?

[Blackwidow]

ya i weigh the same as you...so we're in the same boat...lol

well as long as it doesn't tilt too much then I can save it using my knee...but after a certain point, you need strength to hold up 350+ lbs. BUT...i learned when it does fall, turn you back against the bike, bend your knees and get low...put one hand on the seat, and another on the handlebar...and lift with your knees NOT YOUR BACK...this was the easiest way for me to pick up the bike. try it out...you might need to change where you grip though.

[Rosie]

Originally Posted by Blackwidow

ya i weigh the same as you...so we're in the same boat...lol

well as long as it doesn't tilt too much then I can save it using my knee...but after a certain point, you need strength to hold up 350+ lbs. BUT...i learned when it does fall, turn you back against the bike, bend your knees and get low...put one hand on the seat, and another on the handlebar...and lift with your knees NOT YOUR BACK...this was the easiest way for me to pick up the bike. try it out...you might need to change where you grip though.

Ok, next time I'll go to the parking lot I always practice on, I'll have my husband help me with both holding the bike on the side with the knee, and also pick up my bike from the floor like you described.

Man.. so many things to learn!

[kkim]

http://www.pinkribbonrides.com/dropped.html

[tjkamper]

I've found that if you are slowing with the handle bars turned it can cause an unstable situation where you could easily tip over. It happened to me several times when I first started riding. A good tip, is to not use the front brake if you are going to be turning the handle bars at low speed.

[Cuongism]

Here's a video of the proper way to lift a bike (Paulette has it correct!). You can't hear everything she says, but you get a gist of it from watching. Make sure you have your kickstand down!

Link to original page on YouTube.

That's also a 550 lb Harley she's lifting there. I eat my spinach so I lift the bike facing it since I have more control that way.
You'll get used to the balance of the bike and how to properly use leverage. When I first got a motorcycle, moving the bike while standing next to it was a task, but now I'm spinning the bike on its kickstand. It all takes time and experience, but definitely an enjoyable one
BTW, not sure how you can practice that technique...

[Rosie]

Originally Posted by kawboyCAFE

it happens to the best of riders, even if they wont admit it. i was backing out of my driveway one day and stepped in a hole, and guess what happened.

At first I thought that they guy in the cage that wanted to help was just trying to cheer me up by saying "It happens all the time!", but I guess it's more common than I thought. I though I was fairly safe from bike-dropping while stopped since I can keep both feet flat on the ground, but I had not considered the "super slow speed with handlebars turned" trap It's all good though, lesson learned, hopefully I won't let it happen again. And the more I learn, the more I want to ride!!

[Rosie]

Originally Posted by Cuongism

Here's a video of the proper way to lift a bike (Paulette has it correct!). You can't hear everything she says, but you get a gist of it from watching. Make sure you have your kickstand down!

Link to original page on YouTube.

That's also a 550 lb Harley she's lifting there. I eat my spinach so I lift the bike facing it since I have more control that way.
You'll get used to the balance of the bike and how to properly use leverage. When I first got a motorcycle, moving the bike while standing next to it was a task, but now I'm spinning the bike on its kickstand. It all takes time and experience, but definitely an enjoyable one
BTW, not sure how you can practice that technique...

That's a nice video, I think I can do that

[paterick4o8]

welcome to the club

[highpsiguy]

I rode Goldwings for many years with the local chapter. I have seen women as small as you upright fallen wings. Technique!

Maybe, having a full tank of gas may have offset your center of gravity. That is an extra 32 lbs or so more up top than you had just moments ago.... thats 20 percent of your body weight! Another thing to look out for is oil at the gas pumps. If a car was leaking oil you could have gotten your tire contaminated and rolled over to that spot when u pulled out. Its not always rider error.

I have over 200k miles on motorcycles. I have seen many drops. I can think of at least 2 that were mine. You cant control everything. Accidents will happen.

The worst and most embarrasing drop I ever saw was at a Goldwing rally in Cherokee NC. There were literally hundreds of wings in the parking area. This guy must have weighed at least 500lbs- and I am not exagerating. He dropped it at almost no speed and rolled liked humpty dumpty at least 5 times head over heels right into a crowd of people standing there. Bowling anyone?

So see, your little spill doesn't sound near so bad now does it?

P.S You should not ride alone until you master the skill to pick up the bike by yourself. If nothing else get some cardboard lay it on the ground and have your husband gently lay it *bike* over so you can practice picking it up. You could be alone and in a bad location. Make sure bike is in gear and follow the above video. Could be the guy who comes to "rescue" you, will put you and your bike into his truck......

[FrugalNinja250]

Sadly, where that technique doesn't work is on loose and slick surfaces such as grass, sand, and gravel. Also, if the bike's on a slope and you're on the uphill side of the slope, keeping control of it as it goes vertical is challenging as all getout.

[mrlmd]

Like said here above - it's usually pretty simple. Wheel turned + front brake applied = bike going down. No gravel, sand, anything else needed. It's purely the physics of the bike and the steering geometry.
Use the rear brake for slow speeds, especially if the front wheel is turned. At a complete stop, try and keep the wheel straight ahead or if turned, then still only apply the rear brake, keeping your left foot on the ground. Keep your eyes and gaze forward, don't look down, look where you want to go. Look down, bike goes down. Look around the turn.
Don't feel so bad - It happens to almost everyone in the beginning and that's how you learn.

[gaby]

Sorry to hear Rosie, but it does happened. I dropped the ZX6r going at like 2mph LOL! on the gravel driveway and hit the truck's bumper while I was at it. Husband saw it happened and told me to keep my foot down when I am taking off at that speed. Guess I also had my foot up and then I guess I dumped it. Sucked and was so dissapointed, but lesson learned.

[Rosie]

We are planning to practice the "pick my bike up" move in the privacy of my garage this weekend

Highpsiguy, you are right about the extra added weight with a full tank of gas. I felt the difference immediately as I was pulling out of the gas station and that might have also thrown me off balance. I guess it was a combination of factors, plus the inexperience, of course.

Last night I went to my favorite parking lot to practice and did about 100 super tight turns, at super-slow speed, touching ONLY the rear break and playing with the friction zone (while my hubby was yelling "Use that clutch!! I want to see that left hand moving! ). No accidents, and I controlled the bike fairly well.

[backinthesaddleagain]

Rosie as bad as it seems, better a low speed drop than a high speed one.

[Rosie]

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

Rosie as bad as it seems, better a low speed drop than a high speed one.

Agreed!

[pooter]

Yup, a fistful of front brake + handlebars turned = Quick Drop™

Don't feel bad. I did something similar shortly after I got my bike too. My uncle wanted to go on a ride with me so he pulled out of the driveway on his Harley and he had stopped to make sure there was no cars coming. I was following too closely and also had my handlebars turned, then grabbed the front brake and the bike was on the ground before I knew it. The driveway adding the element of an incline probably was a huge factor as well.

While we're on the topic, my second laydown (shortly after this incident ) was me trying to work the centerstand so I could lube my chain. I got it up after some wrestling around but when I put it down, it immediately went over to the right side (I was standing on the left)

The other day, I almost dropped again when I was pulling into the gas station and as I put my foot down, I slipped on a patch of oil that I didn't see. Was smeared from cars running over it so I didn't notice it at first. Luckily I caught myself with my right foot, but very scary.

And then, just yesterday I almost dropped it again! Came home, turned off bike, kickstand down, dismounted, then the bike practically leans and falls on me lol. Luckily it leaned over to the left where I was standing so I just pushed it back up. Probably what happened is the kickstand wasn't fully down, since when I looked at it as I was pushing it back up, the kick stand had popped back up completely.

Just gotta take each incident as a learning experience I guess

[mrlmd]

Like Cuongism said when he posted the video of picking up a downed bike - Make sure the kickstand is down. If the bike is lying on it's right side, go over to the stand and put it down and make sure it's locked in position, all the way down. It's very embarrassing when you pick up the bike and then it falls over on the left side because you have no way to control it beyond vertical as it goes over. If the bike is lying down on the left side, be careful when you get it almost upright not to go too far, and get the stand down when you have the room. You have to hold the bike and turn around to do this most of the time.

[Rosie]

Originally Posted by mrlmd

If the bike is lying down on the left side, be careful when you get it almost upright not to go too far, and get the stand down when you have the room. You have to hold the bike and turn around to do this most of the time.

Mmmhhhhh.. I wonder if I can just use my heel to get the stand down instead of having to turn around

[pooter]

The Ride Like a Pro dvd video has a good section on how to pick up a motorcycle:

Link to original page on YouTube.

Our bikes have those handles above the passenger pegs to grab unto too Although the couple of times I laid it down, I picked it up superfast with the adrenaline from being really embarrassed...

[jae.trini]

Sorry to hear about the drop. If it makes you feel any better, while I was doing my drivers license road test, I almost dropped mine. It was about 5 inches from hitting the ground. The examiner came over to me and said, "That was a good catch". I felt the same as you did and I didn't even drop it. I almost failed that day. That was yesterday...just kidding.

Yeah.

[mrlmd]

Originally Posted by Rosie

Mmmhhhhh.. I wonder if I can just use my heel to get the stand down instead of having to turn around

That works too if you can see it and reach it. Either way, don't forget the stand, or you'll have to pick it up again.

[mrlmd]

That video posted by pooter is not really fair. That bike is only half down, lying at a 45 degree angle because of the advantage of crash bars/engine guards. Another reason to have them on a big bike, also keeps your legs from getting crushed between the bike and thee road.
But the real point or the video is that when you grab ahold of the bike, walk it backwards slowly with your legs, taking little steps to pick the bike up. Watch out for slippery ground or sand. The strength in your legs and steps is what picks up the bike, not your arms, those are just to grab on to the bike. You'd be surprised at how heavy a bike you can leverage upright if you do it properly.

[karlosdajackal]

It sucks but despite what people say you can use the front brake while turning the wheel, of course you need to be gentle with it, but you don't just yank it all the time do you? Sure you can use the back but the problem with the back brake is its much harder to feel it through your boots, than the front brake is through your gloves. From what you said even if you used the back you would have fell. In fact if you feel to the right you'd be more likely to fall as your right leg would be on the brake instead of going down to support you.

In 95% of stops you should aim to apply the front (power and feel) just before the rear (stability), when you are about to come to a halt you put your left foot down and continue to hold the bike on the rear brake. That rear brake only comes off as the clutch is engaged so the bike can never roll back even on a steep hill. The other 5% of the time the road is falling to the left, so you need to hold it on the front and put your right foot down. Or your on a steep downhill area and need the front as the back tire would just skid down the slope. You could use either foot here.

Everyone is right saying practice, but the above is what you need to practice, both those stopping scenarios.

Your comment that you where going 1mph and still were going to fast is very telling. Was the steering turned over to the stops? Its hard to counter-steer out of a turn when that happens. The thing is, if its to fast at 10mph and the steering is fully locked over, it will still be too fast at 0.0001mph as the steering can't turn any further than that. More worrying is the fact you seem to have been really struggling to take the turn and just kept going rather than stopping and coming up with a better action plan.

We can only guess, but from what you've said, i think you might actually have been going to slow. To go 1mph in a controlled fashion you need to be holding constant rpm and slipping the clutch to control speed and using rear brake also to control speed and add some stability in combination to keep the speed that low. At that speed your feet really should never come up as your always close to putting them down.

Its a lot to think about when also wanting to make a tight turn. If you didn't do all these things your onto a loser straight away. Bit quicker and counter lean if the turn was possible, stop if it was not, 2 simple choices.

Practice stopping though on a level surface front and rear brake (front first)

9/10 stops make sure your holding the bike on the rear brake and left foot down only. When starting again only release the rear in sync with the clutch starting to bite

For the other 1/10 practice stopping and holding on the front brake with your right foot down. Once in a while you'll need to do this when facing downhill or the road is falling away to the left, so instead of reaching with your left foot you can have an easier time using just the right.

After that you just have to read the road ahead of you before you stop on it so you know which one your supposed to be doing. Point is if you were a bit more confident stopping you might have choosen to do that instead