Cam/Chain/Rocker ?

Dbo03 · July 26th, 2019, 09:16 AM

Bike was running just fine- turned it off and ran into store.. came back out and tried to start it and it would crank over but wouldn't start- had to use full choke AND 3/4 throttle to get it going and heard tapping/slapping noise big time.. the speed of the noise was same as rpm's (more throttle-faster the tapping) and won't run on its own. I tried resetting the CCT but it didn't do anything to help.
I'm new to bikes, but I work on cars n trucks etc. (Just not anything internal on engines)
I am a spunge and want to learn- so let me know what ya think I got goin. Thx
(1999 Ninja 250R)

Triple Jim · July 26th, 2019, 09:35 AM

Hello Dustin, welcome.

I'm only guessing without an audio recording of the noise, but needing full choke and that much throttle could mean something as simple as clogged carbs, with the noise coming from the open throttle sucking air. Or something mechanical could have let loose inside the engine.

Dbo03 · July 26th, 2019, 12:55 PM

Thx for getting back to me'
Carbs cleaned and adjust recently and drove just fine to the store and then bam! It's so weird.. the noise sounds like a piece of bamboo with a flat end on it that's going around with the crank- slapping on everything it touches and speeds up right along with the rpms..
... And that's just about the oddest description Ive ever given to date. Lmao

ducatiman · July 26th, 2019, 01:55 PM

Turning bike off...then switching on shortly after with issue...weird circumstance. This happened immediately after you were in carbs?

As thats the last place you were in prior to this issue...an internal carb review is called for.

Desperate start requiring choke and open throttle to start indicate something going on in those carpotata's.

Suggest to verify both carb diaphragms are properly seated and intact...no rips or tears.

Floats are, um...floating?

Did you leave something loose within the carbs which took awhile to loosen further or fall out to create the issue?

A severely out of synch carbset *could* make nasty noises ...1 cylinder running, the other fighting against it, being dragged along.

Bottom line, I'm suggesting to review your carb work first, eliminate or correct any errors there prior to ripping your engine apart.

DannoXYZ · July 26th, 2019, 03:37 PM

Timing-chain may have jumped a tooth.

- Do compression test.
- Verify cams are sync to crank properly

Dbo03 · July 26th, 2019, 04:49 PM

I rode the bike for several weeks b4 this happened.. I fine tuned it every couple days or so just to see if I could better it. It's almost like the chain must have been very loose and maybe the noise is the chain riding over the top of the sprockets? I read however that I should rotate the engine manually since I reset the CCT? I haven't done that yet-
P. S. Thanks for taking the time to help me out 'its very much appreciated!

DannoXYZ · July 26th, 2019, 05:14 PM

Yes, safest to turn engine over 720-degrees by hand to make sure no valves are contacting pistons. Take valve-cover off as well and verify cam-sprockets line up properly at TDC.

ducatiman · July 26th, 2019, 06:35 PM

that's a valid precaution @DannoXYZ

bike running fine...turn key off for his stop. Come out turn key on, start attempt....cam chain/tensioner/valve timing issue instantly during (or caused by) startup? Wow.

Weird scenario...

July 26th, 2019, 09:16 AM	#1
Dbo03 ninjette.org newbie Name: Dustin Location: Hugo, mn Join Date: Jul 2019 Motorcycle(s): 1999 Ninja 250R Posts: 4	Cam/Chain/Rocker ? Bike was running just fine- turned it off and ran into store.. came back out and tried to start it and it would crank over but wouldn't start- had to use full choke AND 3/4 throttle to get it going and heard tapping/slapping noise big time.. the speed of the noise was same as rpm's (more throttle-faster the tapping) and won't run on its own. I tried resetting the CCT but it didn't do anything to help. I'm new to bikes, but I work on cars n trucks etc. (Just not anything internal on engines) I am a spunge and want to learn- so let me know what ya think I got goin. Thx (1999 Ninja 250R)

July 26th, 2019, 01:55 PM	#4
ducatiman ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Gordon Location: new york Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '07 DUCATI SS800 '19 HONDA CBR650R Posts: A lot. MOTM - Nov '18, Mar '17	Turning bike off...then switching on shortly after with issue...weird circumstance. This happened immediately after you were in carbs? As thats the last place you were in prior to this issue...an internal carb review is called for. Desperate start requiring choke and open throttle to start indicate something going on in those carpotata's. Suggest to verify both carb diaphragms are properly seated and intact...no rips or tears. Floats are, um...floating? Did you leave something loose within the carbs which took awhile to loosen further or fall out to create the issue? A severely out of synch carbset could make nasty noises ...1 cylinder running, the other fighting against it, being dragged along. Bottom line, I'm suggesting to review your carb work first, eliminate or correct any errors there prior to ripping your engine apart. __________________________________________________ gordon@customcarbservices.com Custom Carb Service www.customcarbservices.com

July 26th, 2019, 06:35 PM	#8
ducatiman ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Gordon Location: new york Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '07 DUCATI SS800 '19 HONDA CBR650R Posts: A lot. MOTM - Nov '18, Mar '17	that's a valid precaution @DannoXYZ bike running fine...turn key off for his stop. Come out turn key on, start attempt....cam chain/tensioner/valve timing issue instantly during (or caused by) startup? Wow. Weird scenario... __________________________________________________ gordon@customcarbservices.com Custom Carb Service www.customcarbservices.com

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July 26th, 2019, 09:35 AM	#2
Triple Jim Guy Who Enjoys Riding Name: Jim Location: North Carolina Join Date: Jul 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Oct '18, Aug '17, Aug '16	Hello Dustin, welcome. I'm only guessing without an audio recording of the noise, but needing full choke and that much throttle could mean something as simple as clogged carbs, with the noise coming from the open throttle sucking air. Or something mechanical could have let loose inside the engine.

July 26th, 2019, 12:55 PM	#3
Dbo03 ninjette.org newbie Name: Dustin Location: Hugo, mn Join Date: Jul 2019 Motorcycle(s): 1999 Ninja 250R Posts: 4	Thx for getting back to me' Carbs cleaned and adjust recently and drove just fine to the store and then bam! It's so weird.. the noise sounds like a piece of bamboo with a flat end on it that's going around with the crank- slapping on everything it touches and speeds up right along with the rpms.. ... And that's just about the oddest description Ive ever given to date. Lmao

July 26th, 2019, 03:37 PM	#5
DannoXYZ ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: AKA JacRyann Location: Mesa, AZ Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): CB125T CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR SFV650 VFR750F R1M ST1300PA Valkyrie-F6C Posts: A lot. MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17	Timing-chain may have jumped a tooth. - Do compression test. - Verify cams are sync to crank properly

July 26th, 2019, 04:49 PM	#6
Dbo03 ninjette.org newbie Name: Dustin Location: Hugo, mn Join Date: Jul 2019 Motorcycle(s): 1999 Ninja 250R Posts: 4	I rode the bike for several weeks b4 this happened.. I fine tuned it every couple days or so just to see if I could better it. It's almost like the chain must have been very loose and maybe the noise is the chain riding over the top of the sprockets? I read however that I should rotate the engine manually since I reset the CCT? I haven't done that yet- P. S. Thanks for taking the time to help me out 'its very much appreciated!

July 26th, 2019, 05:14 PM	#7
DannoXYZ ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: AKA JacRyann Location: Mesa, AZ Join Date: Dec 2011 Motorcycle(s): CB125T CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR SFV650 VFR750F R1M ST1300PA Valkyrie-F6C Posts: A lot. MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17	Yes, safest to turn engine over 720-degrees by hand to make sure no valves are contacting pistons. Take valve-cover off as well and verify cam-sprockets line up properly at TDC.