Pre Gen vs New Gen for a track bike

[Rollingmenace]

Ok here goes.. I'm planning on racing a production 250 class next year out here in Colorado ... I can pick up a fully race prepped new gen for around 3000-3500 it doesn't seem like to bad of a deal for a ready to go bike... But I have some spare pre gen stuff I could probably put a runner together for cheap or even buy a complete runner for 800-1200 range ... I'd need a set of clipons some rear sets , touch up or customize body work and saddle.. Switch over to new gen wheels, And possibly an exhaust.. I'm thinking If I shopped around I could probably build and prep two pre gens for the cost of a new gen.. That being said the cost could be a factor just for the reason if I end up moving up a class in next year or so I won't have a ton of money invested in the pre gen

Now the questions ...
I think handling would be almost the same on both bikes especially if I switch to new gen wheels and a new gen rear shock(preload adjust)... What do u think...

Rearsets I know there's a ton available for the new gen ... Is there any for the pre gen, can a new gen set be used or modded to fit the pre gen ... What are my options here...

Power... How comparable are the motors on these bikes am I wasting my time with this whole notion of building a pre gen .. Is there a close comparison on these two motors .. Everywhere I look I come up with about the same numbers but I would like your guys opinions and real world experiences

Lastly body.. I know there isn't alot or really anything available for the pre gen... I know I've seen other race bodies used but with alot of mods.. I'm fine with using some pre gen stuff modded up .. Heck I may even try my luck with glassing my own using stockers as templates... What if any ideas or recommendations do you all have especially for the tail...

[Lychee]

Have you looked at airtech streamlining for track fairings? They are the only aftermarket fairing makers I can find on the interweb.

Are you planning to do an entire fork and swingarm swap? You might be able to make the pregen suspension pretty good using valve emulators and springs. You can also drop in a new gen shock on to the pregen swingarm. That won't fix your need for the 17 in" wheels though.

Personally I think you should run the pregen, but maybe I am biased because I want to see how things turn out! The newgen will cost more but is probably a lot less of a headache to get going though.

Rumor has it that newgen rearsets will fit the pregen with some slight modifications. There are threads about it somewhere if you search. I believe the biggest thing is a mounting tab that needs to be ground off near the rear brake.

[Rollingmenace]

I'm planning on the air tech rear and number plate for the front... I may be able really to get a budget setup going as I have a spare pre gen motor and I have a opertunity to get a couple of pre gen full rollers for dirt cheap ... ... I will need a few items like wiring cdi coils radiator ect but I prolly could put together running bike around 300-500 bucks
I've found sets of new gen wheels for around 150 locally..

I've checked into new gen wheels on pre gen basically you can run all pregen stuff and just have to make an adaptor for brake caliper and shave down wheel spacers for front.... On rear need to cut and re weld the brake arm and shave caliper mount .... Easy peasy there
I think I can build a track bike ready to go including the race rear and whole shebang for around 1000 bucks especially if I get a little help from members here on some of the little parts ...and as long as my spare motor lasts.. But I could pick up another used motor for 400 or so and with new tires a backup motor ect be into this thing 1400-1600 and no more than 2000
I think I still would be ahead money wise over buying a pepped new gen ... And I don't mind the work I built my current pre gen from a pile of parts over last winter.... And it's really for the girl to ride once she finally gets the time to learn...

Now does anybody have an opinion on the motor issue... Will the pre gen hold its own against the new gen power wise

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Rollingmenace

Ok here goes.. I'm planning on racing a production 250 class next year out here in Colorado ........

For the pregen:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/How_to_...own_track_bike

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Differe..._Classic_bikes

[Rollingmenace]

Thanks motofool.. I've read into the wiki stuff on a track bike this wouldn't be my first track bike but it's been10-12 years .. I kind of excited to get something going.. I was just concerned about building A pre gen as everybody here runs the newer gen bikes.. It will take some time to get my skill level back up there and ill need to drop a few pounds .. I just want to be sure the pre gen is up to standards to run with the new gen bikes

[motoduelist]

Originally Posted by Rollingmenace

I've checked into new gen wheels on pre gen basically you can run all pregen stuff and just have to make an adaptor for brake caliper and shave down wheel spacers for front.... On rear need to cut and re weld the brake arm and shave caliper mount .... Easy peasy there

...

Now does anybody have an opinion on the motor issue... Will the pre gen hold its own against the new gen power wise

Wow! I hadn't heard about that option to put 17 inch wheels on the bike, but I guess I hadn't looked hard enough! Most of my research has been on the Ninja 250 Riders Club website which suggested that getting 17 inch wheels would cost close to $2k so I've never considered it an option.

I have a pre-gen that I've set up for track, and Woodcraft makes a decent set of rearsets. If you have any questions about mods that I've done to my bike, feel free to ask me.

I've ridden both bikes and the pre-gen seems to have a bit more top end power while the new-gen has a bit more mid range power. Something else to note is that a track prepped pre-gen is about 30 pounds or so lighter than the new-gen. I would assume this helps the power to weight as well as handling going into corners, but I'm still a track newbie so keep that in mind when considering this information.

[Rollingmenace]

Thanks MD... I may be hitting you up for sure with questions concerning the setup.. I heavily seen the wood rafts there are also some less expensive ones prolly china made on eBay that seem highly adjustable.. For new gen bikes that I suspect would work on the pregen...
Wow I didn't think about the weight savings ... And due to the fact I'm a heavier guy at about 235 that could help to level the playing field a bit.. Kinda hard when you out weigh most of your competition by 50-80 lbs
Here is link with new gen wheel swap info http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showt...ght=gen+wheels

Hope the info will help ya out ... I'm sure ill be talking to you soon and keep checking in for updates

[Lychee]

I emailed the WERA racer that copperaxe was talking about in that thread awhile ago. I don't think he does the fab work anymore, but you can give emailing him a shot. That is, unless you are trying to fab it up yourself. Last time I checked Jeff wanted $150 for the work with your parts or $200 for work + him sourcing the parts. The pictures that he sent me are in this thread:

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showp...4&postcount=75

Also, he doesn't mention it, but in the pictures the front fender appears to be raised.

[choneofakind]

$200 for work+parts is a steal. All you need is a few other things, like the wheels and tires. Cheap for what you're getting.



You'd still want the works in the forks and likely used GSXR shock or an aftermarket shock intended for the newgen to be competitive.

[Rollingmenace]

I think I can do most of the mods myself to get the 17's on...
I plan on doing front suspension work like springs and emulators... As far as the rear ill have to read the rulebook to see what is all legal as it is a production class...

[Rollingmenace]

Ok racers time for a debate here.... Local racing club here runs a production 250 class .. You can not mod motor other than aftermarket exhaust and jet kit...
That being said I'm trying to get opinions on building a track bike...
So if for example I was to put together a pre gen bike with new gen 17 wheels and tires... Would there be any difference or advantage between the bikes taking for granted suspensions were set up the same on both... What do you all think

[Rollingmenace]

The reason I'm asking is everybody keeps saying go with a new gen because there better but nobody really has answers as to why....
I've been looking at prices and i am finding new gen bikes already setup in the 3500-4500 range... But I have a few surplus pre gen bikes and I could set one of them up in the 1500-2000 range for everything comparable to the new gen bike .. Minus the dyno tuning of coarse.. The savings alone would basically pay for all my seasons race fees

[Alex]

/merged into the Ninjettes at Speed area for best feedback

[Rollingmenace]

We'll I'm heading north tomorrow to pick up a couple rollers and a bunch of parts... Time to get this started... Still would like feedback on the whole new gen vs pre gen stuff.... But I pulled the trigger on the pregen stuff so I may just be on my own... I'll keep an updated thread once I start getting things together

[cuong-nutz]

I would go with pregen. Parts are aplenty and many of the new gen race parts are interchangeable. I like the extra oomph that the pregen puts out and it's noticeable compared to the newgen.

I am contemplating a pregen track build to ride and sell after I fix this new gen

[alex.s]

newgen engine is easier to work on. pregen engine revs higher. you definitely want newgen finals... the 17" wheels are a requirement if you want to go fast with good rubber. the newgen and pregen suspension both suck and need to be fixed (stiffer springs, real damping) the frame options are meh.

if you go with a pregen, you will be replacing the front and rear ends. if not immediately, eventually.
if you go with a newgen, you'll still be replacing suspension, just not as much stuff to change.
if you go with a 300, you have less work to do, but still will need suspension upgrades similar to the newgen, but you get a really fancy slipper and a better frame and more power and a vastly easier to work on engine. replacing critical components on the 300 looks like a breeze compared to the previous two generations.

[Rollingmenace]

Thanks guys.. The tennitive plan is for now
Pre gen frame .... Stock fairing on front airtech race on rear, custom hand laid fiberglass track spec chin fairing
Pre gen motor... Muzzys can and of coarse carbs jetted.. Possibly even dyno tuned
Also new braided brake lines front for sure possibly rear as well
Pre gen fork tubes w springs emulators, and preload adjusters
New gen 17" wheel conversion front and rear
Pre gen rear suspension with a new gen shock possibly gsxr shock ( until I can afford an ohlins or Penske rear)
Woodcraft clipons on front but with a 2 1/2" riser
Rearset either aftermarket new gen stuff or possibly make adaptor for stock rearset and just pin the foot pegs
I'm looking into aluminum sprockets and a 430 or 420 chain conversion as well

Just keep in mind this is going to be an all out race bike not just a track day setup

So far that's the plans I would also like to find an extra motor to have as a spare

[quarterliter]

Sounds good! As previously stated the pregen engine is more rev happy and makes slightly more power stock. Also valve adjustments are easier with the screw adjusters.