Zero Motorcycles electric motorcycles

[Blue Monkey]

Have you seen these bikes? What do you think about them? You can see them at zeromotorcycles.com I find them kind of cool but too expensive.

[rustler753]

Originally Posted by Blue Monkey

Have you seen these bikes? What do you think about them? You can see them at zeromotorcycles.com I find them kind of cool but too expensive.

They look a bit wonkey

[CZroe]

I saw a pretty good video test drive and write up of the prototype on engadget.

[ScraitT]

I think Brammo has come off as slightly better all around then Zero. I used to see the two compared when they started, but Brammos newer offerings seem to be a bit ahead of Zero with better power and range for a better price.

Brammo's old model, the Enertia, is pretty close in performance and range to the Zero...though the Zero might very slightly top the brammo.
Brammo's newer bikes do 100+ and have ranges from 60-100 miles depending on the model.

The Zero S is 10,000
The Brammo Enertia is 8,000

The newer brammos don;t have official pricing, but are supposed to be around...
Empulse 6.0 (60 miles range) around 10,000
Empulse 8.0 (80 miles range) around 12,000
Empulse 10.0 (100 miles range) around 14,000

And as far as those prices go...the original price Brammo suggested the Enertia would be was 12,000, but it hit showrooms much cheaper.

Also, there's a lot of federal and state discounts which make those much cheaper.

[capt_bugaloo]

I have checked into both. If you don't need more than say a 40 mile range, both the Zero and the Brammo might make a great commuter. My commute is only about a 16-18 miles round-trip, so for me one would be ideal. No pollution (at the vehicle end, anyhow) and they use only pennies worth of electricity per trip.

But the starting price is the big inhibitor. A Zero is 10,000 bucks - easily the twice of a new Ninja 250! I think it's hard to justify that 10 grand when you could go buy a Ninja or a large scooter for a lot cheaper...

[FrugalNinja250]

Then again, there are those for whom dropping 25-30 grand on a bike is no big thing. Hopefully we get enough early adopters to start bringing the cost of Ebikes down.

I remember my dad buying our first VCR, $1,200, and our first CD player, over $800 with only a few hundred titles out on CD. Those were 1980's prices, equivalent to $2,400 and $1,600 in today's dollars.

[ScraitT]

Originally Posted by capt_bugaloo

I have checked into both. If you don't need more than say a 40 mile range, both the Zero and the Brammo might make a great commuter. My commute is only about a 16-18 miles round-trip, so for me one would be ideal. No pollution (at the vehicle end, anyhow) and they use only pennies worth of electricity per trip.

But the starting price is the big inhibitor. A Zero is 10,000 bucks - easily the twice of a new Ninja 250! I think it's hard to justify that 10 grand when you could go buy a Ninja or a large scooter for a lot cheaper...

Yes and no. The Electric bikes only get that 40-50 miles range when your doing like 20-25 mph. The Brammo for example lists its range on the Enertia as 20 miles for "high speed commuting". Since their top speeds are only 60-65...high speed commuting would be anything about 55.
I'd say if you accelerate easy and keep it around 40 mph, you'll average around 30 miles a charge.

However the other huge factor you have to consider is that thats when the bike is NEW. As the batteries age, your range with steadily decrease.

I don;t think I'd go for anything less then the new Brammos with at the very least the "80 miles range" (which means you would hopefully get at least 50-60 miles riding it for fun).


And for price, you have to remember there's HUGE discounts from the government and state. According to the article I read, if the new Brammo comes to 14,000...in some sates theres enough discounts to drop its final price to around 7,000.

I'm still not sure about now....but I'd say in 5 years there will be some interesting bikes out there for pretty good pricing.

[CZroe]

I just want to see a Tesla electric motorcycle. Mission Motors'/Hum Cycles' "Mission One" is the closest we're likely to get, considering it's from a former Tesla guy.

$70K

[dooby]

Hi guys,

there happened to be a demo of these bikes near me, so I tried out a 2012 ZF9 for a quick 5 min ride today involving some 40mph and 60mph roads.

http://www.zeromotorcycles.com/uk/zero-s-specs-2012



I see the manufacturer is based in Santa Cruz so I wondered whether they have had much impact in the US (west coast or otherwise).

I was amused to note it runs the same IRC RoadWinners as my Ninja. It felt very light, but is in fact 155KG - the demo guy reckoned it feels lighter because the weight is lower down (no ~20KG tank of petrol).

I also realised I must use engine note to gauge corner entry speed as I found I had to look down at the speedo to be comfortable when about to turn in. It was strange to have no noise except wind noise but also quite pleasant in some ways.

Your thoughts?

Cheers, Pete

[Xoulrath]

If they weren't so costly at the moment, I could see myself riding one. I think it would be an excellent commuter depending on the roads and the length of travel, definitely a great bike for urban areas, and it would be immensely fun on backroads not having to worry about attracting the wrong kind of attention.

[Panda]

I think one of the CA racers has/had an electric bike? Maybe Nemesis or Rexbo?

[ninjamunky85]

I think they are cool, but still a long way away from being a viable option over gas.

The company wouldn't even be in business still if it wasn't for government subsidies. They are just too expensive and limited in what they can do.

[rojoracing53]

They raced this exact model in our last M1-GP 8HR endurance race three weeks ago. It takes like 12 seconds to swap batteries and with a a good rider it hauls ass. Range really sucks and cost is crazy but in 5 years I'm sure ill probably have something electric for commuting that way I don't have to ride my future panigale to by eggs.

[choneofakind]

Is there any 'engine braking' effect with electric motorcycles or do you have to use the brakes only to set corner speed?

[Joshorilla]

When electric bikes stop looking like electric bikes and start looking like bikes i'd get one.

[Xoulrath]

Originally Posted by rojoracing53

but in 5 years I'm sure ill probably have something electric for commuting that way I don't have to ride my future panigale to by eggs.

I like the way you think!

Originally Posted by choneofakind

Is there any 'engine braking' effect with electric motorcycles or do you have to use the brakes only to set corner speed?

According to what I have read about them, there is no engine braking from the electric engine naturally, but that it is a possibility to program it in during deceleration to give it a "gas-like" feel.

[Jiggles]

Wow, definitely going to need an mgp growler on this or it will be too dangerous for the streets

[ai4px]

I like the idea of an electric car/ bike, but the range on this one is just 10 miles over what I drive everyday to work. My round trip is exactly 50 miles and as it wears on, the batteries will die and in a year or two my range won't be enough to get me to work.

The electric bike I'd love to have is http://litmotors.com/ .

[Trailerboy531]

Originally Posted by rPanda

I think one of the CA racers has/had an electric bike? Maybe Nemesis or Rexbo?

No, his name is Brandon. Rexbo and Nemsis have 250 racebikes.

Brandon is also known for not finishing the races with us because his battery doesn't last all 6 laps when he's "railing" the thing. When he does finish he's in the back of the pack.

[astricklin]

Originally Posted by Joshorilla

When electric bikes stop looking like electric bikes and start looking like bikes i'd get one.

I don't think the styling for the 2013 model S is that far off a normal streetfighter. I think that they have done a pretty good job on the 2013 models getting them to look like a standard example of the style bike. Granted that may not be to your liking and they don't have a full fairing version.

[Joshorilla]

It's an improvment, I would hate to see an electric motor styled to look like a straight four, but I hate to see a big black square box with a frame and fenders.

Engines look cool because they are full of complicated pieces of purely functional components with other very mechanical components bolted on with things that move and whirr.

If they did an electric motor / battery combo that wasn't hidden in a black box that was purely functional and mechanical I would love to see that.

Imagine a love shild between HAL and an hyrdro electric dam generator.

[Alex]

@Rexbo has one or at least used to have one: link to his for sale thread

[Rexbo]

Originally Posted by Trailerboy531

No, his name is Brandon. Rexbo and Nemsis have 250 racebikes.

Brandon is also known for not finishing the races with us because his battery doesn't last all 6 laps when he's "railing" the thing. When he does finish he's in the back of the pack.

I've got a 2011 zero S which I'm still selling, and I've got a 2012 Zero XU which I'll be converting into a dirtbike/sumo this summer and probably racing some M1GP stuff. Brandon's 2012 never finishes not because of the battery but because he's got zero airflow to the heat sink, motor and controller, causing one of them to overheat. Once he fixes that the bike should be fine, as for his riding... no comment.

The 2011 was a decent commuter, got me to work and back with one charge (~25 miles), was nice and quiet, and wouldn't ever get speeding tickets. Good city commuter, nothing more. I haven't ridden the 2012 yet, picking it up next weekend at AFM, I'll report back, but with an upgraded controller and long travel suspension, it should be a world of difference.

[Rexbo]

Originally Posted by Joshorilla

Imagine a love shild between HAL and an hyrdro electric dam generator.

you mean this:

[Joshorilla]

Yes, that's the ticket!

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by Xoulrath

According to what I have read about them, there is no engine braking from the electric engine naturally, but that it is a possibility to program it in during deceleration to give it a "gas-like" feel.

Huh. Don't electric motors have some amount of resistance to them when they're not powered? I sense more research in my future because I'm curious now. But I have 1.5 weeks until finals, and 2 papers between now and then. Research will have to wait I guess.

[Xoulrath]

Honestly chone, I don't have much knowledge on the subject. I just recall reading about either a MotoCzysz or a Zero. The reviewer made a comment about the lack of engine braking while slowing was taking some getting used to (in addition to the ultra-quiet motor operation). He asked a question to whomever he had access to, and was told that the engine spun down fast with minimal resistance, but that the engineers were looking into programming engine braking.

That's about all I've got. I'm interested in it, but not enough to do more research. I'll leave that up to you, Mr. Engineer.

[dfox]

"engine braking" on an electric would require electric regeneration through braking, which I would think, on an electric bike, that they would use to help extend range.

i love these things, and realistically only commute 6 miles round trip on my 250 so this would be perfect, but a 250 is much cheaper than one of these. maybe if i had more money to throw around...

[dooby]

The guy who let me have a test ride did confirm that there is electric regeneration on that model. I didn't notice it particuarly though - I guess I might default to quite agressive engine braking on a petrol bike by selecting a suitably low gear which of course you can't control on an electric with no gears.

I wasn't paying enough attention to this aspect during my ride to comment much further though I'm afraid.

Cheers, Pete

[Numbersix]

I was going to write "needs KERS" but it sounds like that's now happening!

So ... how much is a spare battery? I don't think I'd mind a slightly limited range if the spare could be kept topped off for quick swap.

[allanoue]

I had an electric bike kit I found this forum useful for questions like what you are asking.

http://visforvoltage.org/forums/elec...large-scooters

[bdavison]

I've seen them and rode one. Aint worth a hill of beans in my opinion.

The effective range of them is so short, you'd be better off with a bicycle, which better for you and the environment as well. Say a typical day....you ride to work/school, then to lunch, then back to work/school, then the battery dies on the way home. You could use it to get to work and back every day, but side-trips will put you very close to "no go" territory quickly. And the recharge rate is not nearly fast enough to allow a quick recharge stop.

Also the top speed is not enough for any kind of interstate or freeway travel, which places them as in-town commuter only bikes.

Honestly, the only task which they would be appropriate would be perhaps getting around a college campus, or the occasional trip to McDonalds when you just want to ride.

Long trips, or travel are impossible on one, unless you like spending 8 hrs recharging at a hotel every 40 miles and on backroads only.


One other thing....you can re-map the ECU on the Zero bikes. And the result is of course...drastically reduced range, however you gain INSANE amounts of instant torque and power. So with a re-map, they would be awesome parking lot stunt bikes, as they are light weight, have enough torque to ground loop it.

[allanoue]

Z-bike goes 3500 miles in 6 days. It is not very practical but very possible.

http://www.torquenews.com/1075/how-d...orcycle-6-days