Fantasy vs. reality (upgrade thoughts)

[headshrink]

I really wouldn't be a newish rider if I didn't have fantasies about upgrading my 250r to something "BIGGER"..... or is that just an American thing? So, this thread is about me (hopefully others too) working through thoughts, ideas, and dreams/fantasies of a bigger, more advanced bike.

At a year of riding and now over 10k miles (thus far with only a "kickstand" incident), I feel comfortable enough with the idea of something a little more advanced, BUT recognize at the same time it is ONLY a year and 10k miles, and all my experience is on a SMALL (albeit wonderful) bike. ALSO since the agreement with the wife requires the 250r be paid of BEFORE seriously looking for another one (smart woman she is), and this years finances didn't go as planned, by the time I am actually looking to "pull the trigger" I anticipate at least 2 years of experience and over 20k miles under my belt.

For my first 9 months, I thought I would want something a little more stretched out, but was intimidated by super-sport bikes, and knew this would NOT be a good fit for me. The 650r has always been the next natural choice, as it has more power, but isn't a crazy super-sport. I was thinking about the aftermarket sport bars to get a "sportier" position. I did sit on the SV650 and other Suzuki's, but didn't feel comfortable on any of them or didn't like something about them.

After about 9 months, I had done enough little day-rides to have my adult side override my adolescent side, and I began to value more the relaxed position that the 250r, and more so the 650r offers (with added adjustability), and decided NOT to lower the bars on a second bike.

The 650r is currently at the top of my upgrade list for the following reasons:
-More power (manageable, not crazy)
-Price tag (not cheap, but not expensive either... close to my breaking point though)
- Size and weight (not that much more to readjust to)
-Sexy sport bike looks (09 model)
-Next natural step-up from 250r (same family, assuming similar characteristics)
-Still maneuverable in traffic and twisties (no first-hand knowledge on that)
-Comfortable posture (haven't found an 09, but based on 08)
The only thing I really don't like about it from what I know about it now, is the new gauge cluster looks retarded. Looks like a great bike, but I wonder if it will make me fully happy.

Now here is where I am trying to work through fantasy and reality.... then I see the Honda Interceptor (VFR800)! Here are the points on the Interceptor as I understand them (as compared to the 650r):
-A little more $$
-A little heavier
-Bigger displacement (probably more than I would ever need, but wondering if the V4 would make it more manageable than an inline 4 super bike)
-Sport touring posture
-Available ABS
-Classified as a touring bike, not super sport (insurance)
-My adolescent side likes all the sexiness it has to offer (exhaust, single-side swing arm, etc).

This is where my knowledge and experience ends.
Does anyone have experience on the Interceptor? Can you comment on its friendliness as a second bike after a 250r? Anything else I hadn't thought of?
If I was comfortable on it and had the finances together, I don't think I would look twice at the 650r..... your thoughts?

Sorry for not being able to say all this in fewer words.

[CC Cowboy]

Interceptors are nice bikes. I have many miles on the one I have. I love the V4. It's easy to ride, it's comfortable, it's reliable, it sounds great, I'm just not crazy about the look of the new one.

[Alex]

Personally, I think the 650R is a great bike and a great deal. I think Honda has lost its way with the Interceptor, and don't think the current gen bike (2002 to 2009, believe it or not) is worth anywhere near what they ask for it. Back in the mid 80's to mid 90's Honda put all of its latest and greatest tech on the Interceptor, and it won comparison after comparison for being the best all-around bike on the planet.

But with the 1998 revision, and more so with the 2002 revision, it just hasn't kept pace with the progress that the rest of the motorcycling world has made. It was out of date in 2002, and now it's 7 years later and there hasn't been a single significant change to the bike since. The engine is overly complex, with a VTEC head whose frequent valve adjustments cost $1200 at dealer rates, and are almost impossible for the home mechanic due to the special tools required. And riders end up not liking the step in the torque curve that the feature adds, and even with it the bike is woefully underpowered. Less than 100 hp at the rear wheel from an 800cc V4 with advanced valve timing on it? When every 600cc bike on the planet is pushing 100 hp, and suzuki is getting 135 hp from a 750cc inline 4.

Its suspension is old-tech, soft, and sloppy out of the box. It's non-adjustable up front, with a middle of the road shock in back, and the chassis itself is no longer as stiff as one would like once the pace wicks up.

All of this gets forgiven when a bike is exceptionally inexpensive, as then riders can upgrade as they choose to the parts that aren't up to their liking without breaking the bank. But when Honda is asking significantly more money for the VFR, than their own CBR1K (with 70 more hp! along with top-of-the-line suspension and every other performance part), it just doesn't compute.

Looks like Honda has come to the same conclusion, and it's heavily rumored that the next VFR will be a 1200cc bike, making it much more of a GT bike like BMW's K1300S and the new Concours. Decent thread with pics here. If I had the VFR bug and just had to get one, I'd look for a low mileage 2003/2004-ish machine; it will be half the price, and look identical to a brand new one.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

Interceptors are nice bikes. I have many miles on the one I have. I love the V4. It's easy to ride, it's comfortable, it's reliable, it sounds great, I'm just not crazy about the look of the new one.

How would you describe the learning curve between the 250r and VFR800?

[headshrink]

That is very convincing Alex, Thanks!
It is really more money than I can spend (unless a great used find), but the maintanance is the one thing I didn't plan for when I got the 250r. I assumed motorcycles were like cars.... boy was I in for an education!

I am looking for an all-around bike, if one exists.

(still think I'll hang onto the 250r incase I like it better )

[Rayme]

I'm in the same boat as you, I want a sv650s (if I get another bike, its going to be that for sure). But at the same time my 250 is really all I need (reality). But also I'd like a ruckus lol... oh well. These decision are more of a money issue, if you want a bigger bike and you can afford it why not.

...just remember, alot of people who end up selling their 250R wishes they would have kept it.

[sharky nrk]

I can attest to the 650R being just about everything you mentioned

-The power is sufficient, with exceptional torquey feel. It's got a curve about it that allows for decent go without peaky in-your-face powerband that an i4 has
-When i was shopping the dealer wanted $6500 or so for current year model - with sales being the way they are now i imagine you could get a much better deal
- definately more room than on a 250 but still relatively slim in the mid section and easy enough to flat foot - is quite a bit heavier but its not really noticeable under power
-I actually prefer the pre-09s looks but either way its not a bad looking bike
-It feels just like a big 250 in about every way
-It is suprisingly compentent in the twisties and like anything else the aftermarket is there to fill in any short comings
-A little too upright with the stock bar - i imagine with a shorter bar would be the perfect blend of comfort and sport for an all arounder

the new cluster is retarded - and perhaps one thing that actually goes against it is that its so much like a big 250 that people upgrading from a 250 may not feel its "different enough" to satisfy them. i say ride it and see

[Daeldren]

Personally I would love to have another bike including the ninja down the road, buying a house first is a bigger priority for me though. One bike has caught my eye, but I haven't really seen anything on it yet. Its called the Fischer MRX650, only problem I see is that it uses the hyosung 650 engine but everything else on it looks and sounds top notch.

[komohana]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

Interceptors are nice bikes. I have many miles on the one I have. I love the V4. It's easy to ride, it's comfortable, it's reliable, it sounds great, I'm just not crazy about the look of the new one.

i'll have to second that one CC Cowboy. had one, loved it alot. really liked the powerband the V4's come to bed with. never had serious issues, plus they DO look great.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by komohana

i'll have to second that one CC Cowboy. had one, loved it alot. really liked the powerband the V4's come to bed with. never had serious issues, plus they DO look great.

Was your cost of ownership (maintanance) high?

[ninjabrewer]

If I went by looks, it would be the Triumph Daytona, hands down, (prefer the SE). That is my fantasy. My reality is I will be keeping the 250 probably for several years, for several reasons; 60 MPG, I need to get WAY more experience before I get more power at my wrist, 60 MPG, this one isn't paid for, 60 MPG, and I am really enjoying this one. Oh did I mention that since it gets around 60 MPG I can ride for a few hundred miles on 10 bucks, (which is the reason that I got the bike in the first place)

nb

[headshrink]

60 MPG.... I can't get better than 50ish. But then again, I like to push it a bit.

[kazam58]

haha, my exact reasoning. 60 mpg. Even after DJ needles and a K&N filter. If I want more power, I'll buy an aftermarket exhaust. I just wish I could ride it year round. Then it would really pay off

[ninjabrewer]

Originally Posted by headshrink

60 MPG.... I can't get better than 50ish. But then again, I like to push it a bit.

my worst so far has been in the low 50's, best 67, but I don't really push it real hard. Normal riding I shift around 6 or 7k. going down the interstate, (freeways here in socal) you just about have to be going 70-80 mph to keep from getting run over, she is screaming along around 10k or so. Haven't checked the milage after a tank of that yet.

nb

[komohana]

Originally Posted by headshrink

Was your cost of ownership (maintanance) high?

not particularly...i bought the bike locally spank'n new, but had a falling out with the dealer (who had at the time the only service dept. on island).
i happened to become tight with the mechanic that worked there though, and after getting my maintenance manual, he showed me how to perform most of the required stuff: valves (a pain till i did them several times), carb sync oil/filter...consumables...stuff like that.
in all honesty, the insurance back then was the most expensive part.
the bike did me well, and i didn't spend more for maint. than what i expected.
(did i mention this was in 1985?)

interceptor.jpeg

[Flashmonkey]

2005 Ninja 636....in blue preferably. 108hp of pure hooliganism.

I honestly wish that I could afford to keep my 250 AND get a larger bike, but that type of financial awesomeness evades me at this point. Besides, I plan on giving my little 250 to my cousin, who currently can't afford a bike because she's pretty much the sole provider for herself and her brother.

I am going to try and commute to work for a few weeks and see how I like that (I work in the downtown core and traffic is horrendous). If this is something I can see myself doing long-term....i may pick up an SV650 or a CBR600f4i instead. If i'm gonna have my butt planted on a bike for 2 hours fighting traffic, I may as well be reasonably comfortable.

[Cedilla]

Originally Posted by Daeldren

Personally I would love to have another bike including the ninja down the road, buying a house first is a bigger priority for me though. One bike has caught my eye, but I haven't really seen anything on it yet. Its called the Fischer MRX650, only problem I see is that it uses the hyosung 650 engine but everything else on it looks and sounds top notch.

I think the Hyosung uses the engine from the SV, but I could be wrong.
Also that bike looks very uncomfortable.

[AnarchoMoltov]

The only thing I dont like about the ninja 650 is the enormous hideous whale tail it has....lol

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by AnarchoMoltov

The only thing I dont like about the ninja 650 is the enormous hideous whale tail it has....lol

The windsheild?
That should be easy enough to rectify.

[AnarchoMoltov]

Originally Posted by headshrink

The windsheild?
That should be easy enough to rectify.

no the tail....look at the part u sit on itz huge and hideous....compared to the 250 and the zx6r

[Apex]

I've been wanting a bigger bike. By the look of several of my posts, you can see that.

That is why I signed up for a track day. It will show me just how much I don't know and how much more I can improve on my dinky 250. The want is just a want, not a need. Once I get a bit more track time under my belt, and I feel I need a new challenge, I shall upgrade...

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by AnarchoMoltov

no the tail....look at the part u sit on itz huge and hideous....compared to the 250 and the zx6r

Ahhh, yes.... it took me a little while to look past that too. I think it looks a little dated, but it is more functional than what we currently have.

[backinthesaddleagain]

Originally Posted by komohana

not particularly...i bought the bike locally spank'n new, but had a falling out with the dealer (who had at the time the only service dept. on island).
i happened to become tight with the mechanic that worked there though, and after getting my maintenance manual, he showed me how to perform most of the required stuff: valves (a pain till i did them several times), carb sync oil/filter...consumables...stuff like that.
in all honesty, the insurance back then was the most expensive part.
the bike did me well, and i didn't spend more for maint. than what i expected.
(did i mention this was in 1985?)

Attachment 2642

love the first generation V45 - from Freddy Spencer on the track to the dealers show room.

[komohana]

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

love the first generation V45 - from Freddy Spencer on the track to the dealers show room.

yep!

if i remember correctly, those 'ceptors were one of, if not THE first sportbikes to have a 16" front, 18" rear wheel size that made the bike ultra-flickable. the difference was stunning compared to a friend's older CB 750 that had almost the opposite set up. although it felt like transition from side to side was much quicker, the CB always felt 'solid' and planted with the larger front wheel

...memories...

[xTKx]

Originally Posted by Cedilla

I think the Hyosung uses the engine from the SV, but I could be wrong.
Also that bike looks very uncomfortable.

+1
Not to mention the fact that the undertail exhaust looks horrible. Not sure if that's a bad angle or if that thing looks like it wasn't correctly installed :/

Anyone who knows the history I had with my first bike knows that I am not a fan of China bikes... YUCK!

[AnarchoMoltov]

Originally Posted by Cedilla

I think the Hyosung uses the engine from the SV, but I could be wrong.
Also that bike looks very uncomfortable.

Fischer MRX is powered by Suzukis SV650 v-twin

[Alex]

It's a Hyosung-sourced motor, that has many similarities to the SV mill. The history of the SV engine is a little cluttered, and in fact Hyosung was involved with it from very early on, and there are even some parts that are interchangeable, but they are not identical.

[headshrink]

It is looking like the VFR is going to remain "fantasy" for me, as will the 650r..... darn economy is taking clients away - grrrrr....

Although the 650r does look more "practical" for me at this point (when able to upgrade).
So aside from the cost and maintenance, would the VFR800 be considered a more advanced bike (rider skill), or "upgrade" from the 650r?

I guess no one says the 650r has to be my last, as my first few cars weren't the last

[Alex]

I don't think the VFR or the 650R would require any difference in base skills to operate. A newish rider with moderate skills could happily operate either one with zero issues; there's no feature or quality about either bike that I can think of that would make one more challenging than the other in any way.

[sharky nrk]

Originally Posted by AnarchoMoltov

no the tail....look at the part u sit on itz huge and hideous....compared to the 250 and the zx6r

doesn't look nearly as bad with a cowl style cover for what its worth

[CC Cowboy]

Originally Posted by komohana

not particularly...i bought the bike locally spank'n new, but had a falling out with the dealer (who had at the time the only service dept. on island).
i happened to become tight with the mechanic that worked there though, and after getting my maintenance manual, he showed me how to perform most of the required stuff: valves (a pain till i did them several times), carb sync oil/filter...consumables...stuff like that.
in all honesty, the insurance back then was the most expensive part.
the bike did me well, and i didn't spend more for maint. than what i expected.
(did i mention this was in 1985?)



Attachment 2642

I still have my 83 and it runs like a dream. I rode it hard back in 83 and 84 (track only), stored it until about 3 years ago, changed the oil and bought a new battery, it started right up and is still running strong.

Originally Posted by backinthesaddleagain

love the first generation V45 - from Freddy Spencer on the track to the dealers show room.

The only problem with the 1st generation was the oil pressure to the top end (luckily I used synthetic from the start) and it has a hydraulic clutch.

Originally Posted by headshrink

Was your cost of ownership (maintanance) high?

Very low maintainence on the older ones. A friend of mine had a new one and she didn't have any problems but she got rid of it for a full on cruiser.

[CC Cowboy]

OK, it's official, I love the new V4 Honda





I think it might be a concept. Those tires don't look real but I don't care I think it's one sexy bitch (if you can say that without getting in trouble).

[muffinman]

Originally Posted by Daeldren

Personally I would love to have another bike including the ninja down the road, buying a house first is a bigger priority for me though. One bike has caught my eye, but I haven't really seen anything on it yet. Its called the Fischer MRX650, only problem I see is that it uses the hyosung 650 engine but everything else on it looks and sounds top notch.

Oh, yeah, I heard about the Fischer... thought it was going the way of vaporware but they seem to be making some real progress. Awesome components, and if it's the same V-Twin from the SV650, it'll be "noob-friendly" as well.

.. but damn, that tank looks painful.

[beowuff]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

OK, it's official, I love the new V4 Honda.

Here's a link to some spy shots of the 2010 Interceptor. It's 1200cc and is supposed to be based off that prototype you like.

http://www.motorcyclenews.com/MCN/Ne...spied-on-test/

[CC Cowboy]

I'm not impressed with that look.

Remember months ago Honda said they were going to build a V5 that was trick.

Well back to Ducati for all my love.

[Apex]

VFR = Very Fat Ride

Fat = costly and porky


No thanks! Though the current model does look nice and comfortable.

[Daeldren]

Well after sitting on several different bikes yesterday at the dealership I have come to the realization that most of the SS bikes are way to tall for me. It has come down to the CBR or the SV650SF, so Im thinking the CBR may be the next upgrade for me if I ever do want a bigger bike in the stable. Chances are Ill probably wait till I have a house first and save up the money to pay cash on a used one. Of course when I get the ninjette later this year its staying, it will most likely be my daily ride.

[CC Cowboy]

Originally Posted by Daeldren

Well after sitting on several different bikes yesterday at the dealership I have come to the realization that most of the SS bikes are way to tall for me. It has come down to the CBR or the SV650SF, so Im thinking the CBR may be the next upgrade for me if I ever do want a bigger bike in the stable. Chances are Ill probably wait till I have a house first and save up the money to pay cash on a used one. Of course when I get the ninjette later this year its staying, it will most likely be my daily ride.

How far off is the house?

[Daeldren]

How far off is the house?

It's quite a ways off right now, I would be a lot closer to that goal if the job market was more stable at the moment, but Im hoping things will start looking better towards the end of the year.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by Daeldren

Well after sitting on several different bikes yesterday at the dealership I have come to the realization that most of the SS bikes are way to tall for me. It has come down to the CBR or the SV650SF, so Im thinking the CBR may be the next upgrade for me if I ever do want a bigger bike in the stable. Chances are Ill probably wait till I have a house first and save up the money to pay cash on a used one. Of course when I get the ninjette later this year its staying, it will most likely be my daily ride.

At the dealership the CBR was way more comfortable for me.... BUT I bet on the road it wouldn't be since it is more agressive. I concure that the SV was taller than I expected. Also, ever notice how much bigger the SS ninjas are to the GSXRs and CBRs? I feel like I can actually ride those two, but the SS ninjas are just scary.