Bike not running, too much oil?

[lstat]

Hey guys, quick question for all the experts! I am currently trying to help a family member find a motorcycle, he found a good one (we think) that would be a great rebuild/project. The guys has a 1996 ninja 250 that is "not currently running", he says he "put to much oil in it, after it is flushed and filled it will be fine." I am no engine expert but I wanted to get another opinion and see what you guys thought before he bites the bullet and goes to get it. Could this really be the problem or is it more of a common Craigslist issue of "hide the big details and just get rid of it" type thing?

Thanks for any help!

[alex.s]

a little bit too much oil isnt going to keep it from running. extra oil would simply sit higher up in the bottom of the crank case and the gears would be more filled with it. it would not cause extra oil to go up in the cylinder or anything like that. the oil pump controls how much oil goes to the top of the engine and adding too much oil would not change that, unless the engine was literally filled to the top. which i doubt. if that was the case, and too much oil actually is keeping it from running, the engine is probably useless and has grenaded internals.

whats more likely is the person didnt know what they were talking about and the bike has some clogged carbs and needs a valve adjustment.

on the plus, draining some oil out, or even doing a full oil change takes all of 5 minutes. have someone who knows what they are looking at look at the bike.

[Motofool]

I agree with Alex.

With the spark plugs removed, the engine should be able of turn by hand (wrench on the generator end) or by pushing the bike.

[Stingray1000]

When I purchased my bike everytime I ran it oil would spill out of the top of the bike under the seat. I couldn't figure out what the issue was and a friend told me to drain the oil (one plug) and put it back in as per the sight glass on the side of the back standing straight up ( as per the manual) This fixed my problem and when I took the oil out it was about a quart over full (which is alot for the bike) but the bike ran perfectly other then the spewing oil after I stopped it.... So to answer your question I highly doubt too much oil would cause the bike not to start....

[lstat]

I really figured that to much oil would not keep it from starting, I have seen odder, though! Ill do some investigating and see if I can figure out exactly what is wrong for sure. If it is not anything TO major it will be a perfect buy!

[n4mwd]

Another thing to consider is that sometimes the petcocks will fail which fills the crankcase with gasoline. Easy check. Just smell the oil for gas.

As far as buying the bike, it depends on the price. If there isn't that much wrong with it, you have to wonder why the seller didn't just fix it himself. Obviously a running bike is going to sell for more money than a non-running bike.

But as a general rule for Ninjas, if the engine will turn over at all, it is usually pretty easy and cheap to get it running. About 90% of the time, its clogged carbs.

[lstat]

The petcock would probably be a great place to start looking for the issue, I will definitely take note of that. The guy is only asking $500 for the bike, that is great but at the same time it really makes me leery. My cousin is looking for cheap and he likes the idea of a project because it is something he will be more likely to keep in the long run, much more value that way The really big question, unfortunately, is whether or not the engine does in fact turn over. If it is grenaded then it will probably not be the number one choice any longer.

So far the petcock and carbs are the two things I will be looking at first, I will get ahold of the guy and start asking questions. Ill post both q/a here to get your opinions! I really appreciate the help, guys!

[n4mwd]

its only worth 500 dollars if it has all its plastic. I wouldn't pay any more than that for a bike that doesn't run. I would also take a spare battery along with me to use it to turn the bike over. with bikes like that, they always say the battery is dead.

[lstat]

It looks like he has revised the ad, I went to copy it for you guys to check out and the description is NOT what I have been looking at the last few days! As far as it goes now (his words), all the bike needs is a battery to run.

It looks like all the fairings are there, it needs mirrors and a headlight, but thats all I can really tell in the photos. Check them out and let me know if I am missing anything!


http://fortsmith.craigslist.org/mcy/3011492853.html

Edit:
Looks like it has headlights, but they are...not good! Good temporarily I suppose.

[n4mwd]

Well, that's a tough one. A bike like that looks abused. The first thing I would ask him is if he has clear title to it.

Here is what I noticed... No headlight or headlight brackets. Mirrors missing. Rear tail light missing. Rear fender missing. Cargo hooks missing. Rear turn signals missing. Mufflers look like someone took a hacksaw to them and shortened them. Missing decals (indicate that the bike was wrecked and repainted previously). Seat ripped in rear. If that's all that's wrong with it, you could probably buy most of the replacement parts on ebay for about $300.

Since he obviously took a hit in the front (missing headlight) I would take a close look at the forks. You should be able to take a perfectly flat board and place it flat across the upper struts of the fork and have it lay perfectly flat.

Any accident can also bend the frame. Unfortunately, its often hard to tell with all the plastic on there. But a giveaway is that parts fit tight on one side and loose on the other or when the bike is on its center stand with the front wheel forward, the bike looks cocked when viewed from the front. Note the center stand looks missing as well in the photo.

I would only pay $500 for that bike if I was desperate. I suggest you offer $300 but only if it runs (you bring the battery or one of these things). I wouldn't give a dime for it if he hasn't got clear title.

The damaged plastics cut into the price a little, but since they are all mostly there, its not much of a hit. They are expensive to replace, but they can be repaired with plastifix or JB weld pretty easy. The frame, forks and triple tree are biggies that you need to look out for.

In any case, this is clearly a project bike and not a bike that is ready to ride.

[lstat]

Thanks for all the info, N4mwd! That is exactly what I was looking for!

I will call him tomorrow and get a few more details, I think we may take a trip this week to go and check it out in person. Do the pregen and new gen ninjas use the same batteries? Is this a stupid question? If they do I will simply take the battery out of my 2009 to take with us. Again, I know its rough, but it would be an excellent project; after seeing all the things N4mwd could point out I am a little worried about it now. $300 sounds like a good price, I will definitely run that by and see what we can do! If we can get it started and running ill take it around the block and see if it is even worth the time and energy.

[n4mwd]

Maybe take two quarts of 10w-40 just in case. He may have drained the oil just to have an excuse not to let you ride it. But if you do get to ride it, you might be able to feel fork and frame damage - maybe.

But remember, no title = no deal. The bike looks like its seen a lot of dirt roads and as such, might not be titled. Also, I would be weary of a salvage title if it has that. I don't know the laws where you live, but sometimes there are problems getting a tag if you have a salvage title.

Oh, that's another thing that was missing - the tag and tag holder.

PS - the guy has several other bikes in the photos. I would take that as proof that he does know what he's doing. So watch out if it looks like he's playing dumb.

[lstat]

Thank you again for the tips. I am new to the whole motorcycle scene so I am not sure as far as the tags/title go. I will have to check into that to, I suppose!

So definitely ask about the title, take a battery, oil, feel and look for bends to the frame/forks, and definitely be on my toes with questions. Lets see how it goes over the phone tomorrow :thumb up: wish me luck, maybe it will turn into an 'okay' buy!

[Motofool]

Very good advice from D.

Wish you luck!

[n4mwd]

Another thing. Be familiar with the laws in your state as to whether they require a notary to transfer a title. Some states do, and some don't. So that's another question, if he has the title, find out what state it was issued in and look up the laws regarding title transfers before you go over there.

Another member here, Jono, bought a used frame and title to repair his bike that was damaged. The frame is the part of the bike that actually has the title. He completely finished the repairs and then when he got to the tag office, they refused the title because the state it was issued in required a notary and it wasn't notarized - and the seller had left town.

Anyhow, good luck with it.

[Skippii]

If you're driving there, don't bother with a spare battery and just bring jumper cables.
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[alex.s]

keep in mind, with a project bike you are always fixing something. some insane masochistic people like that, some people dont.