ECOTRONS EFI Kit Question

[patriots21]

Good day to all, this is my first time posting here so please forgive me If I violate any of the forum rules we have here. I was just wondering if any anybody has ever attempted to communicate with any ECU using a microcontroller and then display real time data on an LCD display, think of a cycle analyst for e-bike enthusiasts.

This seems perfectly doable with the megasquirt EFI kit as they have provided information about the RS232 commands that can actually be used to communicate with the ECU as can be seen here: http://www.msextra.com/doc/ms1extra/COM_RS232.htm

The problem is, I'm using the ECOTRONS EFI kit which I can't seem to find any information on. I've managed to crack down what the ProCal tuning software sends to the ECU whenever it is connected, however I've no idea how to interpret the data that it throws back at me. I mean, which is the data for the battery voltage, which is for the tps: it's just a continuous stream of bytes coming out the ECU, and I am going nuts searching for any more information out here on the web. May be somebody here has already done this. Any insightful suggestion would be helpful as well.

[Scattcatt]

Welcome to Ninjette!

I'm not quite sure I completely understand the problem, you can display some real time information when you press the "play" button while connected. I'm sure you already know this though. What information in particular are you trying to look at?

I'm also assuming that your second question comes from the analysis charts, correct? Did you receive the PDF's for ProCAL with your CD? They help explain some of the things IF this is what your question relates to. I'm not really sure yet so I'm just trying to get on the same page as you.

You could always email Matt from Ecotrons too for help, he's been wonderful for those of us on this forum that have purchased the kit from him.

[Super-Tune]

Is Matt replying to anyone's e-mails or phone calls?

[Scattcatt]

Yes, mine.

[Super-Tune]

Thanks, that's all I needed to hear.

[Scattcatt]

Why not contribute to the forum and help this new member out if you have any helpful insight?

[patriots21]

Thanks for the quick reply. I mean being able to communicate with the ECU without using a computer/laptop and the ProCal tuning software. I want to be on a bike, without a laptop of course, and still be able to monitor most of the important variables by displaying their values on an LCD. The microcontroller would pretty much be the device that communicates with the ECU. I'm pretty sure most people wouldn't bother with something like this, but this is something I really want to do.

[Scattcatt]

So if you had something like an iPad or iTouch that you could connect and stuff in the dash or something that would give you what you're looking for? (Not a bad idea by the way, a ProCAL app for an iPod or something would be pretty sick to have!)

I don't really see an easy way around it though, as far as I know, ProCAL requires Windows XP or later, so you'd essentially need a tiny PC to mount on the dash or something. I think I've heard of some smart phones that run off of Windows OS's, but that's beyond me, I still use a hybrid dumb/smart phone.

The cable I personally don't think is a big problem, I'm sure you could wire it internally and have it come out up by the dash pretty easily.

[flynjay]

Originally Posted by patriots21

Thanks for the quick reply. I mean being able to communicate with the ECU without using a computer/laptop and the ProCal tuning software. I want to be on a bike, without a laptop of course, and still be able to monitor most of the important variables by displaying their values on an LCD. The microcontroller would pretty much be the device that communicates with the ECU. I'm pretty sure most people wouldn't bother with something like this, but this is something I really want to do.

I believe the language that comes out of the ECU is proprietary to Ecotrons. The best person to answer your questions is Matt @ecotrons.

[Scattcatt]

^ +1

[patriots21]

Alright, going to have to send him a message. Thanks guys.

[Super-Tune]

Originally Posted by Scattcatt

Why not contribute to the forum and help this new member out if you have any helpful insight?

It's not my system but I can say what he wants to do is not possible due to the lack of protocol being used. I have a full OBDII system but it is for 2 strokes only that can send your data to a smart phone via Bluetooth so there are systems out there that can do what he is asking.

Being proprietary has its draw backs.

[patriots21]

Just to clear things out, I don't really plan on using a smart phone. I don't even need to run ProCal on anything. I just need to know how the ECU communicates with ProCal so that I can mimic the communication using a microcontroller and then use the microcontroller to interpret and display the data I obtain from the ECU, completely without the use of ProCal. The LCD I'm talking about is as simple as this: http://www.superdroidrobots.com/images/LCD-011-000.jpg

But I believe you're right, unless I can find out how the ECU and ProCal communicates, which is pretty much known only to the guys from ECOTRONS,
I'm pretty much stuck. So good luck to me, I'm hoping I can get some sort of reply from them.

[setasai]

Correct me if I'm wrong but from what I understand, ProCAL isnt unique to ecotrons. It's just software that can be used to manage and control calibrations. The firmware uploader that ecotrons uses isnt unique either I dont think. Ecotrons just needs to modify the software to fit their ECU.

http://www.primetechpa.com/ is the original calibration software before it is modified for the EFI kit.

Maybe between Matt and the original company, you can come up with some kind of slim down version. I think they use the older version of procal too so it might be even simpler than you think.

[Super-Tune]

Originally Posted by setasai

http://www.primetechpa.com/ is the original calibration software before it is modified for the EFI kit.

Thanks for the link. I have e-mails from Matt stating it is his software, he wrote ProCal and it cannot be redistributed without his permission.

More lies :-)

[setasai]

It IS his software. He purchased the license from them and together they modified it to fit his company's needs. You are free to purchase your own license of ProCAL and get it adapted to your own ECU for your own calibration purposes but once it's been adapted, it's yours and if you choose not to freely distribute it, then it is your choice.

For all intensive purposes, he wrote the guts of ProCAL that makes it tailored to his company. I wouldnt call it a lie since you do need his permission to redistribute his particular version.

In anycase, not important. I just hope this information helps the OP do something very cool. I would love to have a LCD on my bike display everything about the ECU and the way it runs so I can keep an eye on it at any point in time.

[ecotrons]

Ecotrons ECU and ProCAL software follow the automotive standard protocols: ASAM / ASAP2:

http://www.asam.net/nc/home/standard...%5D=531&start=

It is a far more powerful protocol than the OBDII generic scan tool protocol. It can be very sophisticate and also be very simple depending on your implementation.
It has been widely used by professinoal OEMs and suppliers.
Ecotrons EFI system may be the only one in the aftermarket that uses it.

As long as the confidentiality can be assured, and the supporting efforts are reasonable, Ecotrons are willing to support customers to develop add-on features based on the protocols.

[patriots21]

Originally Posted by ecotrons

Ecotrons ECU and ProCAL software follow the automotive standard protocols: ASAM / ASAP2:

http://www.asam.net/nc/home/standard...%5D=531&start=

It is a far more powerful protocol than the OBDII generic scan tool protocol. It can be very sophisticate and also be very simple depending on your implementation.
It has been widely used by professinoal OEMs and suppliers.
Ecotrons EFI system may be the only one in the aftermarket that uses it.

As long as the confidentiality can be assured, and the supporting efforts are reasonable, Ecotrons are willing to support customers to develop add-on features based on the protocols.

Thanks for taking the time to write a reply. Entirely new to the ASAP2 standard here, but does this mean that this ASAP2 standard governs the actual physical communication that happens via the kit's serial cable? I'm just kind of confused, because as far as my brain is telling me, which would tell you how little I actually know about ECU communications, what goes through the kit's serial cable are RS-232 signals. Right now, it seems to me that ASAP2 is some sort of a higher layer standard which runs over some physical serial communication standard such as RS-232.

As you may observe, I'm quite confused at the moment but thanks for the great lead anyway. Going to have to do a lot of reading. By the way, in what way do you say can you be assured of confidentiality, given that you guys are willing to provide support. I sent you a message here by the way.

[ecotrons]

Originally Posted by patriots21

Thanks for taking the time to write a reply. Entirely new to the ASAP2 standard here, but does this mean that this ASAP2 standard governs the actual physical communication that happens via the kit's serial cable? I'm just kind of confused, because as far as my brain is telling me, which would tell you how little I actually know about ECU communications, what goes through the kit's serial cable are RS-232 signals. Right now, it seems to me that ASAP2 is some sort of a higher layer standard which runs over some physical serial communication standard such as RS-232.

As you may observe, I'm quite confused at the moment but thanks for the great lead anyway. Going to have to do a lot of reading. By the way, in what way do you say can you be assured of confidentiality, given that you guys are willing to provide support. I sent you a message here by the way.

ASAP2 protocols work on many physical communication hardware. Serial RS232 is one of the them. The key is to parse the data in the application layer. We can talk more details in Emails. As many guys here don't care too much about these kind of details.

[patriots21]

Originally Posted by ecotrons

ASAP2 protocols work on many physical communication hardware. Serial RS232 is one of the them. The key is to parse the data in the application layer. We can talk more details in Emails. As many guys here don't care too much about these kind of details.

Understood. Will be contacting you via your g-mail.

[bigbadbob]

I want to undestand more about this too, A digital dash would be cool to do.

according to Ecotrons manual-

Chapter 12
Broadcast protocol via serial cable
You can read some parameters of engine from the RS232 serial cable by using your equipment.
So we provide the protocol to you for using this function.
Variables: RPM, MAP, TPS, ECT, IAT, O2S, SPARK, FUELPW1, FUELPW1, UbAdc
.
Note: Enable the broadcast data function; please tune the CV_APP to be 128, then burn to ECU.
Calibration: CV_APP=128
If you don’t have this variable, please connect us.
The data format is hex, the baud rate is 115200, no parity bit, 8 data bits, 1 stop bit, time interval 100ms.
The data packages is
(Buf[27])
:
80 8F EA 16 50 08 (header)
00 00 6D 90 0F 00 0A 00 0A C0 00 5C 00 28 00 00 00 00 08 6F (data)
42 (checksum)

00 00 (RPM)
Buf[6] Buf[7]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + Low byte)/4
6D 90 (MAP)
Buf[8] Buf[9]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/256
0F 00 (TPS)
Buf[10] Buf[11]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/655.36
0A 00 (ECT)
Buf[12] Buf[13]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)-40
0A C0 (IAT)
Buf[14] Buf[15]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)-40
00 5C (O2S)
Buf[16] Buf[17]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/204.8
00 28 (SPARK)
Buf[18] Buf[19]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/2
00 00 (FUELPW1)
Buf[20] Buf[21]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/1000
00 00 (FUELPW2)
Buf[22] Buf[23]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/1000
08 6F(UbAdc）
Buf[24] Buf[25]
Physical value = ((high byte)*256 + low byte)/160

This is a good start.
I hooked up the pc to serial port and tried monitoring the data, all I get is "ECOTRONS LLC COPRIGHT" at power up, no data stream.
But I don't have Calibration: CV_APP=128 so That's stopped it for me but maybe this will help someone else.