October 9th, 2014, 02:33 PM | #41 |
Que Buenos Son!!!
Name: Ryan
Location: Grovetucky, OH
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Glad that there was nothing wrong with the engine and that you found the problem. Hopefully the threads in the head aren't too stripped and you won't have any more problems.
When I had this happen I was in the middle of a two and a half hour trip. Luckily I was able to coast to a stop in a gas station parking lot and I had enough experience working on the bike to fix the problem. Had to use the stock tool kit to take off the tank and find the problem. Once I found the loose plug though and fixed it I've had no problems since. I'm not really sure why the plug popped out that day, and why it took over an hour of riding before it popped. I guess I didn't have it tightened all the way.
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October 9th, 2014, 02:57 PM | #42 |
Wrench wench
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Hahaha, it must be something about the nocturne blue ninjas I'll try the carb cleaner + grease thing, sounds like a good idea. Thanks a lot for the help, everyone.
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October 9th, 2014, 03:18 PM | #43 | |
wat
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Quote:
if you spray carb cleaner in your engine, you must change the oil after.
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October 9th, 2014, 03:19 PM | #44 |
Wrench wench
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Well nuts to that then, I just changed the oil 100 miles ago If it's soot I should be able to just thread through it...
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October 9th, 2014, 05:05 PM | #45 |
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FWIW, when mine did this, the plug was not loose to start, and it also threaded the whole way down to the crush washer. Then it blew out after a mile on a test ride.
Soooooo just saying, as encouraging as it may look, you're not out of the woods yet. |
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October 9th, 2014, 05:13 PM | #46 |
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October 9th, 2014, 05:16 PM | #47 |
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Alllls I know is that my plug blew out, wouldn't hold a plug anymore in the threads and needed to be helicoiled to have threads that worked. Metal fatigue in the threads from compression cycles maybe? |
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October 9th, 2014, 05:19 PM | #48 |
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Ok. That makes sense: the threads got horked up.
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October 9th, 2014, 05:45 PM | #50 |
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I mean say what you want. It's possible. I never touched those before they blew out.
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October 9th, 2014, 06:12 PM | #51 |
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A good rule of thumb for tightness is never more than would snap a pencil if you were using it as the tommy bar.
A bit less in fact on these small threads. A new crush washer each time is a good idea if you can source a stock of them for your toolkit |
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October 9th, 2014, 07:33 PM | #52 | |
Rev Limiter
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Quote:
If any did get into the oil I would expect it would evaporate quickly (even at room temperature), or would burn-off immediately as the engine and oil temp rose. |
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October 12th, 2014, 12:45 PM | #53 |
Wrench wench
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****ing **** ****** piece of **** **** stupid god damn ****
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October 12th, 2014, 01:42 PM | #54 |
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October 12th, 2014, 01:46 PM | #55 |
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October 12th, 2014, 02:01 PM | #56 |
Wrench wench
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No way am I tapping it myself. For me that's the line in the sand for DIY maintenance. I'll see how much it'll cost at a shop and if it's too much... maybe I'll just sell it for cheap. Been elbow deep in bike guts like all summer this year, completely sick of it. Thinking about moving up for a while now anyways.
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October 12th, 2014, 03:27 PM | #57 |
ninjette.org sage
Name: bob
Location: Earf
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Most places won't charge too much to insert the helicoil.
Last futzed with by agentbad; October 13th, 2014 at 04:10 AM. |
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October 12th, 2014, 03:40 PM | #58 |
Wrench wench
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Absolutely not. NGK CR8HSA. Engine end of the plug itself was fine.
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October 12th, 2014, 04:03 PM | #59 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
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OK once the shock has passed and we get into solution mode the questions are
1 Helicoil vs eBay Head, the basic heads minus cams and rockers are around $100 2 Being on a budget, Can you get away with the old head gasket? 3 Is what people say about having to keep the bearing caps that came with the head true or is it more "overreaction theater" of which we see rather too much here (no names, no pack drill ) (Many ebay heads do not have the caps and we know yours are good,) It's counteruntuitive but the caps actually take most of the working pressure,not the head side because the forces are upward Can anyone who has used bearing caps from a different head let us know if it went okay? |
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October 12th, 2014, 04:05 PM | #60 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
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I'll ask around and see what a shop would charge for helicoiling the head if I bring it in. That way I'll have all the parts that have broken in with the same engine, won't have to tow it to the shop, etc.
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October 12th, 2014, 04:40 PM | #61 |
Participant
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If you're taking the head off, take it to a machine shop (not a motorcycle shop). Probably around $50... Buy a new head gasket! You'll be fine.
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October 12th, 2014, 05:04 PM | #62 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Nick
Location: TN
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Yep machine shop, or just re-thread for larger diameter plugs.
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October 12th, 2014, 05:38 PM | #63 |
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Truth. Machine shop all the way. Or ask around with your friends. If you have a friend who's a machinist in another industry, that's something they could do in their break times for a day or two. Simple for them.
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October 12th, 2014, 06:02 PM | #64 |
.
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October 12th, 2014, 06:07 PM | #65 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
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Search is giving me a lot of unrelated threads - would anyone happen to know of a build thread here/anywhere else online on how to remove the head? I only know how to take off the cover Preferably something with a million pictures.
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October 12th, 2014, 06:17 PM | #66 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
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Point?
It's mutually beneficial. You get a small repair that requires the help of a machinist. They get $50 or a couple nice beers or a gift card for dinner out. I never said you shouldn't repay the guy/gal. I just said that the OP should ask around because it's not like the repair would require hours and hours of labor. It's a simple task that could totally be covered by a friendly favor. I see nothing wrong with asking a favor and/or compensating a skilled person for a little help in their off time. Heck, a lot of union guys would do it on their clock time for you |
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October 12th, 2014, 06:19 PM | #67 |
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Hell, I could do it on the mill and it would take about an hour. But you don't want to ship a head to me and compensate me for my time. I'm expensive.
No need to be negative Mrsatom. |
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October 12th, 2014, 06:22 PM | #68 |
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October 12th, 2014, 06:33 PM | #69 | ||
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Quote:
Quote:
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October 12th, 2014, 06:41 PM | #70 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
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No biggie, I also inferred a little more snark in your response than was intended, apparently. My apologies as well.
My school is in farmville, NW OH. I have friends who farm. Farmers are famous for trading favors. If someone does us a favor, we always try to repay them, even if it's just a simple, "we'll help you with X next time you need it" or "come over for dinner!", etc. Everyone on campus who knows me knows that I do bicycle repair in return for a beer or two. |
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October 12th, 2014, 06:48 PM | #71 | |
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Quote:
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October 12th, 2014, 07:04 PM | #72 |
Participant
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Take it to an automotive machine shop. Have them put in a helicoil or keensert whose inner diameter matches the threads of the correct plug.
I recommend avoiding saving a couple of bucks and just having bigger diameter threads put in, as you'd have to buy a weird-ass spark plug for the rest of time. The miser pays the most. |
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October 13th, 2014, 01:59 AM | #73 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: harry
Location: Central Florida
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The truth about cylinder heads. The cam caps/cylinder head are align bored when they are made. IF you can use a cap from one head, and have it match correctly on another, it is either a miracle, or a marvel of production precision.
I hate it when IDIOTS take a head off and actually believe they need to part it down to the last fracking screw. MORONS!!!!! (For auction today we have a cam cap bolt from a good running XXXXXX, please view the video). The same idiots try to sell used rod bolts from a broken rod. Guess there really is a sucker born every minute. Back to the plug problem. I have fixed many stripped plug holes over the years. The best approach for you would be to have it done professionally, except the cost may outweigh the value of the thing at his point. It is POSSIBLE to use a grease coated tap with the head still on. It takes some though (must be at TDC compression to make sure the valves are closed), and you run the risk of a piece of metal ending up stuck under a valve, but there is a good chance the crap will just blow through when you fire it back up. And Heli-coil is definitely NOT the best repair. Timeserts, correctly installed are better than the original threads since it is a solid insert rather than a "spring". Be especially wary of "Helicoil" knock-offs.
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October 13th, 2014, 08:28 AM | #74 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
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Yeah, this is my #1 problem with this whole ordeal. Bike's value is already low due to beat up fairings, even though the bike itself works fine (until this BS happened) and was prob better taken care of than 99% of ninjas on the local CL.
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October 13th, 2014, 08:58 AM | #75 |
Rev Limiter
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Location: WI
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October 13th, 2014, 12:29 PM | #76 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
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I'm with you on the timeserts I have heard of HCs screwing out with the plug, which is why a larger plug recut also looks promising |
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October 13th, 2014, 02:11 PM | #77 | |
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I do completely agree though. Do not buy something that is not name brand for this application. IE, if you're looking to use a helicoil product, but a Helicoil brand part, same goes for Timeserts. This is not a place to skip. |
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October 21st, 2014, 08:42 AM | #78 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
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Well, it's been at @Finesse 's shop getting tapped... they finished the tap, fired it up, and it sounds awful. Either a shaving fell in or the piston slammed the plug or somesuch. Rip bike.
Incidentally, who wants a rolling chassis |
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October 21st, 2014, 09:23 AM | #79 |
ninjette.org guru
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Sorry to hear that. Is a replacement engine an option?
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October 21st, 2014, 09:27 AM | #80 |
Wrench wench
Name: The Stigette
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Nah, it's just absolutely not worth it at this point. Bike worked well before this, but my fairings were traaashed, so it wouldn't have sold for much anyway. Maybe like 1200. No engines nearby, so I'd have to buy one off ebay, which is like 500 with shipping. I'll either sell it as a rolling chassis or tear it down and sell it part by part.
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