Guinea Pigs needed for New BRT ignition testing

[ztrack157]

The new non programmable BRT is here. Come with two maps preloaded and a rev limit set at 15000.


91-92 octane ie premium is desire. I just want to find out what some people think about it and which octanes like 87, 89, 91 it will run happily on.


These will sell for about $210 maybe a little less. And I need about 3 or 4 people to try them out.

SPECIAL PRICE! $140

[Plasma]

Originally Posted by ztrack157

The new non programmable BRT is here. Come with two maps preloaded and a rev limit set at 15000.


91-92 octane ie premium is desire. I just want to find out what some people think about it and which octanes like 87, 89, 91 it will run happily on.


These will sell for about $210 maybe a little less. And I need about 3 or 4 people to try them out.

SPECIAL PRICE! $140

are u serious??????
can i return mine and buy this .....
;/
lol

[ztrack157]

LOL. NO! You already got the fully programmable for a massive discount.


These were literally just released and made available to me.

[Plasma]

Originally Posted by ztrack157

LOL. NO! You already got the fully programmable for a massive discount.


These were literally just released and made available to me.

true that ..didnt notice where it said it was NON programmable....
cool deal!
everyone should jump on this it is a steal!!

[Verus Cidere]

I'm assuming this is new gen only?

[ztrack157]

correct. unless you did some wiring mods.

[randomwalk101]

wow..this is a nice price. I'd like to sign up but have few questions first...
1) What's the mapping is like compared to stock?
2) Is there a remote flipping switch to change between map? It would be ideal to have a good map for 87 octane and 93 octane so we can flip back & forth.
3) what if this non-adjustable unit's map doesn't work (too much or too little advanced)? How do we fix it?

[ztrack157]

The mapping is better than stock. I need to ask BRT for the timing spots. I believe the unit comes with the same switch as the programable unit. 87 octane is not recommended but I want to see if it will function properly on it.

And I doubt there will be a to little adv issues. More than likely a too much scenario if there is one. I need to get the maps to see. Then if tweaks are needed I can see what BRT will do. Being a performance product premium fuel may just be a given much like running a supercharger on a car requires the good stuff.

[randomwalk101]

yeah..non-programmable unit at lower price makes if the timing is correctly set...basically plug in & forget. Adjustable is a nice feature for tuning at first but once it's tuned, you don't need to mess with it ever again so kinda waste.


btw, why rev limiter set at 15K when stock valve train is rated 14.5K? I would think 14K should be the limit.

[randomwalk101]

Originally Posted by Plasma

are u serious??????
can i return mine and buy this .....
;/
lol

lol..you can sell it to me at the discounted price you bought and buy this

[ztrack157]

IDK why the 15k limit. By doing so you essentially just eliminate the limiter all together.

[Greg_E]

It will make a good replacement for a failing stock CDI if you can keep the price down below $200 and it is truly plug in and go.

[ztrack157]

it is truly plug in and go. and the price will be around $200 or so shipped. Margins on them are already super low and when I offer up a deal like this it is often below my cost just so I can get the word out.

[randomwalk101]

Great deal. I want to sign up for one... Just not sure how to reprogram it if the programmed map is not working right
Posted via Mobile Device

[ztrack157]

You cannot reprogram it. Thus the non adjustable part out there in texas you have 93 octane I think 91 or better will do you good. The maps will work BRT has put plenty of time in and done their homework to make sure you get a good product. The other alternative is to go with the programmable unit.

[Racer x]

From playing with the adjustable unit .I have found the 250 ninja engine dose not seem prone to detonation.Even on pump gas And dose respond well to advanced timing . A non adjustable unit will be great with a pipe and some jetting.You should be able to hit 30 hp and hsve a lot more bottom end torque.
There is no reason to rev the stock engine to 15k but 13500 is kinda low.

[randomwalk101]

RacerX
I noticed that you're rocking with jet 118 which is rich. Rich helps with detonation problem so may be why you were able to run at higher timing without issue
anyhow, it'd be nice to know the exact mapping & have the rev limiter lowered to 14000 for safety

[Racer x]

Definitely need to know the timing settings. I was at #110 jets. Running that lean It had no more power past 3/4 throttle but it never detonated.
I did run into detonation with too much advance of the intake cam.

[ztrack157]

I'm working on the map info. Haven't gotten a hold of BRT yet. But like Eric said detonation won't happen with this motor. He was screwing with the cams when he had problems.

[ztrack157]

Ok setup is for stock motor running Premium. But given the higher RPM settings 87 should do.

Ignition spots are as follows:

Map1:
2500 40
3000 40
4000 40
5000 40
6000 40
7000 40
8000 40
8500 40
9000 39
12000 39
12500 38
13000+ 36

Map 2:
IS Coming

[randomwalk101]

how's this map? Is it close to what you're rocking with the adjustable TIS?

[ztrack157]

it is essentially the same minus 1 degree until 9000 rpm. Then it is milder then the BRT programmable and my own map being only at 36 at 13000 (mine is 41 with octane booster) which is one degree advanced over stock 35 I believe (eric correct me if I'm wrong). So no worries of going boom.

[randomwalk101]

awesome...so there is a remote switch that you flip back and forth to change map?
map 2 is more aggressive?

[ztrack157]

Waiting on them to send me map 2. I hope it is. Yes it should be a switch that mounts just like the other one. But maybea switch you have to manually change.

[ztrack157]

Ok switch is mounted on bars. Confirmed.

[VeX]

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What%27...%27s_engine%3F

It's an oiling issue evidently. And It'd be nice getting to up the timing advance a bit... But I don't have the moneys in the foreseeable future for this And seeing as the valvetrain starts to really run out of steam and the torque starts really falling off around 12k RPM causing the horsepower to drop big time past 13,500 RPM or so, revving to 15,000 would be... Really pointless without getting some beafier valve springs, different cams, and possibly doing some pocket porting and valve work to get some more flow

[ztrack157]

I never said reving to 15000 was possible nor recommended. These just have no rev limit essentially. 14,500 is what the valve train is rated to and 14,000 is in the safe zone. Which I don't recommend going past.

[randomwalk101]

Originally Posted by ztrack157

I never said reving to 15000 was possible nor recommended. These just have no rev limit essentially. 14,500 is what the valve train is rated to and 14,000 is in the safe zone. Which I don't recommend going past.

if it's not useful, why not ask them to change at factory before you order them?

[ztrack157]

Its like a car dealership telling ford to start putting carbs back on cars. I don't have that kind of pull. I will talk with them and see but it ain't gonna happen.

If one cannot pay enough attention to their bike to know when to lay off then it is not my nor BRT's fault. This is why there is a programmable model. Positive and Negative externalities John. You want a lower price your gonna have to make a concession somewhere.

[VeX]

I'm not harping on it It's not going to cause the engine to blow up by over-revving to 15k. You just have to be careful when someone reads something like being able to rev higher with the lack of a rev-limiter because I'd estimate 90+% of people will automatically think, "Wow! This will make my bike more powerful as it can rev higher!" I'd go for the programmable one all the way as ignition rev-limiters can be a god send.

Has Racer X gone with more aggressive cams and stiffer springs yet? I remember reading him considering it or something along those lines along with his other tweaks. That'd be interesting to see dyno's on if he can get another 1,000 RPM out of the engine.

[ztrack157]

I don't think he has done the cams yet possibly the springs. Call up web cams inc. they will hook you up with a nice re grind that will get you about 2 more hp.

[randomwalk101]

Originally Posted by ztrack157

Its like a car dealership telling ford to start putting carbs back on cars. I don't have that kind of pull. I will talk with them and see but it ain't gonna happen.

If one cannot pay enough attention to their bike to know when to lay off then it is not my nor BRT's fault. This is why there is a programmable model. Positive and Negative externalities John. You want a lower price your gonna have to make a concession somewhere.

That's bad business mentality my friend. If you're a manuf the you create a product that people want to buy, not what you want them to buy. Remember GM? Of course if gm's case, "bankcruptcy is not an option" so you and I bent over and forked out billions of tax dollars to they can build craps that people WANT to buy now... Of course after they got the money, they bankcrupted... I guess it is an option now.
Posted via Mobile Device

[ztrack157]

^ not bad business mentality. Your just the mouse I gave a cookie to.

Positive and negative externalities are certainly the biggest part of consumer business. If you want a rev limiter throw down and get the programmable. If you want a lower price get the non programmable and mind your wrist.

If you don't have an actual question pretaining to the product please do not post here. I'm here to give out information and good prices. Not to be told what I should do.

[randomwalk101]

relax man. Don't take it the wrong way. I was just making a suggestion..not telling you what to do.
i'll prob go with the adjustable in the future. needs to get my finances straighten out first though.

[iceman.kcmo]

So... is there any product like this for the 07 and older? Or a way to adapt?

[ztrack157]

you would have to do a wire harness mod equal to the one in the tech section but with the 2008 and newer parts.

[Racer x]

Don't worry about over revving the engine . First of all . It can take it . I have missed gears, dragged the rear tire. just plane held it full pin to see how fast it will go . And it is fine . I am very proud of how much this little engine of mine has had to Indore . I have raced it for two years and it is still running very well .

With the stock intake and exhaust it will be very difficult to get the engine to rev past 14000 RPM . It will simply run out of gas at that speed. And in sixth gear .I wish it would go over 11000 .

As for cams and springs . I am letting my engine builder handle that . I have my limitations and I know it . Figuring out the cam lift and duration is not something you can just do .
And for spring. O BOY that is the most critical part of making an engine that can make power at or above 13000 RPM . IF he can find off the shelf springs that have the proper length and pressure I will be OK for 300 bucks a set . If he can't ,I will have to have custom wound springs . They come in sets of 16 and cost up to 200 dollars each . That's right 3000 dollars for valve springs . My wife is not amused by that one.

[ztrack157]

Eric. Try calling Kibble white. Bram had a bunch of stuff done for him there. including over sized valves, decking, and springs. His cost was $1800 for the whole shebang. So I'm sure it would be cheaper for just springs and valves.

[ztrack157]

Map 2

2000:41
2500:41
3500:41
4000:41
4500:41
5000:41
5500:41
6000:41
6500:41
7000:41
7500:41
8000:41
8500:41
9000:41
9500:39
10000:41
10500:41
11000:41
11500:40
12000:39
12500:39
13000:39
13500:39
14000:39
14500:39
15000:39
15500:39
16000:39
16500:39

[randomwalk101]

Matt, thanks for the maps. That mapping looks good...put me down as one of the "tester"