Parallel twin vs. Inline 4 maintainance.

headshrink · June 29th, 2014, 04:07 PM

I find it interesting that the Ninja 650 is a parallel twin, but Honda's new CBR650F is an Inline 4 (tuned for low-mid torque), as well as the FZR. I would guess they're aimed at the same market, but I don't know why they aren't all using the same engine configuration.

My question really comes down to maintenance. Do inline 4s require more maintenance?

Hossua · June 29th, 2014, 04:26 PM

Yes. Not sure how much more it is but 2x the valves, yes?

headshrink · June 29th, 2014, 04:28 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Hossua

Yes. Not sure how much more it is but 2x the valves, yes?

Yes, it is twice the parts when it comes to valves, but most people only need to do adjustments to their valves, rarely replace parts. I'm thinking more about the frequency of maintenance.

Hossua · June 29th, 2014, 04:31 PM

I wouldn't think the intervals would be too radically different, but someone else will probably set us straight soon.

Soujyu · June 29th, 2014, 04:37 PM

I know for my bike (a V4) the oil change interval isn't that much different, and of course we have things like tires, brake pads, and other consumables that may vary on how we ride.

What does get expensive for my particular bike is the valve adjustment. Due to the special way the camshaft operates, a special tool is required, which prevents me from doing the job myself. Luckily, it doesn't require a valve adjustment as often as the 250/300.

dcj13 · June 29th, 2014, 04:38 PM

I-4's are more complicated that parallel twins. But with fuel injection , the I-4 will be less than twice as complicated as the parallel twin. Maintenance complications will be more related to ease of access and design than number of cylinders.

Soujyu · June 29th, 2014, 04:45 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by dcj13

I-4's are more complicated that parallel twins. But with fuel injection , the I-4 will be less than twice as complicated as the parallel twin. Maintenance complications will be more related to ease of access and design than number of cylinders.

At least we aren't working with a I-4 with carbs. Synching them up can be a pain.

Ninjinsky · June 29th, 2014, 05:07 PM

I don't see marginal maintenance differences as significant compared to what "feel" of engine you want. They are quite different in character, so I dont think they are aimed at quite the same market sector.

Another factor is the relative difficulty of some jobs rather than the number of cylinders. The pregen front valve clearances, for instance, are a pig of a job, despite being a "simple" twin. I could do a well designed four faster

adouglas · June 29th, 2014, 05:44 PM

It's like having two dogs.

Those who don't own dogs assume that two dogs is twice as much work and trouble as owning one. That's not true.

You buy twice the food and pay two vet bills instead of one, but daily life and care is not that different.

So a four-cylinder bike... twice as many spark plugs. So what? Twice the valves... well, you're still just pulling one valve cover. It's not twice the effort to check 16 valves vs. 8.

choneofakind · June 29th, 2014, 06:21 PM

But owning two doggies means you have to pick up twice as much poop. EWWWW

Sirref · June 29th, 2014, 06:39 PM

good to know, No matter how many valves though I dread valve alignments. At least until I've done a few and know what I'm doing.

choneofakind · June 29th, 2014, 07:13 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Sirref

good to know, No matter how many valves though I dread valve alignments. At least until I've done a few and know what I'm doing.

Dude, learn on the pregen. Dead simple.

Sirref · June 29th, 2014, 07:31 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by choneofakind

Dude, learn on the pregen. Dead simple.

hmm, I very well may do it on the pregen sometime this week then do it on the 300 after. I may as well do it on the pregen too since I don't know when they were last done if ever and it has close to 14k miles on the engine.

thedrewski86 · June 29th, 2014, 07:57 PM

I would agree with the general consensus that it's all the same. Keeping one bike on the road is about the same as keeping any other bike on the road. I ride a carb'd I4 every day and I don't think twice about it. The wee Ninja is less work because it's newer, not because it has fewer cylinders. I think that's a much bigger factor.

New cbr650 vs new 650r??? No difference.

cuong-nutz · June 29th, 2014, 07:59 PM

Slightly more work to get the valves adjusted in the bike.

headshrink · June 29th, 2014, 09:14 PM

The dog analogy brings it all together, LOL!

CZroe · July 2nd, 2014, 05:44 PM

I wouldn't say that they are aimed at the same market. Kawasaki sold the 650R and the ZZR600 side-by-side for a while. I'd say that the ZZR600 was aimed at that market.

June 29th, 2014, 04:07 PM	#1
headshrink ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Bob Location: CA Join Date: Dec 2008 Motorcycle(s): '08 Ninja 250r, '14 CBR500r Posts: A lot.	Parallel twin vs. Inline 4 maintainance. I find it interesting that the Ninja 650 is a parallel twin, but Honda's new CBR650F is an Inline 4 (tuned for low-mid torque), as well as the FZR. I would guess they're aimed at the same market, but I don't know why they aren't all using the same engine configuration. My question really comes down to maintenance. Do inline 4s require more maintenance? __________________________________________________ Honda Interceptor VFR800 DLX (2014, 8th gen) Honda CBR500r (2014) - FOR SALE Kawi Ninja 250r (2008) - Restored and passed-down within family, only to be abandoned

June 29th, 2014, 04:37 PM	#5
Soujyu ninjette.org sage Name: W Location: Austin, TX Join Date: Mar 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2010 Ninja 250R (sold), 2012 Tuono V4R Posts: 512	I know for my bike (a V4) the oil change interval isn't that much different, and of course we have things like tires, brake pads, and other consumables that may vary on how we ride. What does get expensive for my particular bike is the valve adjustment. Due to the special way the camshaft operates, a special tool is required, which prevents me from doing the job myself. Luckily, it doesn't require a valve adjustment as often as the 250/300. __________________________________________________ 2010 Kawasaki Ninja 250R - "Aria" (sold) 2012 Aprilia Tuono V4R - "Perrine" Proof that Harleys and Ninjettes are friendly with each other

June 29th, 2014, 05:44 PM	#9
adouglas Cat herder Name: Gort Location: A secret lair which, being secret, has an undisclosed location Join Date: May 2009 Motorcycle(s): Aprilia RS660 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 6 MOTM - Jul '18, Nov '16, Aug '14, May '13	It's like having two dogs. Those who don't own dogs assume that two dogs is twice as much work and trouble as owning one. That's not true. You buy twice the food and pay two vet bills instead of one, but daily life and care is not that different. So a four-cylinder bike... twice as many spark plugs. So what? Twice the valves... well, you're still just pulling one valve cover. It's not twice the effort to check 16 valves vs. 8. __________________________________________________ I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem.
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

June 29th, 2014, 07:57 PM	#14
thedrewski86 ninjette.org guru Name: Drew Location: SoCal Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2007 SV650S 2005 EX250F Posts: 487	I would agree with the general consensus that it's all the same. Keeping one bike on the road is about the same as keeping any other bike on the road. I ride a carb'd I4 every day and I don't think twice about it. The wee Ninja is less work because it's newer, not because it has fewer cylinders. I think that's a much bigger factor. New cbr650 vs new 650r??? No difference. __________________________________________________ Don't think, look!

June 29th, 2014, 07:59 PM	#15
cuong-nutz RIP Alex Name: Cuong Location: Houston, TX Join Date: Apr 2011 Motorcycle(s): '10 250r, '09 265r Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 2	Slightly more work to get the valves adjusted in the bike. __________________________________________________ HalfFast Racing Team Serving Greater Houston Area Riders:WFO Riders MotoHouston HPC CMRA Ride Smart Fastline Lone Star Track Days

June 29th, 2014, 04:26 PM	#2
Hossua ninjette.org member Name: Josh Location: Sullivan, IL Join Date: Jun 2014 Motorcycle(s): '82 Honda Ascot 500 (sold) '09 Suzuki SV650 (Totaled by deer) Posts: 28	Yes. Not sure how much more it is but 2x the valves, yes?

June 29th, 2014, 04:31 PM	#4
Hossua ninjette.org member Name: Josh Location: Sullivan, IL Join Date: Jun 2014 Motorcycle(s): '82 Honda Ascot 500 (sold) '09 Suzuki SV650 (Totaled by deer) Posts: 28	I wouldn't think the intervals would be too radically different, but someone else will probably set us straight soon.

June 29th, 2014, 04:38 PM	#6
dcj13 Participant Name: Dave Location: South of Seattle Join Date: Oct 2012 Motorcycle(s): '94 K75 std Posts: Too much. MOTM - Aug '15	I-4's are more complicated that parallel twins. But with fuel injection , the I-4 will be less than twice as complicated as the parallel twin. Maintenance complications will be more related to ease of access and design than number of cylinders.

June 29th, 2014, 05:07 PM	#8
Ninjinsky ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Paul Location: UK Join Date: Apr 2014 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250, Yamaha RS200 (classic) Posts: A lot.	I don't see marginal maintenance differences as significant compared to what "feel" of engine you want. They are quite different in character, so I dont think they are aimed at quite the same market sector. Another factor is the relative difficulty of some jobs rather than the number of cylinders. The pregen front valve clearances, for instance, are a pig of a job, despite being a "simple" twin. I could do a well designed four faster

June 29th, 2014, 06:21 PM	#10
choneofakind ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: . Location: . Join Date: Feb 2011 Motorcycle(s): . Posts: Too much. MOTM - Feb '13, Feb '14	But owning two doggies means you have to pick up twice as much poop. EWWWW

June 29th, 2014, 06:39 PM	#11
Sirref Private Joker Name: Ben Location: Towson, MD Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): '99/'01 Ninja 250 "sketchy", '13 Ninja 300 "yoshi", '03 GSXR 600 "merlin" Posts: A lot. MOTM - Mar '14	good to know, No matter how many valves though I dread valve alignments. At least until I've done a few and know what I'm doing.

June 29th, 2014, 09:14 PM	#16
headshrink ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Bob Location: CA Join Date: Dec 2008 Motorcycle(s): '08 Ninja 250r, '14 CBR500r Posts: A lot.	The dog analogy brings it all together, LOL! __________________________________________________ Honda Interceptor VFR800 DLX (2014, 8th gen) Honda CBR500r (2014) - FOR SALE Kawi Ninja 250r (2008) - Restored and passed-down within family, only to be abandoned

July 2nd, 2014, 05:44 PM	#17
CZroe CPT Falcon Name: J.Emmett Turner Location: Newnan, GA Join Date: Apr 2009 Motorcycle(s): '08 CP Blue EX250J, '97 unpainted EX250F, 2nd '97 unpainted EX250F (no engine), '07 black EX250F Posts: A lot.	I wouldn't say that they are aimed at the same market. Kawasaki sold the 650R and the ZZR600 side-by-side for a while. I'd say that the ZZR600 was aimed at that market.

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