Shifting to neutral when at a stop.

[Kitdog]

I was just wondering I went on a ride the other day and when I pull up to a red light I usually shift to neutral to wait for the light to change then shift to first just before it does, unless the light is very close to changing then I just hold the clutch. I noticed some people just hold the clutch the whole time, while others take my approach of shifting to neutral, which is correct/better?

[Alex]

Dealer's choice. Advantages to keeping it in neutral:

• If the clutch cable breaks unexpectedly, you don't find yourself in the intersection
• Might be less likely to dart out the instant the light turns green, allowing red-light runners a bit more time

Advantages to staying in 1st with the clutch in:

• quicker getaway possible if you see traffic approaching from behind
• good isometric exercise for your left hand.

I'm sure there are more out there. I find myself doing both, probably depends on how long the light is likely to stay red.

[2WheelGuy]

Leaving the bike in gear gives you the option to take off should a car driver "not see you". I tend to leave my bike in gear until a safety barrier stops behind me, then I kick it into neutral and relax. I also stop on the sides of the lane, never in the middle.

My mother (in a car) got rear ended while stopped at a red light just a few weeks ago. She was hit by the stereotypical soccer mom driving an SUV full of kids while talking on a cell phone. Seriously. Over $5000 damage to her car. Had she hit a bike instead of a car one of us could be dead.

[bob706]

Originally Posted by 2wheelguy

leaving the bike in gear gives you the option to take off should a car driver "not see you". I tend to leave my bike in gear until a safety barrier stops behind me, then i kick it into neutral and relax. I also stop on the sides of the lane, never in the middle.

+1000

[kkim]

Kit,

have you taken the MSF course?

[Kitdog]

Originally Posted by kkim

Kit,

have you taken the MSF course?

Sadly I haven't the nearest place its offered is quite a drive for me and would require 2 over nights to attend, but I am hopping to go to another work training come fall so I will be able to go during the day to that training and in the evening do the MSF course.

Originally Posted by 2WheelGuy

Leaving the bike in gear gives you the option to take off should a car driver "not see you". I tend to leave my bike in gear until a safety barrier stops behind me, then I kick it into neutral and relax. I also stop on the sides of the lane, never in the middle.

Yea this is me too... I just keep my right foot on the rear break, looking verify that the person coming up behind me sees me, making sure to FLASH my break lights as they approach, then I relax too. I also make sure to leave enough room in front of me to go around the person in front of via "white lining" if I should have to in an emergency. I just noticed some people never seemed to go to neutral at all.

[Talonne]

I never bother to go to neutral... Having the ability to make a move quickly if someone doesn't look like they're going to stop is one reason. The second is just the fact that our clutch is not exactly tough to hold down, even for my tiny hands... So why bother shifting back and forth? If I had a bike with a really stiff clutch, I'd probably opt to take a rest.

[SCREEM]

I go to neutral and keep an eye on the cages behind me...The MSF teaches you to always be in gear at stop lights.

[Guinss]

I keep it in 1st gear.
Only times i go to neutral is if it is roadwork or similar where the light will be red for a couple of minutes or more. But, only if i got a car already stopped behind me, like Craig says. Try to keep my brake light on aswell, until there is a car or two stopped behind.

[ckholloway]

I always keep my bike in gear at stop lights with my right hand on the front brake lever thus keeping the brake light on. Even with a car behind you it can get rear ended and pushed into you (I've seen it happen). I don't like to take chances so I am always ready for a quick get away.

[Snake]

I do not shift into neutral until The vehicle behind me has come to a complete stop. Prior to the vehicle behind me coming to a complete stop I flash my brake lights on and off several times until the vehicle stops just to make sure they see me.

[Hadyn]

Originally Posted by Alex

I find myself doing both, probably depends on how long the light is likely to stay red.

+1
And +1 to waiting for a car to stop behind you before shifting into neutral.
And +1 to flashing the brake light at approaching cars.


And something I've noticed, all the Harley riders seem to shift into neutral at every light, regardless of length, other cars, or anything else. They always 'ka-chunk' their way into first before they move. Do cruisers have significantly heavier clutches?

[2WheelGuy]

Originally Posted by Hadyn

Do cruisers have significantly heavier clutches?

Harley Davidsons have notoriously heavy clutches. There are a number of "reduced effort" kits on the market. My girlfriend looked at the Buell Blast briefly before buying a Ninja 250, she couldn't pull the clutch, end of story.

[CZroe]

You waste more gas with the clutch pulled. Put it up on a rear stant in neutral while idling, hold in the clutch and then shift down. The tire will begin turning as if you were in 1st even with the clutch still held. With the tire down that the clutch slips instead but it still puts a small amount of additional load on the engine.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by 2WheelGuy

My girlfriend looked at the Buell Blast briefly before buying a Ninja 250, she couldn't pull the clutch, end of story.

Something must have been going on with that particular bike, from what I remember, our Buell Blast clutch was just about as light as the ninjette's. One of the key things they did on that bike was re-engineer the clutch so it was much easier for a newer rider to use.

[Kitdog]

Originally Posted by Hadyn

+1
And +1 to flashing the brake light at approaching cars.

I always do this usually tapping my foot to the music in my head... or the voices depending on my mood/med's lol j/k

[wvninja]

It depends on where I'm at but in heavy town traffic I usually stay in first unless I'm adjusting my gloves or helmet for some reason. When riding with other people we kick it in N when we are at a stop sign or intersection on some back road with no traffic. Just to flip up the visors and bs about where to go next.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by Alex

Something must have been going on with that particular bike, from what I remember, our Buell Blast clutch was just about as light as the ninjette's. One of the key things they did on that bike was re-engineer the clutch so it was much easier for a newer rider to use.

The Ninjette's clutch handle didn't feel any different but I do remember having a very sore hand for a few days after my MSF classes (performed with Buell Blasts). I was sore everywhere from my 680 mile ride home after buying the Ninjette, so I couldn't compare directly. 15,000 miles later and no sore hand since.

[Goosey]

I never go into neutral except when I make a mistake shifting down from 2nd . I hope my clutch cable never snaps.

[2WheelGuy]

Originally Posted by Alex

Something must have been going on with that particular bike, from what I remember, our Buell Blast clutch was just about as light as the ninjette's. One of the key things they did on that bike was re-engineer the clutch so it was much easier for a newer rider to use.

I can't say for sure as I only messed with the one bike at a dealership. Their "reduced effort" clutch felt just like a Sportster clutch.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by Goosey

I hope my clutch cable never snaps.

keep it properly lubed and adjusted and it shouldn't.

[cifex]

I take issue with the statement that if your clutch cable broke while you were in first gear, you'd end up in the intersection.....you'd end up 3 inches in front of where you were with a stalled engine. And that's assuming you weren't covering the brake to keep the light on which I would hope everyone IS doing.

[bdavison]

Ill say it once again.
Neutral is only for allowing you to lube the chain....other than that the bike is ALWAYS in gear.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by bdavison

Ill say it once again.
Neutral is only for allowing you to lube the chain....other than that the bike is ALWAYS in gear.

I dunno... I warm up my bike in neutral.

[Alex]

Originally Posted by cifex

I take issue with the statement that if your clutch cable broke while you were in first gear, you'd end up in the intersection.....you'd end up 3 inches in front of where you were with a stalled engine.

With our bikes, yup. Your prediction is probably spot-on. But if the bike has 60+ ft-lbs of torque instead of < 15, a snapped cable can in fact jump the bike forward a couple feet before the rider realizes what has happened. Doesn't take far to go from being safely aside of traffic to being right in the path of it. It's funny, I got that tidbit from some list somewhere that catalogued "100 things a man needs to know", or something near to that title. The only motorcycling thing in there was that tidbit, that a broken clutch cable at the wrong time could be deadly. Seemed out there, and I bet the particular author had one of those rare occurrences happen to him.

[Kitdog]

Originally Posted by cifex

I take issue with the statement that if your clutch cable broke while you were in first gear, you'd end up in the intersection.....you'd end up 3 inches in front of where you were with a stalled engine. And that's assuming you weren't covering the brake to keep the light on which I would hope everyone IS doing.

I kinda agree, I been with a friend who had his clutch cable break and his Mustang it only jerked forward like 8 inches before it stalled he wasn't covering his break either (cocked and ready at a light) it was all blown and stuff to like 500+hp with a mostly fiberglass body, nice mach 1 kit

[cifex]

Sounds logical to me, Alex. I guess the solution is that we don't neglect our bikes, inspect, lube and replace clutch cables before it ever comes to that.

I put my bike in neutral once have a car behind me stopped. Two if its a faster highway or an exposed area like the first light in a long time. I'm usually flashing my brakes and watching my mirrors for someone not paying attention / slowing.

[Kitdog]

Yea I agree I hope to never find out, I broke the cable on my Baja bug back in high school out in the desert and with no one to tow me home I had to drive home 50+ miles in 1st gear (top speed about 8mph) with out stopping it was not fun, I did have to stop 2 times that I remember my friends had to push the car while I turned it over because we would stall, the starter would push it forward but it needed the help of friends, then they had to run to jump in after we were going.

[cifex]

I'm sure push starting a buggy in sand is just barrels of fun!

[kkim]

also, I hope you know now that it's possible to shift a car w/o using the clutch? it's not as easy as on a bike, but it is possible.

[cifex]

I don't plan on trying that.....Wouldn't that F the S out of the synchros???

EDIT: I assume that was directed at buggy guy? I think Richard Hammond was doing that on the episode that they drove across South America until the differential exploded all over the highway.

[kkim]

if done wrong and if you force it, it will. there is a speed in the trans where the gears will mesh and will drop into the next gear. Long ago , there were no such things as synchronizers in transmissions.

I don't recommend you always shift like this in a car (or even try it in a car you like), but if stuck like he was, it beats driving back in first.

yes, sorry, my comments are directed at the dune buggy.

[austexjg]

Originally Posted by kkim

also, I hope you know now that it's possible to shift a car w/o using the clutch? it's not as easy as on a bike, but it is possible.

Had to drive home from Dallas after the Cotton Bowl one weekend without a clutch - it was brutal while in stop and go traffic.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by austexjg

Had to drive home from Dallas after the Cotton Bowl one weekend without a clutch - it was brutal while in stop and go traffic.

that's unimaginable! how did you manage that?

[austexjg]

Basically, I would force it into first as I was slightly applying gas if I was stopped. If I was slightly moving with traffic, it was easier to get into second. After that, it was simply listening to the engine and slightly putting pressure on the gear shift to get out of and into gears.

Luckily, no major damage - the slave cylinder was out.

[Kitdog]

Mine was in a 66 vw beetle Baja... and yes pushing it in the sand sucked, fortunately if you turned the crank the starter would help propel the car a little also... still brutal, I didn't know about being able to shift a car without the clutch until later that night. (my dad told me about it) I was only 16 so I still had a lot to learn, still I hope never to try it thank you very much.

Once we got it stuck in the mud out in no where in the mountains, no mater what we tried it wouldn't come out... we tried everything. my friend comes up with this Idea that we jack up the rear tire, tie a rope to a tree and then wrap the rope around the rear tire and tie it to the rim, then use the tire as a crank to pull it out... it worked. I swear that car was jinxed.

[revstriker]

I keep my bike in gear until the car behind me comes to a full stop, and then I shift into neutral. If there is no one behind me, and I can see traffic coming for a good distance, I will shift into neutral while watching for cars behind me. If someone is coming up on me I'll go back to first.

[LuxMundi]

I go to N any chance I can get; I'm a knuckle cracker/ stretcher/ gear adjuster/ cell phone checker at lights.

[capt_bugaloo]

Originally Posted by revstriker

I keep my bike in gear until the car behind me comes to a full stop, and then I shift into neutral. If there is no one behind me, and I can see traffic coming for a good distance, I will shift into neutral while watching for cars behind me. If someone is coming up on me I'll go back to first.

That's what I've been doing for 18 years of riding, and it's always worked well for me. And of course, I have my brakes lit up. As I'm watching vehicles behind me in my mirrors, if I think one is coming up just a little too fast, I will flash the brake lights too.

[tjkamper]

I'm almost always in gear unless I have to use my hands for something; i.e. adjust the vents on my jacket, fiddle with tank bag, scratch ass.