Help Oil lights flickering

[mrscbw]

Hello, I'm new here. Been hanging around and finally registered . Hopefully one of you guys could help me out. I have a 09 Ninja 250r. Earlier today after I went out for a ride. I came back home and stopped at my driveway which is at a slight angle. I pressed my front brakes a little to hard and did a bit of a nose dive and saw oil lights flicker. Then I noticed when I would tilt the bike left and right the oil pressure/water temp lights would come on (replicated it 3+ times by tilting bike). Any idea what may be causing this?

[kawboyCAFE]

does your bike have enough oil in it? might wanna check.

[mrscbw]

Yea oil is good about 1.7~1.9 but I did forget to put the washer on the oil filter..Could this be why?

[kawboyCAFE]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

but I did forget to put the washer on the oil filter..Could this be why?

doubt it. the washer is just for keep the spring from digging into the rubber seal on the filter. you should still be fine without it. if your oil is ok, then it sounds to me like you have a loose connection somewhere, maybe in back of the dash, and the connections are sliding in and out of connection when you brake. ya know, momentum, force forward. i could be wrong. is it still under warranty?

[mrscbw]

I replicated it by tilting the bike left and right it would come on and off dimming as I stand up and brightening as I leaned it further. Any ideas where to check?

[kawboyCAFE]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

I replicated it by tilting the bike left and right it would come on and off dimming as I stand up and brightening as I leaned it further. Any ideas where to check?

ya got me. only thing i would know to say is to start at the battery and check all the connections down the line. it may not even be a loose connection, it was just a thought. hows the battery? if it brightens when you lean it, maybe the battery is slightly damaged, and is connecting better when the fluid is moving or sloshing. i really dont know other than that without seeing it.

[mrscbw]

Hmm..its possible for a bad battery connection to cause the oil lights to light up? I'll check the connections tomorrow morning.

[kkim]

recheck your oil level in the sight glass window. is it at the proper level with the bike perpendicular (fully upright) to the ground?

also, what oil weight are you using?

[mrscbw]

The oil glass is about 90% to the full line with the bike upright also 10W40. I'm really thinking this is a wiring problem since tilting the bike makes both the lights flicker? From what I understand the light should either be ON or OFF there is no in between? Since its dimming and flickering I'm guessing the contacts are moving or something. I done some researching and found this diagram: http://i50.tinypic.com/j78cia.png which shows that the 2 lights share the same circuit? Where can I find these connectors?

[grandelatte]

the service manual has the following troubleshooting guide.

Oil Pressure Warning Light Goes On:

• Engine oil pump damaged
• Engine oil screen clogged
• Engine oil level too low
• Engine oil viscosity too low
• Camshaft bearing worn
• Crankshaft bearings worn
• Oil pressure switch damaged
• Wiring faulty
• Relief valve stuck open
• O-ring at the oil passage in the crankcase
• damaged
• Engine oil filter clogged

i hope this helps.

[DaBlue1]

Also check your idle speed. Too low idle speed can result in low oil pressure. How long was your ride and how hot was your bike? Has it done the same thing cold? The oil pressure switch diode and temp switch diode is located on the wiring harness on the left side behind the upper cowling.

[mrscbw]

Hmm.. I just went out to try and replicate it again and it didn't turn on. When it did happen, it was after a 2 hour ride about 1.5 hr in the back roads and .5 on the freeway home going about 70~80 mph which is about 8-10k rpm? After the freeway coming to a stop i notice it flickered but didn't think anything of it. Then when I stopped in my driveway I seen it again, so I showed my friend. I stood the bike upright and it would go away, tilt left or tilt right, light flashes on. Bike has 500 Miles, 2009. Recent changes to bike: Swapped to 2011 exhaust, Pulled Carb to clean jets, 2 #4 washer shims, and adjust fuel/air mixture screw. Any ideas?? I increased my idle a bit, its at about 1500 BTW

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Hmm..its possible for a bad battery connection to cause the oil lights to light up? I'll check the connections tomorrow morning.

Bad batteries can cause a lot of weird things!

Link to original page on YouTube.

He replaced his battery and the problem went away.

[mrscbw]

Brakes revving the motor..haha how ironic

[mrscbw]

Is it common for the oil pressure and water temp lights to come on at the same time?

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by kkim

recheck your oil level in the sight glass window. is it at the proper level with the bike perpendicular (fully upright) to the ground?

also, what oil weight are you using?

[mrscbw]

Feel free to click on the edit and compare revisions..Only changed one thing and thats..oil temp to water temp

[CThunder-blue]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

No need to get your panties in a bunch..Obviously USA for my name was a ERROR. USA should've been the country, I might of used Auto-fill and it placed it in the name for who knows what. If you see original post the oil pressure and water temp lights flickered on at the same time, like I said. And thats what I been asking about. I even PM'd you about those 2 lights so I don't see why you seem so surprised about 2 lights flickering??

Originally Posted by mrscbw

I don't know why your so angry..I didn't do anything. Why are you acting like this? I tried to be as descriptive as possible, even fixed my name. No need to get angry man.

Re-read your earlier post. Normally, you would just say "oops, I'll fix it now." You became a little defensive and some people are more sensitive than others. What you may see as just banter, a stranger who's trying to help you may see otherwise.

As far as your lights are concerned, if they didn't flicker on while the engine was cold, I would suggest changing your fluids.

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by CThunder-blue

Re-read your earlier post. Normally, you would just say "oops, I'll fix it now." You became a little defensive and some people are more sensitive than others. What you may see as just banter, a stranger who's trying to help you may see otherwise.

As far as your lights are concerned, if they didn't flicker on while the engine was cold, I would suggest changing your fluids.

As for the fluids, I just done the oil change using 10W40 about 1.7Qt. As I mentioned earlier, I forgot to put the washer back on. Don't know if that may have anything to do with it. What else fluids should I be changing? Coolant?

What really gets me was tilting the bike made the lights come on. Not just the oil pressure but water temp light at the same time. And they would dim/flicker as well.

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

You have NO idea the bridge you just burnt to the ground. kkim is by far the best source of information on this board!




kkim

Really, a ban for that? There was no need to come at me so strong about a name when it was clearly a honest mistake.

[kkim]

Barry,

I've deleted my offensive posts. I suggest you (and others) go back and do the same. You need to understand this forum is a bit different than others and the members here deal with each other on a more personal level. We value and appreciate the great atmosphere Alex has provided us with and I do my part to keep it that way.

Stick around and I'm sure you'll learn a lot about your bike.

Like I suggested in my PM, check for a loose/corroded ground or a chafed wire where those two lights share a common circuit. I may be completely wrong and I'm sure if I am, someone will tell me so and provide you with the answer to your problem. That's the way it is around here.

welcome to the forum.

[mrscbw]

Hey Kelly, No hard feelings man. You got way more knowledge than me and I'm here to learn from you. No offense to you bro seriuosly.

Just fix this light for me lol

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Hey Kelly, No hard feelings man. You got way more knowledge than me and I'm here to learn from you. No offense to you bro seriuosly.

Just fix this light for me lol

Now that's what I'm talking about. Props to both of you!

Now lets start fresh with this light issue...

Welcome aboard Barry!

[kkim]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Hey Kelly, No hard feelings man. You got way more knowledge than me and I'm here to learn from you. No offense to you bro seriuosly.

Just fix this light for me lol

glad to help, as are many others on this forum. I don't have all the answers, but collectively here, we're able to provide people, with problems to their bikes, the help that they need. If we can all do our part to keep the environment on ninjette a positive one, more of the experienced members would be apt to lend a hand when they see a fellow ninjette member in need.

you need to start digging around/examining the cluster area to check out the wiring, if it's both of those lights flickering together. the fact that you can affect it by moving the bike side to side indicates to me that something might be loose causing an intermittent short or ground.

[mrscbw]

Okay let me try to explain this to the best that I can. First of all these are some things that I done which may or may not affect it. Pulled carb, removed battery tray and majority of the connectors around it. Shimmed needles with 2 #4 washers each. Replaced exhaust with 2011 OEM exhaust. Adjusted Air/fuel mixture screw to 2 turns out. Oil changed 1.7~qts 10W40 (forgot to put the big washer back on, going to put it back on next oil change).

Onto the scenario: 2 Hour ride, 1.5 hr in the backroads, .5 hr on the freeway going about 70~80 mph. When exiting the freeway coming to a stoplight is when I first noticed the oil pressure/water temp light flicker. Coming to the driveway which is sort of a dip before going up to the garage. I stopped at the driveway dip with bike angling down. Tilt the bike left or right and those 2 lights would come on at the same time and at the same brightness. The more I leaned the bike the more brighter the light would get until it reaches a full ON light and would stay on if I held the bike in that angle. When lifting bike back to upright light disappears but as I lift it back up the light would dim/flicker.

Oil glass is about l---------l--l when standing upright more towards the full side.

I tried to replicate this with a few rides around the block and it did not happen. So I'm worried its not electrical and may be mechanical =[

Would the air/fuel mixture have a possibility of causing the bike to overheat when coming to a idle? (say if I adjusted it to lean) Or maybe one of the connectors is loose? I pulled majority of the connectors near the battery tray don't know if any of those reflects those warning lights.

If you guys need more details, I can try to provide it.

[mrscbw]

Alright going to check the wires again..so because both of these lights are coming on at the same time. I'm safe to say this is most likely electrical?

[DaBlue1]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Hmm.. I just went out to try and replicate it again and it didn't turn on. When it did happen, it was after a 2 hour ride about 1.5 hr in the back roads and .5 on the freeway home going about 70~80 mph which is about 8-10k rpm? After the freeway coming to a stop i notice it flickered but didn't think anything of it. Then when I stopped in my driveway I seen it again, so I showed my friend. I stood the bike upright and it would go away, tilt left or tilt right, light flashes on. Bike has 500 Miles, 2009. Recent changes to bike: Swapped to 2011 exhaust, Pulled Carb to clean jets, 2 #4 washer shims, and adjust fuel/air mixture screw. Any ideas?? I increased my idle a bit, its at about 1500 BTW

I suspect that after your long ride at high rpms, was enough to make the engine hot and the oil viscosity low enough for the lights to come on. Also oil can puddle in the front of the engine case when the bike is on an angle or under really hard braking. The oil has a hard time trying to get back to the oil pickup at the rear of the engine, which can cause a momentary pressure loss.

Originally Posted by mrscbw

...I came back home and stopped at my driveway which is at a slight angle. I pressed my front brakes a little to hard and did a bit of a nose dive and saw oil lights flicker.

Originally Posted by mrscbw

...I tried to replicate this with a few rides around the block and it did not happen.

If the lights come on and stay on. I would look at another problem.

Lower your idle back down to 1300-1350 (since you have shims). Try changing your sprocket sizes to help reduce your rpms. You can also run 20w-50 oil as well. (will help in cooling)

[kkim]

first.. are you sure both lights are coming on and just not one light coming on and perhaps its light bleeding over into the other indicator?

the oil flickering light problem has been reported before and the cause seemed to have been too low an oil level when the oil bunches up towards the front of the engine during hard stops or on inclines.

how are you getting your oil level indication in the sight glass? is the bike perfectly perpendicular to the ground when reading? It can't be just "approximately" perpendicular, as I've seen a very small amount of lean affecting the sight glass reading significantly. I'm just trying to make sure you're getting an accurate oil level indication.

also, when you reassembled the bike after shimming, are you sure you got any chassis ground wires you may have removed back into place and are providing a good, solid connection to ground?

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by kkim

first.. are you sure both lights are coming on and just not one light coming on and perhaps it's light bleeding over into the other indicator?

the oil flickering light problem has been reported before and the cause seemed to have been too low an oil level when the oil bunches up towards the front of the engine during hard stops or on inclines.

how are you getting your oil level indication in the sight glass? is the bike perfectly perpendicular to the ground when reading? It can't be just "approximately" perpendicular, as I've seen a very small amount of lean affecting the sight glass reading significantly. I'm just trying to make sure you're getting an accurate oil level indication.

also, when you reassembled the bike after shimming, are you sure you got any chassis ground wires you may have removed back into place and are providing a good, solid connection to ground?

Ya, I'm 100% positive both lights are coming on and as for bleeding, these 2 lights are pretty far apart, could the oil pressure light bleed all the way to the water temp light? I will have to take note of that and check if these lights come back. As for sight glass, I'm not sure how to get a perfect up right position. I had my friend sit on the bike and straighten it up to the best he can and read from there. The only ground wire I could remember removing is the battery's negative? All the others were clips. Am I missing something here? I don't recall removing any bare wires besides the battery terminal wires.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Ya, I'm 100% positive both lights are coming on and as for bleeding, these 2 lights are pretty far apart, could the oil pressure light bleed all the way to the water temp light? I will have to take note of that and check if these lights come back. As for sight glass, I'm not sure how to get a perfect up right position. I had my friend sit on the bike and straighten it up to the best he can and read from there. The only ground wire I could remember removing is the battery's negative? All the others were clips. Am I missing something here? I don't recall removing any bare wires besides the battery terminal wires.

if both lights are indeed coming on, then yes, the problem is electrical. when multiple lights come on when there is not a true occurrence of a problem, the usual suspect is a bad ground, somehow, either by a grounding lug being loose or corroded or by wire insulation being chafed allowing bare wire to touch.

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by kkim

if both lights are indeed coming on, then yes, the problem is electrical. when multiple lights come on when there is not a true occurrence of a problem, the usual suspect is a bad ground, somehow, either by a grounding lug being loose or corroded or by wire insulation being chafed allowing bare wire to touch.

I agree.

Barry: Is there any other mods done. Maybe LED turn signals or any other changes to the electrical system/wiring?

Is the bike new or new to you?

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by kkim

if both lights are indeed coming on, then yes, the problem is electrical. when multiple lights come on when there is not a true occurrence of a problem, the usual suspect is a bad ground, somehow, either by a grounding lug being loose or corroded or by wire insulation being chafed allowing bare wire to touch.

Phew..as long as its not mechanical. However electrical could be just as bad. Ground ground grounds..where are the grounds? Well time to start tracing wires..Thanks for all the help!

[dubojr1]

kkim:

Is there any harm in intensionally grounding one of the switches to see if both lights illuminate again?

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

I agree.

Barry: Is there any other mods done. Maybe LED turn signals or any other changes to the electrical system/wiring?

Is the bike new or new to you?

I just purchased this bike about 2 weeks ago with 250 miles. There was no mods done to the bike everything looked completely stock. The bolts on the fairings looks like they have never been touched. So I was the only person to take this thing apart. I haven't done any mods except the ones listed. Is there any grounds being removed in the process of removing the carburetor/airbox ? or any wires I may have altered in this process that may cause this problem? This was my first attempt and I kind of just went at it with a laptop and KKim/Vex DIY's.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by mrscbw

Phew..as long as its not mechanical. However electrical could be just as bad. Ground ground grounds..where are the grounds? Well time to start tracing wires..Thanks for all the help!

check the service manual

[kkim]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

kkim:

Is there any harm in intensionally grounding one of the switches to see if both lights illuminate again?

sorry... dunno for sure, but I would think not... as long as the switch is indeed using a chassis ground (which I'm pretty sure all electrical does on this bike).

[DaBlue1]

I really doubt that a bike with 250 miles on it has a major electrical problem. The lights flickered and did not stay on. You put any 250 Ninja on a steep angle to the front with the engine hot and the oil pressure light will flicker. Not only that a temp loss in oil flow may cause to temp light to flicker as well. Just my 2 cents.
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/My_oil_..._heavy_braking

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by kkim

check the service manual

In case you need it...

[dubojr1]

Originally Posted by DaBlue1

I really doubt that a bike with 250 miles on it has a major electrical problem. The lights flickered and did not stay on. You put any 250 Ninja on a steep angle to the front with the engine hot and the oil pressure light will flicker. Not only that a temp loss in oil flow may cause to temp light to flicker as well. Just my 2 cents.
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/My_oil_..._heavy_braking

This would make some sense however I am very heavy on my brakes and I have never seen the light flash.

Barry: Can you replicate the lights by leaning it side to side?

[mrscbw]

Originally Posted by dubojr1

This would make some sense however I am very heavy on my brakes and I have never seen the light flash.

Barry: Can you replicate the lights by leaning it side to side?

Ya when I first came back to the drive way, I replicated it 3+ times by leaning it left and right. My friend witnessed it and said "thats crazy". So the next day I took it around the block a few times and came back to the same spot, same angle and tried to lean it again left and right..no light. bummmmer