September 3rd, 2021, 04:53 AM | #121 | |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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Quote:
2. Color I would say is white-ish. May have a hint of blue in it but if I remember correctly mostly white. 3. I will have to check this once I am back at the shop. 4. Gas tank is currently off the bike, I am using a small gas tank for just testing. Its a spun aluminum round tank I keep around for just testing so I know there is fuel flow. 5. Airbox is quite a pain to take in and out but I will try and do it for testing, if I can confirm at least that it will try and run by bypassing the carb at least I know where the problem is. |
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:01 AM | #122 | |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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Quote:
Since this Simplegreen thing looks to be questionable at best I may pick up something like those Chem Dip cleaner that come in gallon jugs or something see if that helps once I cam confirm it will run if I just spray some gas into the carbs / airbox directly. |
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:03 AM | #123 |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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So much good info here, I appreciate it a lot. Once I get back to the shop I will continue with these troubleshooting steps provided.
--Dan |
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:50 AM | #124 |
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:52 AM | #125 |
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September 3rd, 2021, 01:05 PM | #126 |
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Technique I've found to work well is to not remove airbox at all. I haven't even separated battery-tray from airbox:
CARB-REMOVAL 1. remove tank & throttle+choke cables 2. loosen fully clamps between rubber-manifolds and carbs (leave manifolds clamped to head) 3. unbolt airbox from frame 4. pull carbs+airbox combo off rubber-manifolds and back 1-2cm (this gap is all you need to remove carbs) 5. fully loosen clamps on LEFT rubber-manifolds to head 6. pry off and wiggle/remove LEFT rubber-manifold from head 7. roll up spring-clamps between carbs & airbox 8. pull off carbs from airbox and wiggle out left side CARB INSTALLATION - almost same in reverse 1. wiggle carbs in from left side 2. wiggle carbs onto airbox boots, slide whole assembly back as far as it will go 3. wiggle/squeeze in LEFT rubber manifold, click onto head 4. tighten LEFT rubber manifold to head 5. slide carbs onto rubber manifolds and tighten clamps 6. slide airbox onto carbs and roll down spring-clamps 7. install cables It takes no more than 5-minutes to remove and re-install carbs by leaving airbox in place. Just slide it backwards. |
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September 3rd, 2021, 02:15 PM | #127 |
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My '07 had rubber boot shrinkage and I could not the the connection to the carbs to stay sealed until I did the battery box - airbox separation. I'd get them connected and get the clamps on, and go for a ride. When I got back the boots had slipped off the carbs.
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September 3rd, 2021, 03:38 PM | #128 |
Retired motorcycle Mc.
Name: Robert
Location: Weed, California.
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Kawasaki Ninja 250R, 2021 CSC TT250, 1977 Triumph Bonneville 750cc,2001 Honda XR650L. Posts: A lot.
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that's a good explanation of the carb removal Danno ! Thanks !
Jim what is this AIRBOX / BATTERY BOX SEPERATION.... that you speak of ? do you have a link ? when I took my carbs off it was a trial of getting enough room to get them out from the beginning... the manual said move the airbox/battery box back , so I did... and I eventually got them out...but it was a battle all the way. their not like a DT1's carb ! LOL.... ... I didn't separate the carbs on mine I left the hoses between them alone as they looked good. and I know from previous experience you don't separate the carbs unless you have to. it's alot more needless hassel .... However in this case I think these carbs need a good thorough cleaning how you go about it Dan is your choice, you know what to look for and you can get them super clean this time. hang in there and when you get back to the bike you can attack it with a fervor and get it going in short order ! .... Bob.......
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September 3rd, 2021, 04:53 PM | #129 |
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1 out of 1 members found this post helpful. |
September 3rd, 2021, 05:28 PM | #130 |
Retired motorcycle Mc.
Name: Robert
Location: Weed, California.
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Kawasaki Ninja 250R, 2021 CSC TT250, 1977 Triumph Bonneville 750cc,2001 Honda XR650L. Posts: A lot.
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Thanks Triple Jim !
....in my opinion the Kawasaki 250R is a NIGHTMARE of engineered screwups from beginning to end ! all to have that pirty fairing on the outside.... the air box is one good example... pull the inner fender well off the bike to get the air box out ???? what were they thinking ? AURGH ! .... I have never ran into so many engineered Mistakes on any other machine yet.... every where you look on this thing it's a screw up ! Obviously, I am less enchanted with the bike now that I've had it a while.LOL it's a very good looking bike but to give up ease of work ability for that good looking-ness..... was a big mistake ! .... I am considering selling it just because it is so darn hard to work on ! .... Bob........
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:37 PM | #131 |
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Though not directly related, I've done a similar mod to my 900SS Ducati...10 minutes, I'm in my carbs WITHOUT touching battery/electrics /airbox related mounting.
Edited to add: though tank must be lifted (its hinged) and side fairings *must* be removed, to enable access.
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September 3rd, 2021, 05:38 PM | #132 |
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I have no problem working on mine. Lose the fairings and trim the side plastic, separate the airbox, and it's as good as any motorcycle.
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September 4th, 2021, 02:45 PM | #133 |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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Decided to try the cleaning the carb one more time since after today won't have the time to work on it for the next two or three weeks. I am 100% sure now that the carb is clean, I soaked it in ChemDip for a few hours followed by a batch in ultrasonic cleaner which did a nice job. I sprayed carb cleaner through every single hole and it came out another part of the carb... the jets, after the ChemDip looked brand new and I was able to clean the inside and outside thoroughly. I know I am getting gas into the engine now, I can smell it on the spark plug and I want to say I smelled it out of the exhaust but cannot remember for sure if I tested that. Still just cranks with no firing.
The coils have 12.5-13v on them when the ignition is on and it does drop while cranking but still above 11.5. Since I will be spending quite a lot of time on planes in the next couple of weeks I will do some light service manual reading... at this point I want to test the pickup coil and see if that maybe is not good, or the igniter. I dropped my multimeter today when I was taking it out of the toolbox so I currently do not have a multimeter to test all those. Just an update for everyone, and I hope to get back on troubleshooting this as soon as I am back from the work trip. Thanks for the help so far, this has been one very frustrating thing but one by one eliminating what it could be, I hope. --Dan |
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September 4th, 2021, 04:01 PM | #134 | ||
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Quote:
Carb-removal is not that difficult once you develop effective techniques. I switch jetting at track daily and only require 15-minutes to remove carbs, change jets and re-install. Without having to remove airbox. I use 96 mains in morning when air's cooler and switch to 94 in afternoon when things heat up. Worth about 1/2-sec/lap. Jim's issue is due to crispified rubbers holding carbs. I had that problem on my 2002 when I first put it together. Was going to remove airbox to cut off battery tray, but figured I'd fix hard-rubber issue. Used procedure below to restore rubbers back to supple brand-newness! Also did same for my '86 VF500 10yrs ago which had original rubber manifolds. Still have factory-fresh softness today! V4 config makes getting carbs out & in difficult and hard rubbers makes it impossible. Did same procedure to restore rubbers on my newly acquired VFR750 as well. Quote:
Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; September 4th, 2021 at 06:12 PM. |
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September 4th, 2021, 05:42 PM | #135 |
Retired motorcycle Mc.
Name: Robert
Location: Weed, California.
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Kawasaki Ninja 250R, 2021 CSC TT250, 1977 Triumph Bonneville 750cc,2001 Honda XR650L. Posts: A lot.
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Weird Dan !!!! it should at least Try to fire.... you have compression & fuel... so it HAS to be Electrical.
As I think I stated before I have a machine that will not fire if the battery is down even a little bit, it's a Honda 4 wd quad with the electric shift B.S. its in new condition ... but I do not mess with it at all. it will crank over fine but the dash is a bit goofie and it won't shift... then I know it won't fire till I charge the battery.... ... their may be a fault in the brain box on that thing Dan... as you said it drops to 11 volts when cranking and that may mean it stops sparking the plugs ... I remedied my problem with the quad by putting a car battery on the back rack.... and tried it.... and it cured the problem even with the shifting ! you might try that ...but I am not sure what that will do to the bikes electrics. as some things are sensitive to amperage. I got away with it on the Quad but I must caution you on doing it... I doubt it will hurt it, BUT IT COULD ! (if it fried the ecu you'd be looking at an expensive replacement part !) .... I've used car batteries several times on bikes to get them up and running and never had a problem. they have much more reserve amperage and provide more cranking power. I jumped my XS650 several times as the battery would not hold a charge so I just jumped it from the car battery never hurt a thing.... and it shouldn't, as long as you get the positive to the positive and negative to negative !!!! .... use your own judgment ! ..... Bob.......
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September 4th, 2021, 05:47 PM | #136 |
Retired motorcycle Mc.
Name: Robert
Location: Weed, California.
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Kawasaki Ninja 250R, 2021 CSC TT250, 1977 Triumph Bonneville 750cc,2001 Honda XR650L. Posts: A lot.
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Good to Know Danno !!!!!
I've always just spreyed WD-40 on the boots and anything plastic and rub it in good... it helps I think.... it helps the side walls of tires as well but you need to really wipe them off good ! they will still be slick as snot ! so don't corner hard after doing that ! ....Bob.......
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September 5th, 2021, 07:57 AM | #137 |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
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Just did a closer look on the engine. Does this mean the engine is from a 1987?
—Dan |
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September 5th, 2021, 11:29 AM | #138 |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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Searching on the faq.ninja250 site it would seem this engine is from a 2004 model year bike, the frame/electronics are a 2006. Not sure anymore if this engine really only had 10K miles like the frame but at least it had been gone though on the top end.
Would the electronics in a 2006 by chance not be compatible with a 2004 motor? The CDI box for a 2004 is part 21119-1415, while for a 2006 is a 21119-0010. Not familiar with Kawasaki part numbers but would that last four make a difference is the engine running? —Dan |
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September 5th, 2021, 11:57 AM | #139 |
Retired motorcycle Mc.
Name: Robert
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OH,,, sorry I can't help with that question... I would think they should be but I do not know for a fact !
Bob......
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September 5th, 2021, 11:57 AM | #140 |
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I believe the 2004 and 2006 models are essentially the same. I'm pretty sure the TCI modules are interchangeable.
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September 5th, 2021, 12:36 PM | #141 |
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September 6th, 2021, 10:51 AM | #142 |
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Carbs are still dirty. Without extensive scrubbing of hidden secret passages. Without ultrasonic soak. Without micro soda-blasting. They will not be factory fresh clean.
https://www.cbr250.com/threads/bike-...3/#post-324384 Please humour me and just dribble teaspoon of petrol down each carb throat will ya? Thx Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; September 6th, 2021 at 05:29 PM. |
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September 8th, 2021, 09:46 AM | #143 |
Race, Brake, Fix, Repeat
Name: Dan
Location: DFW
Join Date: Jul 2021 Motorcycle(s): 2006 Ninja 250 Posts: 43
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@DannoXYZ, will def try ass on as I am back home in a couple of weeks.
Regarding timing, does it matter which time the 2T mark is in the sight window? I thought it doesn’t but figured I would ask. For some reason I think (didn’t really pay attention just a maybe) that I saw some air come out of cylinder 2 when cranking but could be wrong. |
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September 8th, 2021, 10:39 AM | #144 |
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2T has 2 different orientations of cams. One TDC of exhaust stroke and other TDC compression. Verify alignment and turn 360-degrees to 2T again. One should match manual.
Ignition timing doesn’t matter. it just fires every time flywheel trigger comes around to TDC. End up with one spark at end of compression stroke and one spark at end of exhaust stroke (wasted spark). |
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