Power Commanders are now illegal

[rgx107]

Originally Posted by RacinNinja

You have my curiosity.....I'm going to ask my tuner about the 300 Ninjas and if he's done any PowerCommanders on them and whether they are rich or lean.

Yes, it's a deceleration issue but was it spark cut or fuel cut? I'd really like to know just for the sake of knowing but we probably never will. In regards to the fuel cut off....my Yamaha came the same way from the factory. Riding the edge of the throttle in the turn was a bit butt puckering, as the fuel would come on and off and create a bit of a jerk, even perceptible in a straight line. Yes, it's old tech but it's also driveability tech. Not so much of a problem in a car that has 4 wheels planted in a corner....

I wonder if this an EU spec ECU thing to be rich? Most of the bikes here in the states are so lean from the factory it's a wonder they run at all.

I think I wrote fuel cut-off. I don't understand why you would cut off the spark. It risks creating a number of issues, and is normally used only very briefly, i.e. at shifting and rev limiting. Possibly even some early car traction control software did this. Are you saying that some ECUs cut out the spark at deceleration?

I'm sorry I can't say that I myself measured the AFR. First of all it requires modifications to block the air bypass. Then you have to assume that this is not detected or compensated for by the ECU. A fair assumption though at high revs and open throttle, that it's running open loop then, but a risky assumption at lower revs and partial throttle. Then you can start worry about measurement errors, i.e. if the sensor or pickup sucks in air from somewhere.

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by rgx107

I think I wrote fuel cut-off. I don't understand why you would cut off the spark. It risks creating a number of issues, and is normally used only very briefly, i.e. at shifting and rev limiting. Possibly even some early car traction control software did this. Are you saying that some ECUs cut out the spark at deceleration?

I'm sorry I can't say that I myself measured the AFR. First of all it requires modifications to block the air bypass. Then you have to assume that this is not detected or compensated for by the ECU. A fair assumption though at high revs and open throttle, that it's running open loop then, but a risky assumption at lower revs and partial throttle. Then you can start worry about measurement errors, i.e. if the sensor or pickup sucks in air from somewhere.

There is no risky assumption if I ask my tuner. He blocks off the PAIR systems and can tune either the ECU directly or via PowerCommander.

I'm not sure if some ECU's cut spark...that's why I posed the question. You would have to cut spark AND fuel, else there would be flooded spark plugs and a loud BANG on re-ignition.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by RacinNinja

I'm not sure if some ECU's cut spark

Yes there are some stock ecu's that will kill spark. Late model r6's have a built in quick shifter, that is of course disabled by the factory . An ecu flash to enable it and connecting the shift wire to the harness and boom... you're on!

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Yes there are some stock ecu's that will kill spark. Late model r6's have a built in quick shifter, that is of course disabled by the factory . An ecu flash to enable it and connecting the shift wire to the harness and boom... you're on!

I meant cut spark on deceleration or throttle closing rather than just cutting fuel.

My tuner can do the new R1 and R1M to quickshift both up AND down.

[Somchai]

Originally Posted by Alex

Somchai - I'm not sure how to best phrase this, so please forgive my bluntness. Your content isn't helpful to the tone of this site. The anti-american bullshit you gravitate to is as tedious as it is unhinged. There are plenty of like-minded sites you can find to post on if that's what you want to focus on, but this is no longer one of them. There won't be another warning.

Ok Alex to make this long story short, delete my account with all my posts.
The second point is very important since all of them are my own copyright and when I leave the forum I don't want them to exist any longer.
They are based on my understanding, skills and knowledge so nobody has any right to use them any longer. Don't leave any trace remind about me.

[Alex]

Uh, no. Good luck to you.

[SLOWn60]

It's important to add a little chlorine to the pool once in awhile.
I'm sure it's one of the reasons this is the best forum on the Internet.

[corksil]

[EDIT] If this were any other forum I would be changing this post to pictures of boobies because everyone likes boobies. But this is a family friendly forum so that would be a no-no and I haven't figured out how to delete a post yet. Therefore my post is now "No-no" instead of "Ta-Ta." [/EDIT]

[corksil]

Follow up.. I agree with somchai -- amerikkkan government is run like a business. The sole responsibility of a business is to it's shareholders. Money makes the world go around. 95% of the world's "wealth" is owned by the top 3% of the population. Their sole motivation is to generate more wealth. The planet is doomed as a result of overpopulation. Climate change is real. World hunger, is real. All of the inconvenient truths in this world are just that. Truth.

We really aren't doing all that well as a species when you look at the rate of consumption versus the rate of regeneration of the planet's natural resources. Those at the "top" in terms of money and power do not care much about these sorts of things.

Going further in a negative vein -- there's nothing any one or ten or 10k people can do about it. It's a process that is and has been in motion long before any of us were born. It's the way of the world.

Perhaps it's most logical for an individual to realize these facts, and come to terms with them in the same way we have come to terms with universal laws of physics such as gravity. Certain things simply are. Certain things won't be changing -- no matter how "wrong" they may be from a moral or ethical perspective.

With that said -- it's important to be positive because if you let the bleakness of our situation with the current human condition affect you on an emotional level, that's the end of your practical ability to improve things and help others -- even if only to extend the survival of our species a few short generations longer.

A lot of the stuff he was talking about has merit. I bought into the domestic vehicle market right around the time that a massive ishtstorm erupted involving the DOT/EPA/DOH and various other governmental "agencies." I've always been one to leave no stone un-turned, so naturally I dug deeper and deeper into things and spoke to more and more people in various positions under various aliases in an ongoing pursuit of knowledge to satisfy my genuine curiosity.

To put things bluntly -- I wish I hadn't. Also had the eye opening experience of knowing a [redacted] buddy who was a political lobbyist under the official working title of "campaign manager." The things I learned after a few brief conversations with that character were appalling. The world is not as it seems. Money, power, and corruption in business.. those are as constant in politics as the rain, the snow, and the sun in most of the world.

I'm not pointing any fingers or naming any names -- but I've learned that there are stones better left un-turned. Childish innocence is the root of happiness. When you dance with the devil, the devil doesn't change. The devil changes you. I'm not a religious man and I'm speaking in metaphors -- my points are probably lost in the rhetoric.

With all of that said -- be careful what you seek, because if you seek it long enough -- you WILL find it. What you find will not be what you set out to find, and once you find it -- it cannot be un-found.

Would've been better for me to take things at face value instead of constantly digging deeper until I discovered the true nature of reality.

It's been said before... "curiosity killed the cat."

Happy trails everyone -- sorry for derailing the thread. Back to your regularly scheduled programming.

[cbinker]

@corksil

if the american government was a business, it would have been shut down years ago.

[akima]

[MrAtom]

corgi, the context of who it's coming from is more important than the message itself in this particular situation.

[corksil]

^^^ chris -- the amerikan government is a business. The citizens of our country are managed the same way employees are. Either way it's not something I want to put much thought into.

It is absolutely undeniable that we as a species are barreling at maximum speed toward a cliff. My philosophy? FORWARD!!!

Easier to accept things as they are than be disheartened by the nature of that which will not be changing.

FWIW I was referencing the infantile dick-sizing competition which took place between domestic truck manufacturers leading up to and right after the turn of the century. All largely under the same management -- not unlike a sick science fair project when all the teams are sponsored by the same corporation, and it's a research and development competition with the illusion of rivalry to garner public support even though the powers running the event are doing faceless experiments with humanity under the guise of scientific "progress."

I feel as if I can speak on the matter because I do own one of those trucks somchai posted a picture of.. with the 7.3l diesel engine -- one of the largest production engines sold in non-commercial vehicles in the history of our species. I can attest to the fact that the vehicles quickly got into the hands of mad scientists alike loosely defined under the term "tuners" -- and a lot of things got very far out of hand, very quickly. That's when [primarily] the EPA stepped in and throttled things down, but the damage had largely already been done. I watched over a period of days when numerous performance companies literally dissolved overnight before suits could be brought against them and within a few more months -- ECUs were 'locked' and required sophisticated tech to overcome their encryption. Many technologically gifted engineers overcame this, and the problem mushroomed out of control.

The government can and will always use private independent contractors to do it's dirty work, because when the red flags go up -- a straw man is the most surefire way to shirk moral and ethical responsibility.

"Kinda sad, how things have come to be. Desensitized to everything... what became of subtlety."

Okay I'm done with this one as well. Not trying to be negative or mean or speak ill of things -- merely aiming to inform in such a way that chaidude isn't labelled as delusional and tedious.

Let's all have a group hug!

[95PGTTech]

Originally Posted by HoneyBadgerRy

Time to move I guess.

If he lives in California and hasn't figured this out yet, there is no hope for him. Always the first state to vote stupid laws in, followed closely by NJ.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by 95PGTTech

If he lives in California and hasn't figured this out yet, there is no hope for him. Always the first state to vote stupid laws in, followed closely by NJ.

and you're still in Jersey...

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by corksil

^^^ chris -- the amerikan government is a business. The citizens of our country are managed the same way employees are. Either way it's not something I want to put much thought into.

It is absolutely undeniable that we as a species are barreling at maximum speed toward a cliff. My philosophy? FORWARD!!!

Easier to accept things as they are than be disheartened by the nature of that which will not be changing.

FWIW I was referencing the infantile dick-sizing competition which took place between domestic truck manufacturers leading up to and right after the turn of the century. All largely under the same management -- not unlike a sick science fair project when all the teams are sponsored by the same corporation, and it's a research and development competition with the illusion of rivalry to garner public support even though the powers running the event are doing faceless experiments with humanity under the guise of scientific "progress."

I feel as if I can speak on the matter because I do own one of those trucks somchai posted a picture of.. with the 7.3l diesel engine -- one of the largest production engines sold in non-commercial vehicles in the history of our species. I can attest to the fact that the vehicles quickly got into the hands of mad scientists alike loosely defined under the term "tuners" -- and a lot of things got very far out of hand, very quickly. That's when [primarily] the EPA stepped in and throttled things down, but the damage had largely already been done. I watched over a period of days when numerous performance companies literally dissolved overnight before suits could be brought against them and within a few more months -- ECUs were 'locked' and required sophisticated tech to overcome their encryption. Many technologically gifted engineers overcame this, and the problem mushroomed out of control.

The government can and will always use private independent contractors to do it's dirty work, because when the red flags go up -- a straw man is the most surefire way to shirk moral and ethical responsibility.

"Kinda sad, how things have come to be. Desensitized to everything... what became of subtlety."

Okay I'm done with this one as well. Not trying to be negative or mean or speak ill of things -- merely aiming to inform in such a way that chaidude isn't labelled as delusional and tedious.

Let's all have a group hug!

No, its not a business, its a Mafia.

[akima]

Originally Posted by cbinker

No, its not a business, its a Mafia.

Main difference being... Mafia have better taste:

Vs

[toEleven]

Originally Posted by akima

Main difference being... Mafia have better taste:

Depends on the Mafiosi and business men we're talking about.

vs


Lapo Elkann is rarely accused of having poor style. Tracksuits, on the other hand, are never a good decision.

...also, uh, what happened to Power Commanders and that whole 'thread topic' thing?