Can a 250 really keep up ?

[eddiekay]

clearlynotstefan makes an good observation...all of us spend time projecting what we want our ninjettes to be....that's part of the fun of these lil babies.
Hardly anybody writes about the mind excursion these bikes provide: If you ride a bigger bike, you never have an excuse for not oputriding someone else...with the jette...you always have an excuse. If you crash a bigger bike...you're crashing $7000 worth of bike...not $4000. And when you do outride a bigger bike...sheeeet, even a corolla...it's not a win but a major victory. I routinely take my FZ6 well over 100 and...it's like...so what. But, at 80 on the jette...I'm moving,,,,downshift on the slightest hill, feel every twitch in the road, get pushed over in the slightest breeze, that itty bitty mill screaming. Look, I undertand loving a machine for it's performance, handling, styling. babe-magnet, economy...even duc rattling clutch noise or HD detailing. In almost any situation...with bigger faster more expensive machines the bike will be way more capable than the rider ('cept for the pro's). With the ninjette, we ride them and for the 99% of us who are street riders...if you want to, you can melt into this bike and be one with uit.
OK...gotta go get some LSD now and listen to my grateful Dead LP's but if you don't know what I mean, maybe someday you will. Groovin'.

[Boom King]

Originally Posted by eddiekay

OK...gotta go get some LSD now and listen to my grateful Dead LP's but if you don't know what I mean, maybe someday you will. Groovin'.

[akima]

<3 Eddie's posts

[Guoseph]

Originally Posted by eddiekay

when you do outride a bigger bike...sheeeet, even a corolla...it's not a win but a major victory.

+1

I out gunned a Ford Ranger pick up truck today on a highway merge, felt like a major bad ass because I'm on a 250

[Alex]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

I out gunned a Ford Ranger pick up truck today on a highway merge, felt like a major bad ass because I'm on a 250

[Malicious Logic]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

+1

I out gunned a Ford Ranger pick up truck today on a highway merge, felt like a major bad ass because I'm on a 250

Ugh....hate reading stuff like this....

[TheTopher]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

+1

I out gunned a Ford Ranger pick up truck today on a highway merge, felt like a major bad ass because I'm on a 250

I own a Ford Ranger pickup. Mail trucks are faster.

She'll keep running 'til the world stops turning though.

[Malicious Logic]

Originally Posted by TheTopher

I own a Ford Ranger pickup. Mail trucks are faster.

She'll keep running 'til the world stops turning though.

Lol, my point exactly....to be proud of getting out ahead of a Ford Ranger on a 250 makes me think I should already start looking at which 600 I want after the 250... <.<

[Guoseph]

Originally Posted by Malicious Logic

Ugh....hate reading stuff like this....

Why?

[TheTopher]

Originally Posted by Malicious Logic

Lol, my point exactly....to be proud of getting out ahead of a Ford Ranger on a 250 makes me think I should already start looking at which 600 I want after the 250... <.<

My best friend has a 307hp 2012 Mustang that he bought the same month I got my Ninja. He's a hair faster on the interstate but 0-70mph I'm out front.

These bikes are a lot quicker than most people give them credit for.


I have to keep the pedal almost all the way down in 4th gear just to keep up with interstate traffic in my Ranger. If a ninja can't out run that truck, there is something seriously wrong with your bike.

[Guoseph]

But...but...it was a green Ranger, the faster color!

I was just joking guys, my bike is at least faster than a Ford Fiesta...at LEAST

[Malicious Logic]

Originally Posted by TheTopher

My best friend has a 307hp 2012 Mustang that he bought the same month I got my Ninja. He's a hair faster on the interstate but 0-70mph I'm out front.

These bikes are a lot quicker than most people give them credit for.


I have to keep the pedal almost all the way down in 4th gear just to keep up with interstate traffic in my Ranger. If a ninja can't out run that truck, there is something seriously wrong with your bike.

Lol, alright, that's a bit more comforting.

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

my bike is at least faster than a Ford Fiesta...at LEAST

are you positive about that? they make some mean Fiestas

Link to original page on YouTube.

[TheTopher]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

But...but...it was a green Ranger, the faster color!

I was just joking guys, my bike is at least faster than a Ford Fiesta...at LEAST

Mine is bright blue, it's even faster than the green ones.

[Guoseph]

Originally Posted by choneofakind

are you positive about that? they make some mean Fiestas

Link to original page on YouTube.

Okay that's pretty bad ass. Thanks for ruining my dream of out dragging a Ford Fiesta.

I was so sure my Ninja could take on that Gorilla on the Segway until he fired the rockets!

Anyway, sorry OP for the thread jack, it started out as such a nice thread.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by choneofakind

are you positive about that? they make some mean Fiestas

Link to original page on YouTube.

that's just sick yo

[randy328]

I have a RED Ford Ranger with various racing stickers on the window. They make it extremely fast.

[DarC]

I am undoubtedly faster in the tighter stuff on the RC than on the ninja. This is partially due to the better suspension on the RC (Ohlins), the scary brakes, the much better positioning (personal preference) and the power advantage (lots of corner propelling torque) but I think most of it is my riding style. The RC's power band seems to fit me a little better as I tend to brake a bit more and use more power to get me through the corner rather than to enter quickly and balance through to the power exit. In a local canyon I timed myself at 1.97 seconds faster on my first time on the RC over my best N250 run. Not much but a difference nonetheless.

Moral of the story is it isn't always the bike or the rider but also the fit of the two.


The road for those that are interested in google mapping is Scenic Drive in El Paso at the southern base of the Franklin Mountains.

[Clearlynotstefan]

A corner does not consist of the millisecond you are at your apex, it includes entry and exit. Even if the 250 could hold the same speed at the apex, it's brakes force it to brake earlier, and it's ability to roll on during the apex thru exit is decimated by a supersport. A corner even conservatively could be defined as when the road starts bending, to when it stops bending, even then the supersports brakes and acceleration would make a huge difference. If your saying at some point in the corner, the 250 could be traveling the same speed, that's fantastic, and it'll be truer the tighter then turn gets; but that's not what cornering faster is...cornering faster means if we enter at the same time, you should exit the corner in front of a supersport.

I think people chronically overestimate the modern 600cc supersports, they assume because they're in the next class that they trade tons of weight for more power. If you regularly ride a 600, you'll see that it's no less flickable then the 250, for christs sake it's 30lbs heavier soaking wet, and the upgraded suspension, braking, tires, and drastic pull away speed, only help.

Look, I love the 250, I'm on a 250 fan site, and I've been quite active on it...I'm no 250 hater, and that's how this conversation is making me look, but try to look at both sides of the argument...

I'm just sharing my experience. My 250 has sport demons with 1000 miles on them, and an upgraded spring in the back, stiffer springs up front. I've done everything I could to make it as great as it could be in the corners, and it made a huge difference. But I know I've pushed it on both of my bikes around the best twisties I know, canyon carving ridiculous tight turns, sweepers, you name it...my supersport ALWAYS is faster...Just my experience.

I've put over 15,000 miles on EACH of my bikes. Most of it in the twisties..I'm not unfamiliar with either machine by a long stretch.

Can't stress this enough, just my experience... Maybe I am blessed with a supersport with better cornering abilities then the rest. Maybe I had 15,000 miles of off days on my upgraded pregen, or 3000 miles of off days on my neighbors new-gen.

[Clearlynotstefan]

Originally Posted by DarC

I am undoubtedly faster in the tighter stuff on the RC than on the ninja. This is partially due to the better suspension on the RC (Ohlins), the scary brakes, the much better positioning (personal preference) and the power advantage (lots of corner propelling torque) but I think most of it is my riding style. The RC's power band seems to fit me a little better as I tend to brake a bit more and use more power to get me through the corner rather than to enter quickly and balance through to the power exit. In a local canyon I timed myself at 1.97 seconds faster on my first time on the RC over my best N250 run. Not much but a difference nonetheless.

Moral of the story is it isn't always the bike or the rider but also the fit of the two.


The road for those that are interested in google mapping is Scenic Drive in El Paso at the southern base of the Franklin Mountains.

Thanks for chiming it, and you raise a great point about the fit of the two. I'm MUCH more comfortable on the gsxr...Proper posture feels much more natural, I feel due to the lower bars.

[Guoseph]

Originally Posted by Clearlynotstefan

A corner does not consist of the millisecond you are at your apex, it includes entry and exit. Even if the 250 could hold the same speed at the apex, it's brakes force it to brake earlier, and it's ability to roll on during the apex thru exit is decimated by a supersport. A corner even conservatively could be defined as when the road starts bending, to when it stops bending, even then the supersports brakes and acceleration would make a huge difference. If your saying at some point in the corner, the 250 could be traveling the same speed, that's fantastic, and it'll be truer the tighter then turn gets; but that's not what cornering faster is...cornering faster means if we enter at the same time, you should exit the corner in front of a supersport.

I think people chronically overestimate the modern 600cc supersports, they assume because they're in the next class that they trade tons of weight for more power. If you regularly ride a 600, you'll see that it's no less flickable then the 250, for christs sake it's 30lbs heavier soaking wet, and the upgraded suspension, braking, tires, and drastic pull away speed, only help.

Look, I love the 250, I'm on a 250 fan site, and I've been quite active on it...I'm no 250 hater, and that's how this conversation is making me look, but try to look at both sides of the argument...

I'm just sharing my experience. My 250 has sport demons with 1000 miles on them, and an upgraded spring in the back, stiffer springs up front. I've done everything I could to make it as great as it could be in the corners, and it made a huge difference. But I know I've pushed it on both of my bikes around the best twisties I know, canyon carving ridiculous tight turns, sweepers, you name it...my supersport ALWAYS is faster...Just my experience.

I've put over 15,000 miles on EACH of my bikes. Most of it in the twisties..I'm not unfamiliar with either machine by a long stretch.

Can't stress this enough, just my experience... Maybe I am blessed with a supersport with better cornering abilities then the rest. Maybe I had 15,000 miles of off days on my upgraded pregen, or 3000 miles of off days on my neighbors new-gen.

Okay I'll participate in the serious side of the conversation too. I think it all comes back to "It's the rider, not the bike".

I would say you shouldn't focus on the "250 is faster than a 600 in corners" comments since most of the time someone is talking about "my" 250 being faster than "the other guy"'s 600. Which, back to what the OP originally intended to talk about, is that a 250 is a good enough bike to go "fast" in the twisties. But realistically a well ridden 600 is always going to be faster than a 250, otherwise we'd be watching MotoGP on Ninja 250's. However, a 250 is a much more forgiving bike when someone is trying to go faster, being a bit ham-fisted with the throttle is a lot less likely to dump you off a 250 vs a 600 for example, and the difference in skill in comfort between 2 riders shines through.

In your case, same rider, different bikes. I think the situation is a bit different. Clearly the more modern suspension and components make you feel more comfortable at a higher rate of speed, and I think on the street that's perfectly fine, it's not a race afterall. I also think that if conditions such that you can continue pushing the envelop on the 250 (at a track for example), you might be surprised at the speed you can carry. You may not be comfortable, but the bike will probably do more than you think it will. Obviously the street is not the place to test those boundaries of traction, and riding 80% on a Ninja is probably not as fast as riding 80% on a supersport. But since we are not racing, who's really keeping score anyway

Let it go man, it's just a bit of bench racing. We all do it from time to time, it makes the hobby a little more fun

[Guoseph]

Also, a lot "250's are just as fast as a 600 in corners" type comments are used to discourage potential newbies with little to no experience from jumping to a 600 too early in their riding careers.

[Clearlynotstefan]

Originally Posted by Guoseph

Okay I'll participate in the serious side of the conversation too. I think it all comes back to "It's the rider, not the bike".

I would say you shouldn't focus on the "250 is faster than a 600 in corners" comments since most of the time someone is talking about "my" 250 being faster than "the other guy"'s 600. Which, back to what the OP originally intended to talk about, is that a 250 is a good enough bike to go "fast" in the twisties. But realistically a well ridden 600 is always going to be faster than a 250, otherwise we'd be watching MotoGP on Ninja 250's. However, a 250 is a much more forgiving bike when someone is trying to go faster, being a bit ham-fisted with the throttle is a lot less likely to dump you off a 250 vs a 600 for example, and the difference in skill in comfort between 2 riders shines through.

In your case, same rider, different bikes. I think the situation is a bit different. Clearly the more modern suspension and components make you feel more comfortable at a higher rate of speed, and I think on the street that's perfectly fine, it's not a race afterall. I also think that if conditions such that you can continue pushing the envelop on the 250 (at a track for example), you might be surprised at the speed you can carry. You may not be comfortable, but the bike will probably do more than you think it will. Obviously the street is not the place to test those boundaries of traction, and riding 80% on a Ninja is probably not as fast as riding 80% on a supersport. But since we are not racing, who's really keeping score anyway

Let it go man, it's just a bit of bench racing. We all do it from time to time, it makes the hobby a little more fun

Couldn't agree more!

I always get a kick out of people that compare bikes when they're really comparing ability, or usually motivation. I can run faster then a ferrari, if it's not trying to drive faster then I run. I love when people say Oh man I went riding with this bike or that and I got to the end first, so my bike is fastest...When that guy could have just been cruising enjoying the ride... I'm guilty of it too!

Thanks for your good attitude... I figured I'd get jumped bringing the real topic back up...And you are right to bring up the SS being much more picky about technique and rider input. It will throw you on your face if your throttle control isn't decent. When I first started on a 250 I made inputs via my clutch that would lock my rear wheel and send me flying on my 600...It's part of the reason I love the 250!

[Guoseph]

I once got so excited I passed a guy who has always been faster than me. So excited in fact that I missed the brake markers for the next turn and took a tumble out into the grass. After I picked up all the pieces I realized he was pulling into pit-lane

I stopped getting excited in practice after that

[DarC]

^^^I lol'd, remembered I did a similar thing in an SCCA race many moons ago, and lol'd again.


I ran off track after passing a much faster driver/car combo only to find out afterwards that his clutch had quietly exploded.

[Clearlynotstefan]

Originally Posted by DarC

^^^I lol'd, remembered I did a similar thing in an SCCA race many moons ago, and lol'd again.


I ran off track after passing a much faster driver/car combo only to find out afterwards that his clutch had quietly exploded.

LOL