Bike died ?????

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 07:15 AM

OK, so took bike for a spin to bed in new brake pads before annual inspection.

So bike was run for a couple of hours on bench adjusting carb vacuum & idle. Next day was run for about 45minutes to warm through & check new clutch with some pull aways.

A couple of hours later, I took bike out on the ride, went great until I pulled up at a stop sign & it just died. Would not restart, had breakdown come out to recover it, the mechanic decided to have a good go at getting it working, to no avail. Now its home I've had a look, but a bit perplexed as was he.

Bike has;-
1. Fuel, supplied from a funnel in the feed hose, its fresh.
2. Spark, pulled plugs, bopth give health fat sparks.

It cranks easily on fresh charged battery. Coughs now & again but does NOT catch & run. Bike had carbs stripped & cleaned prior to the first startup, so should be good as it ran for approx 3.5 hours before it died.

Any ideas ?

Thanks

HoneyBadgerRy · March 23rd, 2016, 07:28 AM

Give it a compression test. There is also a possibility it sucked in a peice of filth into the pioltjet or pilot circuit, so its worth cleaning the carbs again.

csmith12 · March 23rd, 2016, 07:33 AM

Check boots on both sides (airbox and intake) to make sure they didn't slip off, fold or are leaking air.

Unplug spark plug wires and turn it over a few times. Remove plug... check for wetness. If they are not wet, you have a fuel delivery problem.

Hope it's something simple fore you and good luck!

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 07:35 AM

I'd agree with that as a possabilty if it was one carb, but both at the same time ?
I changed over to CoP's a month ago & know that it will run on one cylinder as one was faulty & confimered by swapping to other cylinder, bike ran equally well on either cylinder.

Carbs were spotless when reassembled, in fact they were pretty spotless when pulled out which surprised me, no gunk, nothing and it had been laid up for a year, due to me having a crock knee

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 07:39 AM

OK, so plugs were wet when pulled yesterday after attempts to start it when I got it home.

Did a compression test & both registered 125psi on 4 pumps, new gauge, so no idea how accurate it is. That was full throttle, no spark plugs. i guess that's where Kawasaki get that 470rpm comp test figure from, as rev counter went half way to 1

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 07:42 AM

PS, used a bore scope to look in plug holes, both pistons are intact, no dents, marks or other anomalies

SLOWn60 · March 23rd, 2016, 09:01 AM

Timing?

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 09:03 AM

Possible, but as it was running fine & was going slow when it stopped I'd be surprised, but I will check it.

RacinNinja · March 23rd, 2016, 09:06 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohawk

OK, so plugs were wet when pulled yesterday after attempts to start it when I got it home.

Did a compression test & both registered 125psi on 4 pumps, new gauge, so no idea how accurate it is. That was full throttle, no spark plugs. i guess that's where Kawasaki get that 470rpm comp test figure from, as rev counter went half way to 1

Spec for compression per the manual is 139-218 psi.

125 is low.

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 09:17 AM

agreed 125 is low, but manual spec is for a hot test & this was a cold test. I can understand one cylinder going out of spec, but not both simultaniously ! Could happen if bike was running badly, but went from great to dead in like 2 seconds !

I'm going to pull the carbs & check it all over, as the downside to the ZZR is you can't work on it with the fairing on

jkv45 · March 23rd, 2016, 09:27 AM

If the plugs were wet and it stumbled but wouldn't start, it would seem you are getting too much fuel for some reason.

Have you tried cranking with the throttle open a little - or a lot? It is odd that it ran for quite a while, then quit.

Is the tank spotless inside? Are you running a fuel filter? Could be possible something made it's way down to the float valves and is stopping them from closing.

In general it sounds carb related to me.

Mohawk · March 23rd, 2016, 09:40 AM

Its been cranked wide open & closed with choke, no apparent differenc ein attempts to start. Now & then it coughs, but does not catch

Tanks is spotless inside, no corrosion nor any muck. Tank flows loads on prime position, so not tank related.

Will look at carbs again, as spark is easy to test.

spooph · March 23rd, 2016, 01:34 PM

Intake tract and exhaust tract clear of obstructions?

jkv45 · March 23rd, 2016, 01:50 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mohawk

Its been cranked wide open & closed with choke, no apparent differenc ein attempts to start. Now & then it coughs, but does not catch

Tanks is spotless inside, no corrosion nor any muck. Tank flows loads on prime position, so not tank related.

Will look at carbs again, as spark is easy to test.

Without choke as well? If it's flooded, for whatever reason, you would want to crank wide open - no choke.

It does seem odd that it would all of a sudden start running extra rich though.

bluesound · March 28th, 2016, 12:06 PM

Could it be some old / bad quality fuel you supplied?

Mohawk · April 4th, 2016, 09:19 AM

Not had a chance to look at this since I got it home, spent all of easter gutting & refurbing a bedroom, now she's happy I have to clean the garage, before I can start work on it, so will get round to it one evening this week.

March 23rd, 2016, 07:15 AM	#1
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	Bike died ????? OK, so took bike for a spin to bed in new brake pads before annual inspection. So bike was run for a couple of hours on bench adjusting carb vacuum & idle. Next day was run for about 45minutes to warm through & check new clutch with some pull aways. A couple of hours later, I took bike out on the ride, went great until I pulled up at a stop sign & it just died. Would not restart, had breakdown come out to recover it, the mechanic decided to have a good go at getting it working, to no avail. Now its home I've had a look, but a bit perplexed as was he. Bike has;- 1. Fuel, supplied from a funnel in the feed hose, its fresh. 2. Spark, pulled plugs, bopth give health fat sparks. It cranks easily on fresh charged battery. Coughs now & again but does NOT catch & run. Bike had carbs stripped & cleaned prior to the first startup, so should be good as it ran for approx 3.5 hours before it died. Any ideas ? Thanks

March 23rd, 2016, 07:28 AM	#2
HoneyBadgerRy ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Ryan Location: Beaufort SC Join Date: Aug 2015 Motorcycle(s): 05 Ninja 250, 04 KTM 625 SMC, 01 Xc250 Posts: A lot. Blog Entries: 3	Give it a compression test. There is also a possibility it sucked in a peice of filth into the pioltjet or pilot circuit, so its worth cleaning the carbs again. __________________________________________________ Because Unregistered sucks at riding.

March 23rd, 2016, 07:33 AM	#3
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Check boots on both sides (airbox and intake) to make sure they didn't slip off, fold or are leaking air. Unplug spark plug wires and turn it over a few times. Remove plug... check for wetness. If they are not wet, you have a fuel delivery problem. Hope it's something simple fore you and good luck! __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

March 23rd, 2016, 09:01 AM	#7
SLOWn60 n00bie to wannabie Name: Bill Location: St Ives, BC (Shuswap Lake) Join Date: Sep 2015 Motorcycle(s): 2012 250R (Red), 2005 VFR800A (Red), CRF450X (Red), 2012 F800GS (Wants to be Red!) Posts: A lot. MOTM - Nov '15	Timing? __________________________________________________ The Smart Money: #1 - ATGATT, #2 - Training (machine skills and survival skills), #3 - The bike; whatever floats yer boat with the money you have left over

March 23rd, 2016, 01:34 PM	#13
spooph ninjette.org certified postwhore Name: Spooph Location: Golden, CO Join Date: Jul 2010 Motorcycle(s): '08 Ninja 250R Posts: A lot. MOTM - Oct '15	Intake tract and exhaust tract clear of obstructions? __________________________________________________ My therapist has 2 wheels and a seat. If you are ever in doubt to my tone, please refer to my avatar.

March 23rd, 2016, 07:35 AM	#4
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	I'd agree with that as a possabilty if it was one carb, but both at the same time ? I changed over to CoP's a month ago & know that it will run on one cylinder as one was faulty & confimered by swapping to other cylinder, bike ran equally well on either cylinder. Carbs were spotless when reassembled, in fact they were pretty spotless when pulled out which surprised me, no gunk, nothing and it had been laid up for a year, due to me having a crock knee

March 23rd, 2016, 07:39 AM	#5
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	OK, so plugs were wet when pulled yesterday after attempts to start it when I got it home. Did a compression test & both registered 125psi on 4 pumps, new gauge, so no idea how accurate it is. That was full throttle, no spark plugs. i guess that's where Kawasaki get that 470rpm comp test figure from, as rev counter went half way to 1

March 23rd, 2016, 07:42 AM	#6
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	PS, used a bore scope to look in plug holes, both pistons are intact, no dents, marks or other anomalies

March 23rd, 2016, 09:03 AM	#8
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	Possible, but as it was running fine & was going slow when it stopped I'd be surprised, but I will check it.

March 23rd, 2016, 09:17 AM	#10
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	agreed 125 is low, but manual spec is for a hot test & this was a cold test. I can understand one cylinder going out of spec, but not both simultaniously ! Could happen if bike was running badly, but went from great to dead in like 2 seconds ! I'm going to pull the carbs & check it all over, as the downside to the ZZR is you can't work on it with the fairing on

March 23rd, 2016, 09:27 AM	#11
jkv45 Rev Limiter Name: Jay Location: WI Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot. MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16	If the plugs were wet and it stumbled but wouldn't start, it would seem you are getting too much fuel for some reason. Have you tried cranking with the throttle open a little - or a lot? It is odd that it ran for quite a while, then quit. Is the tank spotless inside? Are you running a fuel filter? Could be possible something made it's way down to the float valves and is stopping them from closing. In general it sounds carb related to me.

March 23rd, 2016, 09:40 AM	#12
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	Its been cranked wide open & closed with choke, no apparent differenc ein attempts to start. Now & then it coughs, but does not catch Tanks is spotless inside, no corrosion nor any muck. Tank flows loads on prime position, so not tank related. Will look at carbs again, as spark is easy to test.

March 28th, 2016, 12:06 PM	#15
bluesound ninjette.org newbie Name: bluesound Location: Tampere, Finland Join Date: Mar 2016 Motorcycle(s): 2010, Ninja 250R, FI Posts: 3	Could it be some old / bad quality fuel you supplied?

April 4th, 2016, 09:19 AM	#16
Mohawk ninjette.org guru Name: Chris Location: Bristol, UK Join Date: Feb 2016 Motorcycle(s): ZZR250, VFR800 Posts: 478	Not had a chance to look at this since I got it home, spent all of easter gutting & refurbing a bedroom, now she's happy I have to clean the garage, before I can start work on it, so will get round to it one evening this week.

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