****

[rasta]

Originally Posted by adouglas

Another thing not mentioned yet:

Those look like stock tires. Yes? And how old?

Yes, stock tires. Have about 4200 miles on them; and still have plenty of tread. Though I've had Diablo Rossi's sitting in garage...I 'spose it's about time I get around to throwing them on.

Originally Posted by Sirref

to be fair the road does look a bit damp too, though you haven't mentioned that so I'm not really sure it is.

It hasn't rained here in Bay Area for 2 or 3 weeks and I crashed in mid-afternoon. So while I don't believe the road was damp, a friend of mine who's much more familiar with the road said it's "notoriously slick."

Originally Posted by subxero

Assuming to much

Back to the crash.
Perhaps there was a bit of foreshadowing or could have been intervention as it seems we are mostly giving same tips/constructive criticism as we were in prior thread
Here is thread from OP from few weeks ago you be the judge, something to think about.

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=148449

I think one of my biggest mistakes in the crash was the misconception that I wasn't going fast enough to need better body positioning. Great reminder that I'm still a n00b....especially with that mindset. You can bet that I'll be shifting my weight from now on...even on smaller curves.

Funny you should mention foreshadowing though. I was just thinking that there could have been warning signs yesterday prior to the crash. I scraped the peg/my toe a couple times...something that had never happened before (oddly enough, always on right hand turns).

[subxero]

Originally Posted by rasta

Yes, stock tires. Have about 4200 miles on them; and still have plenty of tread. Though I've had Diablo Rossi's sitting in garage...I 'spose it's about time I get around to throwing them on.

...

I think one of my biggest mistakes in the crash was the misconception that I wasn't going fast enough to need better body positioning. Great reminder that I'm still a n00b....especially with that mindset. You can bet that I'll be shifting my weight from now on...even on smaller curves.

Funny you should mention foreshadowing though. I was just thinking that there could have been warning signs yesterday prior to the crash. I scraped the peg/my toe a couple times...something that had never happened before (oddly enough, always on right hand turns).

Age of tires is different than miles on tires. sure they only have 4200 on them but they are what 5 years old? Tires are not that expensive for the 250, replacing tires that are old despite good tread left well worth it IMO.

As far as BP, Sure you don't need to do it all the time, but I think it is important to be able to pull it out when you have to. When I started riding I started practicing small BP shifts through EVERY turn despite needing it or not. Reasoning, I wanted to be comfortable doing it and to start programming it into my muscle memory so it would start to happen with out having to think about. Do I hang off like a mad man around every turn, no not at all but a simple change in BP can go a long way.

[rasta]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

You should see if Gerry at GP Frame and Wheel can fix your wheel. If he can't fix it, the attempt won't cost you anything. You can just ship the wheel to him.

I sent him an e-mail and he said he could do it for about $120. Thanks for the suggestion

[rasta]

This situation just got even more ****ing annoying today. I was trying to install the Yoshi slip on I just got, and ran into this little problem.

I guess the lowside caused part of my frame to bend inward. It's the part that's welded to the frame, where you connect the footpeg brackets to.



So when the footpeg parts are attached, it points waaay in, pretty much to the point where it touches the rear wheel.



I tried to bend it back with my hands, but surprisingly I'm not strong enough

Is there anything I can do to fix this? Other than contacting the frame straightener that @tfkrocks suggested?

Maybe there are alternative ways I can mount the exhaust where I won't need to use that part, I shall look into that.

EDIT: Totally didn't realize they make exhaust hangers. But they still attach to that same part of the frame

[Trailerboy531]

Anything on a 250 will bend back with the proper leverage; even the frame. Get some pliers and maybe a heat gun and see if you can bend it. If not...then attach the footpeg to it and bend it back, have a friend brace the bike since you will be pulling it hard towards you and away from the kickstand.

GET MORE MUSCLE AND MUSCLE THAT BITCH.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by rasta

..........I tried to bend it back with my hands, but surprisingly I'm not strong enough ...........(

If you can slide an adjustable 12" crescent wrench in the back of that flat part, your hands will be strong enough to straighten it.

It is not strong steel and bending it back a little at a time alternating position over each hole is doable.

Use some leather between the tool and the frame to protect the finish.

You will need a friend to push the bike against your lever, or a way to support it against a wall or even the floor.

[rasta]

Thanks for the ideas guys. I tried using a crescent wrench, but just couldn't get it far enough behind the piece for the necessary leverage to move it much. A mechanic friend of mine is gonna come over tomorrow with some "metal bending tools", so hopefully those can help get the job done.

[rasta]

So ever since this happened, I've been thinking a lot about body position and lean angle. I've seen numerous pictures/videos of riders achieving much more lean angle than I had before the lowside. I'm still missing *something* about the physics of lean angle and contact patch, because I don't quite understand how some people can get so much lean without sliding out. I read somewhere on another forum that some tires actually have more contact patch when leaned over than straight-up. Could this be why?

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by Trailerboy531

Anything on a 250 will bend back with the proper leverage; even the frame. Get some pliers and maybe a heat gun and see if you can bend it. If not...then attach the footpeg to it and bend it back, have a friend brace the bike since you will be pulling it hard towards you and away from the kickstand.

GET MORE MUSCLE AND MUSCLE THAT BITCH.

hahhhhh. hahahaha.

try oxy acl, and a 5 foot solid steel pry bar if you're wanting to be bending zees frame. the torch and a big hammer works best though.

[Nemesis]

Missing your turn in marker (for that turn) with a combination of too much lean angle was the cause. If you still don't understand it, watch the Moto3 Valencia race where Pol Esparago does the same exact thing but just at higher speeds. But same concept.

Props to you for wearing all your gear.

[csmith12]

What tires did you have mounted when you went down?

To answer your question about contact patch... It has to do with the profile of the tire. For example, a race slick dunlop has it's largest contact patch when the tire is at a 45 degree angle. Since I don't prefer dunlops, I run michelin V profile tires on my R6 when going for crazy elbow dragging lean angles. Although, my avatar shows some decent lean angle with a fairly round profile pirellis. Different tires have different characteristics. Some will agree with you as a rider, others will fight you every step off the way. If your gunna push the limits of traction, you MUST find the tire that complements you and your bike's setup, so try different brands as needed. Buy take offs if you have to.

There are so many other variables that goes into how much lean a bike & rider combo can achieve. Each one of these variables is worthy of it's own thread, but to put them all together to achieve greatness is the ultimate goal of every aspiring rider that craves the need for speed.

GET TO THE TRACK and do the "school" they offer. Many of your questions will be answered in a single day.

[rasta]

Originally Posted by csmith12

What tires did you have mounted when you went down?

To answer your question about contact patch... It has to do with the profile of the tire. For example, a race slick dunlop has it's largest contact patch when the tire is at a 45 degree angle. Since I don't prefer dunlops, I run michelin V profile tires on my R6 when going for crazy elbow dragging lean angles. Although, my avatar shows some decent lean angle with a fairly round profile pirellis. Different tires have different characteristics. Some will agree with you as a rider, others will fight you every step off the way. If your gunna push the limits of traction, you MUST find the tire that complements you and your bike's setup, so try different brands as needed. Buy take offs if you have to.

There are so many other variables that goes into how much lean a bike & rider combo can achieve. Each one of these variables is worthy of it's own thread, but to put them all together to achieve greatness is the ultimate goal of every aspiring rider that craves the need for speed.

GET TO THE TRACK and do the "school" they offer. Many of your questions will be answered in a single day.

Stock tires. I have Pirelli Diablos just waiting in my garage. I've been meaning to put them on, but I'm just waiting until the weather gets nasty out here. I have to fix the chipped wheel, and figure it would be best to do that all at once.

I've been yearning for a track day. Just not ready to shell out that cash yet

[cuong-nutz]

Originally Posted by rasta

I've been yearning for a track day. Just not ready to shell out that cash yet

Get the track day! It's lifesaving! Although better tires are great for traction, it still doesn't fix poor riding skills.

[rasta]

Originally Posted by cuong-nutz

Get the track day! It's lifesaving! Although better tires are great for traction, it still doesn't fix poor riding skills.

It's true, I still have awful lines turning in. Often find myself making mid-curve adjustments in the wider hairpins. I know what I'm supposed to do, the execution just isn't there.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by rasta

So ever since this happened, I've been thinking a lot about body position and lean angle. I've seen numerous pictures/videos of riders achieving much more lean angle than I had before the lowside. I'm still missing *something* about the physics of lean angle and contact patch, because I don't quite understand how some people can get so much lean without sliding out........

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showp...6&postcount=21

The position of the camera was exceptionally good in order to see the load on the front patch.
Note that the fender was at it highest point (max load) right before the slide and also how the front wheel got over-steered.

That compression of the forks could have been produced by a bump on the road (pretty long, judging by the time the fender started showing up and rising in the camera) or by a transfer of weight by inadvertently closing the throttle, or by a combination of both.

The recent thread about loosing the front have very good posts that dissect what happened to your front tire:
http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=157839

[Lychee]

It appears to me that you went over a patch of moisture or oil on the road at a high lean angle at time index 0:0275. Note the abruptly darker colored strip of pavement in the key frame after the one with the silver car. If you missed that patch of pavement, you may have made it but we will never know. Here is a screenshot.

[akima]

I'm a little late reading this thread, but all the same; glad to hear you're ok @rasta. I don't know if the camera shot was deceptive, but that was some pretty hard-core looking lean-angle there!

The experience shared and wisdom expressed in this thread is amazing! Makes me glad I found this ninjette.org

[rasta]

Originally Posted by akima

I'm a little late reading this thread, but all the same; glad to hear you're ok @rasta. I don't know if the camera shot was deceptive, but that was some pretty hard-core looking lean-angle there!

The experience shared and wisdom expressed in this thread is amazing! Makes me glad I found this ninjette.org

What a bump lol. And yes, this crash and subsequent thread has made me a better rider