Bike not starting after carb clean

[garyg199]

Hi there

Just bought a used 250 with 36 miles so it was pretty new. I was getting some performance issues with the acceleration not at 100% and it was bogging with WOT trying to get up passed 6-7k. Decided to pop the carb covers off without removing the carbs fully and clean the jets. I removed the needles , springs etc and stuck some wire down in the jets. Spray some carb cleaner and dropped some seafoam. The whole lot. Covered the carbs back up and tonight I tried to start it and it would begin to turn over for a second and then just nothing. Did I mess up somewhere? Did I not properly seat the needles or something? I'm not an expert on bikes and like I said this bike is very new to me. I do not have the tank on so I have the vac hoses open along with the gas line. I tried to funnel some gas in the carbs through the port where the line meets the carb. Do I have to have the tank on? Do I have to complete the vacuum process? What did I do? Please help! Sorry if this is a dumb question, once again I am a novice (with enough knowledge to do basic maintenance!)

Thanks!

[SLOWn60]

Vacuum lines have to be connected.
How on earth did you do work on the carbs without fully removing them?!?
Better question: what's the story on a 7 year old bike with only 36 miles on it?!?!?

Welcome to the site! The good news is you will soon be overwhelmed with great advice to solve your problem.

[garyg199]

So is that why it's cranking for a second and then I get nothing at all? Connected to the tank right? And the previous owner bought it in 2011 for his wife..took it out once..tipped it over..got pregnant..told hubby to sell it.

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by garyg199

So is that why it's cranking for a second and then I get nothing at all? Connected to the tank right? And the previous owner bought it in 2011 for his wife..took it out once..tipped it over..got pregnant..told hubby to sell it.

Cranking is electrical (the starter motor). Are you saying the starter motor stops after a second or it stops firing after a second?

My bet is it's unlikely the carbs are really clean after all these years in spite of your best efforts to clean them "in frame". There's 3 fuel circuits and it can be a challenge to clean them thoroughly on the bench!

[garyg199]

It just stops cranking after a second or two. I don't understand how the starter could just go like that? It was absolutely fine. I feel like I did something wrong or it just doesn't have fuel in the bowls TO fire on

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by garyg199

It just stops cranking after a second or two. I don't understand how the starter could just go like that? It was absolutely fine. I feel like I did something wrong or it just doesn't have fuel in the bowls TO fire on

How old is the battery?

[garyg199]

Oh my god it's cranking now! Thank god. Thought I broke a brand new bike. That was weird. Maybe just took a little longer to get fuel through after being empty and torn apart. By the way to clean the carbs I just the tank and side fairings off and popped the valve covers off (took some effort with a thin screwdriver). Took the springs and needles and cleaned them with some gas. Stuck some thin metal down through the jets (the carbs were surprisingly clean actually). Put everything back together. There's a couple videos on YouTube on how to do it too.

[SLOWn60]

Glad for you to read it's working!

[ducatiman]

Carbs must be removed to adequately clean them. I'm not sure what you did or didn't do based on youtube vids.

The bowls (underside of carbs) must be removed to reach the actual jets. Attempting this with carbs on the bike is a exercise in futility...if not an accident waiting to happen.

36 miles in 7 years? Was fuel left in the system the entire time? If so, you'll need a very serious carb service and a tank flush for starters.

[garyg199]

I understand that you need to pull them in order to properly clean them. However under time restraints I figured I would just pop the covers off and take a look and try to clean what I could instead of taking them off. The bike performed decently just with moderate performance decrease when acceleration. Mostly around the 6-8k rpm range. At this point however,I might as well just pull them being I have everything opened up. I pretty much did a "quick and dirty" clean. I was able to get to the jets though.

It was not sitting since 09 with fuel in it getting gummed up. The previous owner had last run it last October so he says. Yes, I haven't pulled the bowls off but otherwise things looks decent. Carb 1 had a bit more gunk in it but it really wasn't much. Needles were clean and in good shape. I'm going to start it up and see how it runs from what I have done this far. I'll probably end up pulling them after and getting into the bowls. Just want to see if I made any improvement by not taking them off.

Another question from a whoopsie I made...got the carb screws mixed up and forgot that they are different sizes. Does anyone know which ones go where?

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by garyg199

I understand that you need to pull them in order to properly clean them. However under time restraints I figured I would just pop the covers off and take a look and try to clean what I could instead of taking them off. The bike performed decently just with moderate performance decrease when acceleration. Mostly around the 6-8k rpm range. At this point however,I might as well just pull them being I have everything opened up. I pretty much did a "quick and dirty" clean. I was able to get to the jets though.

It was not sitting since 09 with fuel in it getting gummed up. The previous owner had last run it last October so he says. Yes, I haven't pulled the bowls off but otherwise things looks decent. Carb 1 had a bit more gunk in it but it really wasn't much. Needles were clean and in good shape. I'm going to start it up and see how it runs from what I have done this far. I'll probably end up pulling them after and getting into the bowls. Just want to see if I made any improvement by not taking them off.

Another question from a whoopsie I made...got the carb screws mixed up and forgot that they are different sizes. Does anyone know which ones go where?

If you haven't pulled the bowls then you haven't cleaned the jets.

To be honest and frank, you didn't clean anything. The dirty part of the carbs, where all the "action" happens, are in the bowls. This can't even be classified as a "quick and dirty clean". The only reason to pull the top off is if you have a sticky slide and need to clean it OR need to shim the needle. That's it. There is no cleaning to be done other than the slide from the top of the carb.

The YouTube video you watched was entirely incorrect and full of false information if they said this would do anything. To add insult to injury, if there WAS anything in the main jet, and you knocked it out, now it's just floating around the bowl waiting to be sucked up into the start jet or pilot jet, which will only increase issues.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by garyg199

.......Spray some carb cleaner and dropped some seafoam. The whole lot. Covered the carbs back up and tonight I tried to start it and it would begin to turn over for a second and then just nothing. Did I mess up somewhere?.........

Welcome, Gary !!!

You may have created a hydro-lock (dangerous for internal parts) by pouring all that liquid down the carbs.

We understand your natural excitement for a new bike, but stop, take a break and study the proper way to work in the engine, before you destroy it.

This is how to properly service the intake system:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Removing_J_bike_carbs

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Intake

[garyg199]

Yknow what you guys are totally right. I feel stupid now. I know these things but I guess I did in fact get some tunnel vision and went to the wrong parts of the internet for misinformation. Oh well. Still learning. I'm going to pull the carbs off for sure and do it the right way. I've done it before on my old gs500 so I don't know why I thought this was okay. I was and am just excited and want to get her running like a top. Took the easy way instead of the hard way which just made more work for myself! Duh!

Do you guys think my issue was in fact a dirty set of carbs? It's bogging when I'm passing the 7k rpm range. Not smooth at all. Have to have the throttle open to climb up to speed and it's not very quick. Or as quick as a 250 should be.

[Motofool]

Yes, carbs are not clean.

For a bike like this one, you will need to go over the whole maintenance schedule, because all that service, except valve's adjustment, is needed before putting miles under than baby.

Lubrication of all points and replacement of fluids, plus tires maybe, are surely due.

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Service_Schedule

Congratulations !!!

[ducatiman]

"Decided to pop the carb covers off without removing the carbs fully and clean the jets. I removed the needles , springs etc and stuck some wire down in the jets. Spray some carb cleaner "

Oi.....not good for diaphragm rubber, permanent distortion can occur.

If you consider or seek a quicker path to riding *sooner than later*, PM me.

[garyg199]

ninjette.org guru

ducatiman's Avatar

Name: Gordon
Location: new york
Join Date: Sep 2009

Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '98 HONDA VFR800

Posts: 292
"Decided to pop the carb covers off without removing the carbs fully and clean the jets. I removed the needles , springs etc and stuck some wire down in the jets. Spray some carb cleaner "

Didn't spray it directly on the diaphragm. However I did get some on the one and I noticed that very quickly. I think it's okay though. Thanks for the info everyone!

[Ghostt]