ninjette.org

Go Back   ninjette.org > 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R > 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old August 13th, 2022, 05:36 PM   #1
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
After a great day of riding, bike won't run. Help troubleshooting?

Hi, everyone!

Last week I rode my bike (2005 Ninja 250R, 4500 miles) for about 5 hours... great time! I brought it home hot, parked in the garage, and 3 days later went to start it up, and all it will do is crank... doesn't even try to start. I'll share the quick back-story, then share what I've done so far.

BACKSTORY
Bike had sat in garage for about 3 years. I pulled, stripped, and cleaned the carbs, flushed and cleaned the fuel tank, put it all back together, and it had been running great for a few weeks... until this episode.

WHAT'S HAPPENING
When I tried starting the bike after sitting a few days after a successful ride, it would crank fine, but does not attempt to start... no combustion. Tried choking it, thinking maybe it was too cold. Still wouldn't start. Tried with a little throttle, still wouldn't start. Confirmed fuel is coming from bleeds under both bowls. My first thought was "carbs must be gummed up again". Then I went through the following...

WHAT I'VE DONE SO FAR
  • Ensured fully charged battery throughout work and testing.
  • Removed and cleaned the carbs again, reinstalled, no luck.
  • Inspected the air filter. It was deteriorating, so I removed it, cleaned the air box out, replaced with new filter from dealer. Checked all the airways (all clear). Tried starting again. Still no luck.
  • Checked all the fuel and vent lines. All clear. Carbs are fully getting fuel.
  • Removed spark plugs, tested for spark against engine, and both had good spark. Cleaned, checked gaps (.7) and replaced. Still no luck.
  • Pulled the carburetor again, and this time installed a factory rebuild kit with new needles, jets, pins, gaskets, washers, o-rings. Reassembled, tested again. Bowls filled with fuel, still no combustion.

So, I'm really at a loss guys. I've tested everything I can think of... air, fuel, spark. I'm really perplexed because it was running great before I set it up for a few days.

Any thoughts on what I might try next? Thank you!
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote




Old August 15th, 2022, 06:13 AM   #2
jkv45
Rev Limiter
 
jkv45's Avatar
 
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
Hmmm...you have covered a lot of the possible issues.

After a starting attempt, have you looked at the plugs to see if they are wet or dry?

Are you charging between attempts?

How old is the fuel? Any chance you picked up a significant amount of water or condensation?

I might try some new fuel, bypassing the tank, after draining the old fuel from the floatbowls.
jkv45 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 07:29 AM   #3
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: Mesa, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T EX250F-street Ninja250R-race CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR VFR750F

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Pour about 2-3cc petrol down into airbox
wait 30s
Does it start now?

Last futzed with by DannoXYZ; August 15th, 2022 at 11:10 AM.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
Old August 15th, 2022, 10:32 AM   #4
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by jkv45 View Post
Hmmm...you have covered a lot of the possible issues.

After a starting attempt, have you looked at the plugs to see if they are wet or dry?
Still dry.
Quote:
Are you charging between attempts?
Fully charged.
Quote:
How old is the fuel? Any chance you picked up a significant amount of water or condensation?
A week oldÖ no condensation at all.
Quote:
I might try some new fuel, bypassing the tank, after draining the old fuel from the floatbowls.
Iím pretty confident the fuel isnít the issue on this one since the tank was cleaned, lines are clear, and fuel is fresh.
Thank you so much for the feedback!
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 10:32 AM   #5
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
Pour about 2-3cc down into airbox
wait 30s
Does it start now?
I just tried this, and no change.
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 10:43 AM   #6
ducatiman
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
ducatiman's Avatar
 
Name: Gordon
Location: new york
Join Date: Sep 2009

Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '07 DUCATI SS800 '19 HONDA CBR650R

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Nov '18, Mar '17
"2005 Ninja 250R, 4500 miles"

have valve clearances ever been checked? No mention in your prior posts.
__________________________________________________
gordon@customcarbservices.com
Custom Carb Service
www.customcarbservices.com
ducatiman is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 11:01 AM   #7
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by ducatiman View Post
"2005 Ninja 250R, 4500 miles"

have valve clearances ever been checked? No mention in your prior posts.
No, I havenít done thisÖ I donít have experience with that, but Iíll do some research on how. Iím pretty much game for getting my hands dirty with anything.
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 11:11 AM   #8
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: Mesa, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T EX250F-street Ninja250R-race CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR VFR750F

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by JabezStone View Post
I just tried this, and no change.
Then forget looking at carbs, you don't have fuel-flow problem as even directly putting fuel into engine doesn't make it run.

So next ... ignition, compression (related is valve-timing). Do compression-test before and after valve-clearance check & adjustment.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 11:41 AM   #9
jkv45
Rev Limiter
 
jkv45's Avatar
 
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
It's odd that it just ran fine not long ago.

Checking the valves is a good idea, though unusual, it's possible a rocker popped off or there's something unusual going on under the cover...

If all that checks out, a couple last-ditch effort things to try would be Starting Fluid (Gordon doesn't like it because it's bad for any plastic in the carb. Maybe lift the slides and open the throttle plates before giving it a shot). If it sputters at all, it tells you there is a fuel/carb related issue.

The other thing would be trying to bump-start it.

Oil level is good? No chance of fuel draining into the crankcase?
jkv45 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 12:02 PM   #10
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
Then forget looking at carbs, you don't have fuel-flow problem as even directly putting fuel into engine doesn't make it run.

So next ... ignition, compression (related is valve-timing). Do compression-test before and after valve-clearance check & adjustment.
Okay, so I gave it another try and this time opened the throttle… I got combustion! It didn’t fully start and it’s not running, but this is a good sign of life!

So, now I’m thinking I’d better break my carbs down again and do a more thorough job, cleaning out the hidden channels. I skipped those this last time.
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 15th, 2022, 12:12 PM   #11
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Itís running!!!!
I canít even tell you how thrilled I am right nowÖ I donít want to shut it off! 😂🤣
I really didnít do anything different, but Danno and JKVís thoughts about getting fuel through the air box made me just try it again and after a few cycles it just fired up.
I do think now that Iím dealing with a carb issue, so I think pulling it back off and thoroughly cleaning and adjusting it is the next move.

Thank you everyone! Iíll reply back when thatís done and hopefully Iíll just have good news to share.
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.
Old August 15th, 2022, 01:04 PM   #12
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Here it is!
Attached Files
File Type: mov trim.13526962-56F6-4218-A414-266AE16328BD.MOV (12.05 MB, 10 views)
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 16th, 2022, 12:41 AM   #13
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: Mesa, AZ
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T EX250F-street Ninja250R-race CBR250R-MC19 CBR250RR-MC22 NSR350R-MC21 VF500F CBR600RR VFR750F

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
It's not uncommon for used bikes to work briefly then die. This is caused by crap in tank taking their time to work their way towards exit and clog petcock and filter.

So in addition to carbs, pull petcock and rebuild it with K&L kit.

Also fish out internal filter from fuel-hose between petcock and carbs. Toss it and replace with external filter that you can inspect easily to determine amount of debris collected and replace as needed.

DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
Old August 16th, 2022, 05:51 AM   #14
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Thanks, Danno. I placed an order for filters and spring clamps through Amazon the other day and they should arrive today. Looking forward to getting the inline filters in place, and theyíre very cheap in bulk these days.

Iím not having luck locating a petcock rebuild kit yet, but will keep searching. Thanks again!
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 16th, 2022, 06:30 AM   #15
jkv45
Rev Limiter
 
jkv45's Avatar
 
Name: Jay
Location: WI
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
It's not uncommon for used bikes to work briefly then die. This is caused by crap in tank taking their time to work their way towards exit and clog petcock and filter.

So in addition to carbs, pull petcock and rebuild it with K&L kit.

Also fish out internal filter from fuel-hose between petcock and carbs. Toss it and replace with external filter that you can inspect easily to determine amount of debris collected and replace as needed.
Make sure you check this.
jkv45 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 16th, 2022, 04:55 PM   #16
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
So, I think I may have an issue… would love your thoughts.

While riding around the city today, I thought I noticed a noise coming up through the area in front of my gas tank (top of the engine).

After coming home and installing my new in-line filter, I took it for a spin and very clearly heard the noise again.

What’s happening is, between about 2500 and 3000 RPMs, I hear a vibration (probably more of a rattle) coming from that area. I was able to replicate it multiple times by going slow in first and second gears at those RPMs.

I’m not sure if it’s normal, or cause for concern. Any thoughts?

Last futzed with by JabezStone; August 16th, 2022 at 06:21 PM.
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 16th, 2022, 09:01 PM   #17
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
FALSE ALARM!

So, after some forum searching I suspected the issue was a CCT rattle, and just pulled, cleaned, and reinstalled it... and noise is gone! It sounds amazing now.

Good info on the ninja250 wiki, along with a nice (but oooooold) walkthrough video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4eH0d2E73g
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
Old August 17th, 2022, 08:44 AM   #18
thedrewski86
ninjette.org guru
 
thedrewski86's Avatar
 
Name: Drew
Location: SoCal
Join Date: Jul 2013

Motorcycle(s): 2007 SV650S 2005 EX250F

Posts: 392
Quote:
Originally Posted by JabezStone View Post
FALSE ALARM!

So, after some forum searching I suspected the issue was a CCT rattle, and just pulled, cleaned, and reinstalled it... and noise is gone! It sounds amazing now.

Good info on the ninja250 wiki, along with a nice (but oooooold) walkthrough video here: https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=E4eH0d2E73g
That video is great I had a similar cam chain noise the other week (after the bike sat for a while) and started to go down this path myself. Thought for a few minutes before busting the tools out and fired it up again: oil warmed up and the CCT clicked out a little more. Noise gone. Oh well, I think I'll clean the CCT later! I was outta Mtn Dew like Travis had in the video, so I wasn't prepared anyway.
__________________________________________________
Don't think, look!
thedrewski86 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 17th, 2022, 01:10 PM   #19
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Hahaha! Mountain Dew would have certainly added to my experience. 😂
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


Old August 17th, 2022, 01:16 PM   #20
JabezStone
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Jay
Location: Grand Rapids, MI
Join Date: Aug 2022

Motorcycle(s): 2005 Ninja 250r

Posts: 12
Quote:
Originally Posted by DannoXYZ View Post
It's not uncommon for used bikes to work briefly then die. This is caused by crap in tank taking their time to work their way towards exit and clog petcock and filter.

So in addition to carbs, pull petcock and rebuild it with K&L kit.

Also fish out internal filter from fuel-hose between petcock and carbs. Toss it and replace with external filter that you can inspect easily to determine amount of debris collected and replace as needed.

Got itÖ Thanks so much!
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 0A6EDB49-573B-457C-A1AE-E74FE0D5FCE5.jpg (99.4 KB, 7 views)
File Type: jpg D4680718-42A6-4A2A-95E2-231A4881BF61.jpg (57.9 KB, 9 views)
JabezStone is offline   Reply With Quote


1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.
Reply




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
Wahhhh!!! My Bike Won't Start/Run/Idle... Can Someone Help!!??? kkim 2008 - 2012 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 67 July 29th, 2018 04:03 PM
Bike won't run above 5K rpm edward2014 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 12 October 30th, 2014 08:51 AM
Bought first bike and 1 day later it won't start: do I have a junk bike? brendandubs 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 43 May 11th, 2014 07:59 AM
bike won't run after several miles shikikanzero 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 9 January 13th, 2012 04:27 PM
[visordown.com] - Kent Police clampdown on May Day bike run Ninjette Newsbot Motorcycling News 0 May 5th, 2009 11:00 AM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Motorcycle Safety Foundation

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 06:36 PM.


Website uptime monitoring Host-tracker.com
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2022, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2022 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Except where otherwise noted, all site contents are © Copyright 2022 ninjette.org, All rights reserved.