Area-P tuner installed

old3 · December 22nd, 2012, 05:06 PM

My Area-P tuner arrived today. I have an Akra slip on for a 250 and a decatted stock header.

AWESOME.

The engine now pretty much totally exceeds anything I ever expected a 250 Ninja based engine could ever be, and it was already doing that stock! The torque is even better than before, pulls clean from 2500 RPM, hauls with a hit into the low mid around 4500, then flat pulls hard to around 12500. It might fall off there just a tad but I'm having trouble shifting fast enough to avoid the limiter. It popped the front wheel off the ground in the 1-2 shift.

WOW.

Open up the exhaust, add this tuner and let it rip. I'm probably running a touch fat too, still waiting for my K&N air filter panel.

Side benefit, I had upgraded to 93 octane last few weeks to track down a metallic tingle I could hear around 4-5k RPMs. I wrote it off as a fairing noise as the premium fuel seemed to lessen but not cure it.

Well, it is gone now. Had it earlier today, can't get it despite loading it hard uphill. It would do that everywhere before, flat land, down hill, anytime you applied fuel in that RPM range.

old3 · December 22nd, 2012, 05:22 PM

Install tips. Whole job took about an hour.

I was able to drop the fairings onto the front fender and prop the fuel tank up with a 2x4.

Pull out the under rear seat tray and trim the plastic on the right front corner so the cable can run smoothly under the steel brace back there. It smooths the angle of the wire and no possibility of the seat pan crushing/damaging the wire. The tray pops out with 2 cotters and 2 pins. Very simple.

Loosen the next forward brace to fit everything under it.

Pull out the battery cover and trim that along the right side too to allow the cable to pass without obstruction.

I needed to use a long needle nose plier to release the right side injector connector. Best to use a flat tool to compress it rather than man handle it and damage it.

Be sure to run the wires under the heavy cable under the tank, good room in there to stash everything and it pluged right in.

I have been replacing the factory bolts as I go along with KTM and Husky 8mm head bolts for everything in 5 and 6mm. This allows you to tear it apart with a single 8mm T handle. What a treat to have this on a bike, I was spoiled by no Japanese bikes for years! Seat, fairings, side panels are now one size tool instead of 3.

Next time I pull the front top black covers those phillips screws are gone too! Starting to strip their heads already. Cheesy junk.

Jiggles · December 22nd, 2012, 06:17 PM

You upgraded to a less efficient slower burning fuel?

Alex · December 22nd, 2012, 06:37 PM

Nice report!

old3 · December 22nd, 2012, 07:01 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Jiggles

You upgraded to a less efficient slower burning fuel?

To fight off detonation/pre-ignition?

Yes. Why?

edit!

Oh, missed the funny face. LOL, LMFAO, OMG, har-har-har!

Somchai · December 23rd, 2012, 12:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old3

To fight off detonation/pre-ignition?

Yes. Why?

edit!

Oh, missed the funny face. LOL, LMFAO, OMG, har-har-har!

Jim, to be honest I can hardly believe that the 300 should have probs with the ignition. The 300 is compared to the 250 much more emission-oriented, look at the CR and the setup of the ignition only and you'll see.
My 250 runs very well with 91 RON thats what you know as 87 MON.

csmith12 · December 23rd, 2012, 08:24 AM

old3 · December 23rd, 2012, 10:12 AM

Don't have any other explanation. In NJ we get crap winter blends mandated by the state. Even the premium sucks.

The sound was like thin aluminum foil being wrinkled. Tinkle, tinkle, tinkle. It did not sound like the common death rattle of a car going uphill on low grade fuel. My Mustang is tuned for 93 and it will make a racket if you run low grade fuel and hammer it. Tough to describe but easy to hear over an open Akra can and open header, over wing noise on the highway in a full face helmet so loud enough.

I loaded the crap out of the engine uphill, 2500 RPMs, WOT. Noise is gone. I could dial up that noise at will from 4-5k everytime. I had thought it must be something else, like a vibration sensitive rattle of a bracket or something, the guts of the horn, whatever but the tune is what stopped it.

I'll be curious to hear if other 300 owners ever report the same noise. Unfortunately alot of them are buying their first bike so they are kinda lost with what they hear.

allanoue · December 23rd, 2012, 10:20 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old3

Tough to describe but easy to hear over an open Akra can and open header, over wing noise on the highway in a full face helmet so loud enough.

Any chance that you could record the noise and share, for us noobs?

old3 · December 23rd, 2012, 11:02 AM

I'd rather not have had any detonation to begin with, I'm not gonna do it deliberately! I don't have anything that would "hear" the sound over wind across the device anyway

If you have it, you should be able to hear it clearly at 4k to 5k RPM, just roll on the throttle faster than the engine can keep up, load it at 3500 RPM and listen. If you hear anything except the intake/exhaust, like what I described, that is it.

Area-P said the bikes are lean inj the lower range, I'm betting that is it. Shooting for fuel economy they went too lean. Pretty common tune for Japanese bikes since the 1970s, lean low, OK to fat up top.

kbryant · December 23rd, 2012, 11:06 AM

Thank you for the comments on the FI Micro Programmer. Our web page is now up

http://www.areapnolimits.com/product...a-300-2013.php

jaybo · December 24th, 2012, 01:01 PM

Hey was wondering which tune you used. Since you have deleted the cat and snorkel and have a slip on, I'm guessing you used the tune for the full exhaust with the snorkel removed and k@n replacement filter. Congrats on the mods coming together with the tune and the bike running like it should! Also thanks for posting info on the cats

old3 · December 24th, 2012, 03:06 PM

I asked they load the tune they used for their full system and K&N panel filter. That filter should be installed in the next few days too, just waiting on UPS.

The decat was easy if you weld and I'm sure really let the slip on combo work to its best potential.

Somchai · December 25th, 2012, 01:02 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by old3

Don't have any other explanation. In NJ we get crap winter blends mandated by the state. Even the premium sucks.

The sound was like thin aluminum foil being wrinkled. Tinkle, tinkle, tinkle. It did not sound like the common death rattle of a car going uphill on low grade fuel. My Mustang is tuned for 93 and it will make a racket if you run low grade fuel and hammer it. Tough to describe but easy to hear over an open Akra can and open header, over wing noise on the highway in a full face helmet so loud enough.

I loaded the crap out of the engine uphill, 2500 RPMs, WOT. Noise is gone. I could dial up that noise at will from 4-5k everytime. I had thought it must be something else, like a vibration sensitive rattle of a bracket or something, the guts of the horn, whatever but the tune is what stopped it.

I'll be curious to hear if other 300 owners ever report the same noise. Unfortunately alot of them are buying their first bike so they are kinda lost with what they hear.

Ok, yesterday i went out and tried to provoke detonation from pre-ignition (I'd advanced my ignition by 5°) - absolutly no chance.

The benzine we get here is 91 roz (your 87 moz) only and the quality i don't want to talk about - there is not much (i always compare this to Germany).

So for me this is really strange since the cr of the 250 is 11.6 to 1 and the 300 is 10.6 to one and here's a picture of the ignition-curves (I hope all my informations are right, correct me please if not).
The orange line is mine with 5° advanced,
the dark-green is the US-carbed with BRT-TIS,
the brown one is the European-Version,
the dark-blue is the standard Thai-Version,
the yellow line is the US-carbed standard,
and the light-blue is the new 300 Ninja.

Since I'd advanced my ignition my water-temperature is lower then before, so this indicates that there is absolut no problem in this range. And please remember the earlier Kwakis and the others also, before the companies started to care about emissions, always run the ignition in this ranges up to 45° degrees (retarding the ignition and lowering the cr with running lean is for emission-control). The very best example about this is the Chevy Corvette from the 70's to the 90's.
But at least I'm believing you, because you're sitting on the bike.

old3 · December 25th, 2012, 07:20 AM

IDK what to try to really confirm it is preignition but I can't even think of anything else it could be. It shouldn't be, but the noise is there. Engine source, clutch in it goes away, RPM and throttle load sensitive, not speed dependant. It got better with the tune till I dumped the gas can gas in it...

I'll be adding premium fuel soon, the roads are snow and ice covered right now so ASAP, and I'll follow up.

jaybo · December 26th, 2012, 06:37 PM

Yeah I weld so I will probably do it this week, its to cold to ride so I can have the bike down for a few days If I need. Ive got some more weight cutting to do to ha ha. Unnecessary but its in my blood. I spent hundreds on titanium on my mx bikes but wont be going there this time.

December 22nd, 2012, 05:06 PM	#1
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	Area-P tuner installed My Area-P tuner arrived today. I have an Akra slip on for a 250 and a decatted stock header. AWESOME. The engine now pretty much totally exceeds anything I ever expected a 250 Ninja based engine could ever be, and it was already doing that stock! The torque is even better than before, pulls clean from 2500 RPM, hauls with a hit into the low mid around 4500, then flat pulls hard to around 12500. It might fall off there just a tad but I'm having trouble shifting fast enough to avoid the limiter. It popped the front wheel off the ground in the 1-2 shift. WOW. Open up the exhaust, add this tuner and let it rip. I'm probably running a touch fat too, still waiting for my K&N air filter panel. Side benefit, I had upgraded to 93 octane last few weeks to track down a metallic tingle I could hear around 4-5k RPMs. I wrote it off as a fairing noise as the premium fuel seemed to lessen but not cure it. Well, it is gone now. Had it earlier today, can't get it despite loading it hard uphill. It would do that everywhere before, flat land, down hill, anytime you applied fuel in that RPM range.

December 22nd, 2012, 06:17 PM	#3
Jiggles Jigglin' your Jiglets Name: Sean Location: San Jose, Ca Join Date: Jun 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2009 K1300S, 2013 Ninja 300, 2011 Ninja 250R, Faster than Unregistered's ninjette Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 1 MOTM - Apr '13	You upgraded to a less efficient slower burning fuel? __________________________________________________ If the Ninja 250 doesn't have enough power for you, then you don't know how to ride it. AFM #676 Supersports are for n00bs

December 22nd, 2012, 06:37 PM	#4
Alex ninjette.org dude Name: 1 guess :-) Location: SF Bay Area Join Date: Jun 2008 Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 7	Nice report! __________________________________________________ Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org ninjette.org Terms of Service Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first. The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)

December 23rd, 2012, 08:24 AM	#7
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	__________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

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December 22nd, 2012, 05:22 PM	#2
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	Install tips. Whole job took about an hour. I was able to drop the fairings onto the front fender and prop the fuel tank up with a 2x4. Pull out the under rear seat tray and trim the plastic on the right front corner so the cable can run smoothly under the steel brace back there. It smooths the angle of the wire and no possibility of the seat pan crushing/damaging the wire. The tray pops out with 2 cotters and 2 pins. Very simple. Loosen the next forward brace to fit everything under it. Pull out the battery cover and trim that along the right side too to allow the cable to pass without obstruction. I needed to use a long needle nose plier to release the right side injector connector. Best to use a flat tool to compress it rather than man handle it and damage it. Be sure to run the wires under the heavy cable under the tank, good room in there to stash everything and it pluged right in. I have been replacing the factory bolts as I go along with KTM and Husky 8mm head bolts for everything in 5 and 6mm. This allows you to tear it apart with a single 8mm T handle. What a treat to have this on a bike, I was spoiled by no Japanese bikes for years! Seat, fairings, side panels are now one size tool instead of 3. Next time I pull the front top black covers those phillips screws are gone too! Starting to strip their heads already. Cheesy junk.

December 23rd, 2012, 10:12 AM	#8
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	Don't have any other explanation. In NJ we get crap winter blends mandated by the state. Even the premium sucks. The sound was like thin aluminum foil being wrinkled. Tinkle, tinkle, tinkle. It did not sound like the common death rattle of a car going uphill on low grade fuel. My Mustang is tuned for 93 and it will make a racket if you run low grade fuel and hammer it. Tough to describe but easy to hear over an open Akra can and open header, over wing noise on the highway in a full face helmet so loud enough. I loaded the crap out of the engine uphill, 2500 RPMs, WOT. Noise is gone. I could dial up that noise at will from 4-5k everytime. I had thought it must be something else, like a vibration sensitive rattle of a bracket or something, the guts of the horn, whatever but the tune is what stopped it. I'll be curious to hear if other 300 owners ever report the same noise. Unfortunately alot of them are buying their first bike so they are kinda lost with what they hear.

December 23rd, 2012, 11:02 AM	#10
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	I'd rather not have had any detonation to begin with, I'm not gonna do it deliberately! I don't have anything that would "hear" the sound over wind across the device anyway If you have it, you should be able to hear it clearly at 4k to 5k RPM, just roll on the throttle faster than the engine can keep up, load it at 3500 RPM and listen. If you hear anything except the intake/exhaust, like what I described, that is it. Area-P said the bikes are lean inj the lower range, I'm betting that is it. Shooting for fuel economy they went too lean. Pretty common tune for Japanese bikes since the 1970s, lean low, OK to fat up top.

December 23rd, 2012, 11:06 AM	#11
kbryant Area P Name: Kerry Location: SoCal & South Florida Join Date: Dec 2008 Motorcycle(s): Too many to list Posts: 439	Thank you for the comments on the FI Micro Programmer. Our web page is now up http://www.areapnolimits.com/product...a-300-2013.php

December 24th, 2012, 01:01 PM	#12
jaybo ninjette.org member Name: Jason Location: Northwest FL Join Date: Dec 2012 Motorcycle(s): 13 ninja 300, 04 crf 250, 06 yz125 Posts: 43	Hey was wondering which tune you used. Since you have deleted the cat and snorkel and have a slip on, I'm guessing you used the tune for the full exhaust with the snorkel removed and k@n replacement filter. Congrats on the mods coming together with the tune and the bike running like it should! Also thanks for posting info on the cats

December 24th, 2012, 03:06 PM	#13
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	I asked they load the tune they used for their full system and K&N panel filter. That filter should be installed in the next few days too, just waiting on UPS. The decat was easy if you weld and I'm sure really let the slip on combo work to its best potential.

December 25th, 2012, 07:20 AM	#15
old3 ninjette.org sage Name: Jim Location: NJ Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 300, KTM EXC610SMR Posts: 913	IDK what to try to really confirm it is preignition but I can't even think of anything else it could be. It shouldn't be, but the noise is there. Engine source, clutch in it goes away, RPM and throttle load sensitive, not speed dependant. It got better with the tune till I dumped the gas can gas in it... I'll be adding premium fuel soon, the roads are snow and ice covered right now so ASAP, and I'll follow up.

December 26th, 2012, 06:37 PM	#16
jaybo ninjette.org member Name: Jason Location: Northwest FL Join Date: Dec 2012 Motorcycle(s): 13 ninja 300, 04 crf 250, 06 yz125 Posts: 43	Yeah I weld so I will probably do it this week, its to cold to ride so I can have the bike down for a few days If I need. Ive got some more weight cutting to do to ha ha. Unnecessary but its in my blood. I spent hundreds on titanium on my mx bikes but wont be going there this time.