Post pics of your most recent track/racing BP (Body Positioning)

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by choneofakind

^^ Love white suits

interesting light deflection pattern just below your left foot. I assume that's from the heat?

No.... it's from doing cool stuff while riding in the N group.

[adouglas]

Do they make fingertip sliders?

[Sirref]

^

you have to install them yourself, I know a guy who had it done to his because he's addicted to dragging his hand on the ground through the bowl at nccar (stupid long corner)

[csmith12]

Finger sliders.... hahahahaha naw imma pass on that noise.

Gezzz, I need some rearsets bad.

[Floki]

One of my pictures was featured on sportbike track time's Instagram lol

[csmith12]

Nice!

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Finger sliders.... hahahahaha naw imma pass on that noise.

[green_bread]

Thats pretty sweet @Floki!

[Supernam]

If anyone is bored, can you give me some pointers on body positioning? I still have stock clipons and rearsets, will aftermarket help? I find I'm almost sitting straight up all the time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=wamVE6C9B5w

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Supernam

If anyone is bored, can you give me some pointers on body positioning? I still have stock clipons and rearsets, will aftermarket help? I find I'm almost sitting straight up all the time.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eRf...x1OvcSou2C01P7

Cool stuff Supernam! Sit back in the seat, always have a knee locked on the side of the tank (both knees in the straights). And yes, rearsets and clipons will help alot.

How tall are you?

[Supernam]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Cool stuff Supernam! Sit back in the seat, always have a knee locked on the side of the tank (both knees in the straights). And yes, rearsets and clipons will help alot.

How tall are you?

I am 5'7" and when I watch myself I know I'm not very smooth. It looks better when you can't see me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FoaxdhT7pcg

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Supernam

I am 5'7" and when I watch myself I know I'm not very smooth. It looks better when you can't see me.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=9eRf...2C01P7&index=2

It's not as bad as you think, just use your time more wisely. For example;

Get your bumm off the seat earlier before the corner and pick the bike up before trying to climb back up on it. Start there along with sitting back and knee on the tank at all times.

[adouglas]

Yeah, slide back. I had a much easier time of it once I did. I'm 5'7" too, BTW.

Fact: It'll feel really exaggerated once you start getting off the bike enough.

As someone still working on BP, I'll add this to what Chris said about moving your butt:

Pick some reference points on the bike. For example, imagine your armpit over the gas cap. Think about looking around the inside edge of the windscreen instead of through it or over the top of it (i.e. "kiss the mirror"). Things like this will help to get your upper body down and over, so you don't get crossed-up when you do move your butt.

One thing I struggled with and still haven't quite gotten right is relaxing and dropping the inside shoulder. Imagine that inside elbow pointing at the ground, rather than out to the side. Imagine the center of your chest pointing at the bike's long axis, rather than at the ground.

Look at pictures of top-level racers where the camera is on the inside of the turn and the shot is from the side. See how you're looking at their back, not the side of their torso? See how they're relaxed and down on the tank? They're almost hugging the bike... shoulder is down.

MotoGP riders drag elbows as well as knees. True that their equipment allows them to achieve lean angles approaching 60 degrees or so, but still, that should tell you something about what they're doing with the upper body. The inside elbow is way down and to get it there, you have to relax your torso.

Look at this pic of Pol Espargaro. Draw an imaginary line from his spine through the center of his chest. Where is it pointed? In at the bike--- at its centerline, not out and away.

Notice a few other things:

- He has only one butt cheek off the seat.
- You can see the gas cap, which means his whole body is well off to the inside.
- His helmet is fully to the right side of the windscreen, which means he's not crossed up.
- His torso is parallel to the bike's centerline.

[green_bread]

Couple more from this past weekend:

[csmith12]

Gettin' it done Adam!

[higear223]

Originally Posted by choneofakind

^^ Love white suits

interesting light deflection pattern just below your left foot. I assume that's from the heat?

Yeah, what is that?

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by higear223

Yeah, what is that?

It's from heat and wind. The r6's fairings shoot air down at that angle relative to the rearset, so it creates that effect when the conditions are right (temps of tarmac, engine, air and speed).

Kyle Hunter (track photographer) loves to shoot temp effects like that. He positions himself and sets up the camera specifically to catch them.

[green_bread]

Nothing better than a good track photographer with a great eye for things like that!

[adouglas]

@green_bread

That's what I'm talkin' about. Your BP showcases everything I mentioned in my last post. Wish I was able to do that... eventually I will, once I figure out what that weird twisty thing in my right hand is for.

No, not that weird twisty thing. The one on the bike. You perverts.
@Supernam, check it out.

[Supernam]

Originally Posted by adouglas

@green_bread

That's what I'm talkin' about. Your BP showcases everything I mentioned in my last post. Wish I was able to do that... eventually I will, once I figure out what that weird twisty thing in my right hand is for.

No, not that weird twisty thing. The one on the bike. You perverts.
@Supernam, check it out.

Yeah I see it and I'm dreaming about being able to do that one day.

I tried sliding back in the seat but it then becomes really uncomfortable because the stock pegs are so far forward, I feel like a pretzel. I'm going to try all those things and hopefully there will be improvement my next time around.

[M42]

Shenny in the morning vs afternoon



crazy track, 4 people crashed in novice (one of them in front of me, on a pregen ninjette too), I caught a nail in my tire the night before (rode to the track in a huge rainstorm) and had to shell out for a supercorsa - proceeded to run off into the grass on the next session because it wasn't warmed up. It was nuts. Learned a lot. Corkscrew can suck it.

[Sirref]

Looking good! just need to focus on the other aspects of going fast now

How'd you like shenny?

it's my favorite track

[algs26]

Originally Posted by M42

Shenny in the morning vs afternoon

Who improves that much in a few sessions? Sandbagger!

[M42]

Shenny is pretty hard for someone with bad suspension. It turns out the springs in the gsxr front end were replaced with something even stiffer than stock, for like a 200lb person (and I'm like 135 in leathers). So the bumpy patching in turns 1+2, the hook, and corkscrew unsettled the bike every time. If they repaved those turns, I'd have no complaints.

First thing on the list of winter work is racetech springs for my weight.

Also comparison pic between TD 1 at main a month ago and yesterday at shenny, similar turn, similar time of day/session. Just flipped the left image.

[green_bread]

Looking good @M42. Sometimes, the BP thing just "clicks" and you find the reference points that work for you to anchor yourself to the bike without even thinking about it. I can remember the exact day when things "clicked" for me, last year. Get ready... youre about to start improving even more, now!

[Sirref]

^ I've noticed that as well

though after it clicks and your head is down it can actually slow you down for a bit until your mind adjusts to the different visual angle caused by having your head so much closer to the ground

[M42]

Yeah, There was a definite click during the last few sessions of my first trackday, and there was also two yesterday. You can actually see where it happens on the gopros too

Originally Posted by algs26

Who improves that much in a few sessions? Sandbagger!

Probably had to do with that supercorsa. Much better than the DR2 I had on there before. I have to get that off asap though, my shizz will get rekt if I ride with it on the street.

[adouglas]

Getting there. Eyes good, line good (the white spot is the marker I was aiming for), shoulder dropped, relaxed.

This whole day felt great.

Now I just need to give myself permission to go faster and lean more, or vice-versa. This is solid yellow group pace (red-yellow-blue-black, slow to fast).

[Floki]

Body positioning needs some work, but I'm doing something right. Does anyone know what good lap times at Little Tally are on the 250?

[AwDang]

:12's are very respectable

[mgentz]

What is hanging down on the right side of this picture by your foot? Is that the kickstand?

Originally Posted by green_bread

Couple more from this past weekend:

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by mgentz

What is hanging down on the right side of this picture by your foot? Is that the kickstand?

It's the shift lever, there is 100% no chance he is leaning the bike over that far with a side stand still mounted. Looks like the sidestand mount tab is cut off the fame as well.

[green_bread]

^ Correct and correct. It's the shift lever and I have cut the side stand bracket off. Even with the Vortex rearsets adjusted all the way up and back, I still drag the peg and lever from time to time. I think it's because I reinforced the frame in that area to keep the rearset mounts from snapping of in a crash, so now they sick out a little too far. Probably going to take a hacksaw and cut the outer half inch to a full inch off of the peg. The lever, we'll, I can't do too much about it. It's spring loaded so it folds up, at least.

[tgold]

I love that this is my first post, but don't read too much into that fact.

Body position.... Meh.

No, I didn't wade through a thousand posts, but I'll throw this out there. IMO new riders spend far too much time/concentration on body position when there are things that are way more important to focus on. It is far mere important to be thinking clearly about what you are doing on the bike (aside from body position) Am I saying that body position doesn't matter? No. But the priority is lower than most people realize... That is unless your priority is having the coolest pictures.

I'll be the first to admit that I can improve my body position, but I have won many races and a championship with the "crappy" body position you see below:

[csmith12]

Welcome Timm!

How do you like nelson? How is Todd and the MS gang?

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by tgold

I love that this is my first post, but don't read too much into that fact.

Body position.... Meh.

No, I didn't wade through a thousand posts, but I'll throw this out there. IMO new riders spend far too much time/concentration on body position when there are things that are way more important to focus on. It is far mere important to be thinking clearly about what you are doing on the bike (aside from body position) Am I saying that body position doesn't matter? No. But the priority is lower than most people realize... That is unless your priority is having the coolest pictures.

I'll be the first to admit that I can improve my body position, but I have won many races and a championship with the "crappy" body position you see below:

hmmmm....

As a relative beginner I have a different view.

Would you agree that once you reach a certain point, poor body position becomes a limiting factor on your speed?

My thought is that it's a lot easier to adopt good habits early than it is to break bad habits once they're ingrained.

So no, I haven't won a bunch of races, I'm only in my second year of track riding and I'm not too fast. But I have spent some effort on BP and I think I'm doing pretty well. To me that means less to worry about as I improve... I can focus on going faster, knowing that my BP won't be what holds me back.

Of course, my perspective is that of a track rider, not a racer. As a racer, getting fast as soon as possible is important. For a guy like me, it isn't. I'm in it for the fun.

And the coolest pictures.

[tgold]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Welcome Timm!

How do you like nelson? How is Todd and the MS gang?

Thanks csmith12,

Todd and the Moto Series folks are doing well. We have a good group of 250 riders that I got introduced to at the last round of the year. I raced a borrowed pregen Ninja and had a blast, so I'm actually trading My SV650 for a 2010 Ninjette racebike. Really looking forward to having fun on the little bike next year!

Good 'ol Bumps 'n Ledges.... I mean Nelson Ledges is really fun. It's my home track nowadays, even though I live in Buffalo. They say it's a thirteen turn, 2 mile long track, but it's more like seven turns so it's a pretty fast track. A pretty fast lap on a ninjette would have an average speed of right around 90mph.

[csmith12]

Cool Timm!

I love Nelson, we endearingly call it "boot camp" down here. If you can go fast there... you can go fast just about anywhere. lol I raced with MS in 2013-2014, we were almost always pushing down in the low 20's with an occasional 1:20 thrown in the mix for race times.

Tell Todd and the gang I will around a bit more next season, I really miss ya'lls and the good times racin'.

[tgold]

Originally Posted by adouglas

hmmmm....

As a relative beginner I have a different view.

Would you agree that once you reach a certain point, poor body position becomes a limiting factor on your speed?

My thought is that it's a lot easier to adopt good habits early than it is to break bad habits once they're ingrained.

So no, I haven't won a bunch of races, I'm only in my second year of track riding and I'm not too fast. But I have spent some effort on BP and I think I'm doing pretty well. To me that means less to worry about as I improve... I can focus on going faster, knowing that my BP won't be what holds me back.

Of course, my perspective is that of a track rider, not a racer. As a racer, getting fast as soon as possible is important. For a guy like me, it isn't. I'm in it for the fun.

And the coolest pictures.

Yes, I agree about breaking "bad" habits, however, there things like reference points, evaluating front end feel, braking technique, where you are looking, how you are processing information, etc, that are far more valuable and have a bigger payoff than BP in the short term and long term.

Yes, "poor" body position can be a limiting factor to your cornering speed. However, I am not saying it is THE limiting factor. It's the priority that it gets that can be a problem for newer riders. I do some race instruction and one thing that happens very often with new track riders is this scenario: I take a group of 3 or 4 riders (who are riding in line behind me) out to show them a typical race line for the track. We do this for a few sessions and then I wave them by me one at a time to evaluate their performance. Now they are able to follow my lines perfectly when they are behind me, but almost invariably they start going all over the place when I wave them by. Then I have to get back by them and show them the racing line again. Why? Because they are not placing a priority on accurately locating themselves on the racetrack with reference points. It doesn't matter how good your body position is if you can't locate yourself on the track. This is just one example of priority.

Emulating MotoGP riders may be cool, but not always necessary for going fast.

Don't get me wrong, I'm in it for the fun which is exactly the reason I'm going to a 250.

[sharky nrk]

Originally Posted by adouglas

hmmmm....

As a relative beginner I have a different view.

Would you agree that once you reach a certain point, poor body position becomes a limiting factor on your speed?

My thought is that it's a lot easier to adopt good habits early than it is to break bad habits once they're ingrained.

So no, I haven't won a bunch of races, I'm only in my second year of track riding and I'm not too fast. But I have spent some effort on BP and I think I'm doing pretty well. To me that means less to worry about as I improve... I can focus on going faster, knowing that my BP won't be what holds me back.

Of course, my perspective is that of a track rider, not a racer. As a racer, getting fast as soon as possible is important. For a guy like me, it isn't. I'm in it for the fun.

And the coolest pictures.

You know what they say about "opinions and everyone having one" lol. J/K. Honestly there is no right/wrong approach. From a beginner standpoint, there are a lot of things good BP helps with and as such its not a bad idea to instill the right ideas from the get go.

However, there is no "correct" BP for everyone. Riding fast beyond the beginner basics (lol alliteration fumble) becomes as much about what works for you, personally. But that comes after the more important bits like understanding lines, reference points, vision, throttle and brake application, steering inputs, etc.