Ninja making ticking noise from engine area

[zaknifein]

Hey yall!

So I impulse bought a ninja without doing my research and got a lemon. Stupid, I know, but better that it happened with a smaller purchase than a larger one.

Anyways, the previous owner(s) knew diddly or didn't care about maintaining the bike, so when I took her to the mechanic I was in for a treat. Valves were wide open, carbs were dirty and needed to be synced. The fool even put a full exhaust on it and didn't have an exhaust gasket on the head so she was leaking exhaust

I got her back and the mechanic said there was a ticking noise that he can't quite figure out. It kinda sounds like the cam chain noise I've heard on a few youtube videos but I dont know for sure. She's got good power and is running great, should I be worried?

Video here:

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Esh...ature=youtu.be

After cleaning the cam chain tensioner

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfyQ...ature=youtu.be

Edit: 2007 ninja 250r, just turned over to 15k miles

[VaFish]

Ticking or clunking?

The clutch baskets are known to cause a more clunking noise at idle when the bike first starts up. Many people mistake it for a bad bearing in the bottom end.

Ticking noise, only time I have heard is when I adjusted the valves improperly last couple of weeks. Is it possible the mechanic has a valve too loose?

Also Welcome to the Ninjettes.

[csmith12]

Upload video please. The little 250 engine isn't the quietest of engines. A bit of ticking/rattling is normal.

[zaknifein]

It's a ticking noise. It gets louder with revs so I feel like chain is a possibility
I'm pretty sure the mechanic did a good job with the valves, he's very competent but who knows

I'll record and upload a video in a few!

Edit: By louder I mean it gets more frequent

[zaknifein]

Here's the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Esh...ature=youtu.be

[csmith12]

Miles on engine? Last oil change? Is the oil level proper?

And the first thing I would try aside of checking oil level is to remove the cam chain tensioner and clean/lube it. Cost $0 dollars, time 20mins. If that clears the ticking... then you know your problem. The stock part cleaning may last forever, it may only be temporary in nature.

And yes... that is something to be concerned with and NOT normal.

[zaknifein]

Engine should be right along with the bike at 15k
Changed the oil 350 miles or so ago, when I got the bike

Will be cleaning the tensioner today then, thank you

[jkv45]

Does it change from cold to hot?

I was told that a cam chain noise usually get louder when the revs drop rather than when they climb.

That sounds like valve noise to me though.

What oil did you use when you changed it?

Was it making the same noise when you took it in?

[csmith12]

^^^^

[zaknifein]

I used mobil 1 racing oil for motorcycles. I'm pretty sure it doesn't change from hot to cold, but the ticking is definitely more noticeable at lower RPMs, maybe because you can tell the individual ticks apart.

I think so, but I don't know. It was making a LOT of noises when I took it in so it was hard to judge.

Just cleaned the tensioner, the noise seems to have gone down just a little bit

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=IfyQ...ature=youtu.be

[jkv45]

Still sounds like valves that need adjustment to me.

[VaFish]

That doesn't sound like the ticking I was hearing from my valves.

But, I only had 1 that was over spec, and according to several around here the over spec is what makes the noise. If yours has several (especially if it is one on each cylinder or intake and exhaust valves) that are over spec that might explain why it sounds different to me.

[zaknifein]

that's weird, my mech said he adjusted all the valves to 13mm because they were wide open

he said he thinks it might be some kinda bearings

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

that's weird, my mech said he adjusted all the valves to 13mm because they were wide open

he said he thinks it might be some kinda bearings

I would ask him again for the valve lash spec he used. Maybe 0.13 mm? SPecs should be:

.08 - .13mm intake
.11 - .16mm exhaust

0.13 is on the loose end of the intake adjustment and might be the cause of some noise.

[zaknifein]

Originally Posted by RacinNinja

I would ask him again for the valve lash spec he used. Maybe 0.13 mm? SPecs should be:

.08 - .13mm intake
.11 - .16mm exhaust

0.13 is on the loose end of the intake adjustment and might be the cause of some noise.

So it doesn't sound like bearings or whatever to you?

[Ghostt]

If the CCT is in question, get a new one, I just did mine. Cost from Partzilla was under $45.00, cheaper than a new engine in the event the CCT fails.

Cleaning as others have pointed out is a bit hit and miss, as I use mine for commuting I can't afford any downtime, especially for something so stupid, and cheap.

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

So it doesn't sound like bearings or whatever to you?

Hard to tell from a video. I hear cam chain noise but not sure what the other knocking is.

I prefer the old screwdriver-to-your-ear method. Get a long shafted flat or philips head screwdriver. Place the handle on your ear and the tip on the engine in different spots until you get close to where the sound is coming from. It can also tell you if it's a knocking, etc etc.

It will be easier to tell based on the area of the noise. Metal can resonate, making a top end issue sound like it's further down in the cases.

[zaknifein]

the CCT was pretty messed up. Part of the spring was completely gunked up and the ball bearings weren't having a good time

I just ordered a new CCT hopefully this is the source of all my problems. I will let you guys know as soon as I swap it out!

[csmith12]

Hope it's easy like that for ya.

[jkv45]

It will be interesting to see if the new CCT fixes the noise - please let us know.

It's also interesting that the mechanic didn't mention to you that the noise persisted after making valve adjustment. You would think he would have started it and noticed that it was still making noise, and knowing that he accurately adjusted the valves it had to be something else.

You'd think.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

the CCT was pretty messed up. Part of the spring was completely gunked up and the ball bearings weren't having a good time

I just ordered a new CCT hopefully this is the source of all my problems. I will let you guys know as soon as I swap it out!

Welcome, aaron !!!

Consider a manual CCT over the original:
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=266774

Your mechanic should have measured the condition of the cam chain, sprockets and guides.

[zaknifein]

Originally Posted by jkv45

It will be interesting to see if the new CCT fixes the noise - please let us know.

It's also interesting that the mechanic didn't mention to you that the noise persisted after making valve adjustment. You would think he would have started it and noticed that it was still making noise, and knowing that he accurately adjusted the valves it had to be something else.

You'd think.

Oh no, he did mention it. That's why I thought it was the bearings. He just gave it back to me because I asked for it back and he said "well, she starts and runs alright. I'm not gonna give you any guarantees, though."

He said he thought it was the bearings inside the engine, that's hwere I got the idea

Originally Posted by Motofool

Welcome, aaron !!!

Consider a manual CCT over the original:
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=266774

Your mechanic should have measured the condition of the cam chain, sprockets and guides.

Thank you! Unfortunately, I just ordered a new OEM one. If this is actually the issue and it goes bad as well, I may consider switching over.

[Ghostt]

I disagree with a manual CCT for street use, track okay.

Only use if your an expert in manual CCT

If misused/adjusted wrong causes damage.

The Ninjette isn't know for bad CCT, dirty yes but they can go bad, after all its just a spring.

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Cam_cha...sioner_removal

[zaknifein]

After doing the ol' screwdriver to the ear trick, I discovered that most of the noise was indeed coming from the CCT. It's gotten louder, which is strange. But there is some noise coming from the top of the block/head area, loudest at top of the block. Unsure if it's a rapping noise or just regular engine noise. No knock, as far as I can tell at least.

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

After doing the ol' screwdriver to the ear trick, I discovered that most of the noise was indeed coming from the CCT. It's gotten louder, which is strange. But there is some noise coming from the top of the block/head area, loudest at top of the block. Unsure if it's a rapping noise or just regular engine noise. No knock, as far as I can tell at least.

Might be a loose chain slapping against the plastic rails. Don't run it until your new CCT arrives and is installed.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

I disagree with a manual CCT for street use, track okay.

Interesting... Why do you feel that way? It's either installed right or wrong, slack within spec or not. I am game for learning something new or gaining additional perspective on things.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

Oh no, he did mention it. That's why I thought it was the bearings. He just gave it back to me because I asked for it back and he said "well, she starts and runs alright. I'm not gonna give you any guarantees, though."

He said he thought it was the bearings inside the engine, that's hwere I got the idea

No guarantees on what?

It doesn't sound like a bearing issue to me. Hopefully the new CCT will cure the problem. If not, I would inspect the valve clearance myself. He should at least guarantee the clearances are right. If you find them out of spec you would need to decide how to get it corrected without paying additional (if you chose to take it back to the same mechanic).

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Interesting... Why do you feel that way? It's either installed right or wrong, slack within spec or not. I am game for learning something new or gaining additional perspective on things.

The problem lies with the installer, in the hand of an inexperienced person, they tend to over or under tighten them, causes undo wear, and tear, in extreme cases breakage, not to mention periodically needed adjusted, some people can't even routine maintenance items, these people should not have a manual CCT.

How many check their drive chain? Adjust it properly? Etc.....

Hence why I said only the experienced should use them.

[csmith12]

Fair enough....

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

The problem lies with the installer, in the hand of an inexperienced person, they tend to over or under tighten them, causes undo wear, and tear, in extreme cases breakage, not to mention periodically needed adjusted, some people can't even routine maintenance items, these people should not have a manual CCT.

How many check their drive chain? Adjust it properly? Etc.....

Hence why I said only the experienced should use them.

I would change your "experienced" to "responsible". But that's my 1/2 cent.

I know, potato, potato but for the most part I agree.

[Ghostt]

I say expert, because reasonable is way too wide of term, and besides people often mislead themselves into thinking they are more than they are.

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

I say expert, because reasonable is way too wide of term, and besides people often mislead themselves into thinking they are more than they are.

Agreed.

PS....it was responsible.

[zaknifein]

Geez you guys bicker more than my parents do

Welp, switched out the CCT, got zilch. That was a waste of 50$. Any other ideas?

Thanks for the help so far guys. I'm just irked because I've thrown so much time and money into this bike but she's still not running right

[Ghostt]

No bickering, just opinions being voice over a forum, actually this is quite tame compared to others.

With that said, do difference in noise could either be normal for the Ninjette, which by the way always has some valve train noise, and or the clutch basket issue.

Here's more information on that subject,
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What%27..._the_clutch%3F

[RacinNinja]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

No bickering, just opinions being voice over a forum, actually this is quite tame compared to others.

With that said, do difference in noise could either be normal for the Ninjette, which by the way always has some valve train noise, and or the clutch basket issue.

Here's more information on that subject,
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What%27..._the_clutch%3F

Given the mechanics diagnosis of a bad bearing and the noise coming from near the CCT area, I'd say this is spot on.

[Ghostt]

The Ninjette and its bigger brother the EX500 both suffer from this. Being that own both I can testify to the noises being true.

Cheesy OEM design, solid, not hydraulic valve train, and old school technology=noises

Time to embrace your inner Ninjette, and enjoy it, and ride on.

[zaknifein]

sooooo.... how accurate is the clutch basket test you sent me?

my ticking noise is directly proportional to the RPMs of the engine: the ticking noise did not prove conclusive

[Ghostt]

If it's a ticking and not a soft knocking sounds it's the valves, either they are right, or not.

If you have faith in your mechanic, then it's most likely normal, the Ninjette isn't as silent as a ninja.

[zaknifein]

Ah okay thanks for your help everyone

I really do wanna keep her as a second bike whenever I get a bigger bike for commuting so I want her to run properly

[strickcharles5]

Originally Posted by zaknifein

Here's the video

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=1Esh...ature=youtu.be

I think if my bike was running right now it might sound the same.From another tread I think i found out my problem a starter clutch bearing and or another bearing,but I would try cleaning the chain tensioner as others have suggested and i think I'm gonna try that 2 first things first. The reason mine is running for sure right now I removed the head and 2 of the exhaust valves have holes burnt in them that I believe Champion spark plugs did NEVER USE CHAMPION PLUGS.Also sounds like u have an exhaust leak to me probably the exhaust collars maybe.Exhaust collars are compression fittings use only once and easy to put on just put brake fluid on the bolts so u don't ring the studs off.