Quick!! Close the Barn Doors... the Horses (Donkeys) Have Gotten Out!!!

[k1prototype]

Originally Posted by OldGuy

As for Kareem's well written input I'm sorry I just don't buy it. It is your opinion and I respect that. But from my perspective we have two problems with "youth" today. 1) Far too many had a friend growing up and not a parent. As a result they still haven't learned that there are consequences for their actions. 2) As for having to "learn the hard way" - as a parent you might be comfortable letting them do that if we're talking about dating, school, money decision, etc BUT NOT THEIR LIFE.

The hardest part about being a parent is having to say no and enforcing the rules you've laid down. It's called being an adult.

Don I can't agree with you more, but I'll throw another wrench into the situation. There are those parent's who themselves have either a.) never ridden a motorcycle before and don't know the first thing about ATGATT, or b.) might be the traditional "Harley" type of people who don't wear gear because they feel it takes away from the purity of enjoying motorcycling.

For example: When I first bought my bike and gear I took a fishing trip with a friend of mine to Wisconsin, the mecca of Harley riders. Within the two day trip I saw at least 90/100 Harley riders riding with only jeans and a t-shirt (men and women included). Compared to that I have to say on a positive note out of the 20 sport bikes I saw at least 10 of those people had gear on. I know it isn't much butter but there seems to be at least a better trend for those on sport bikes to wear gear compared to the cruiser scene.

My point is parents definitely do make an impact on the decision process, but like you said only if the parent acts like a parent and not a friend. If the parent gives in to the desire of their child who wants to buy a sport bike and not wear gear when they fully well know that their kid doesn't fully understand the consequences of getting into an accident, then they themselves should prevent them from buying the bike in the first place and having such a scenario come about. But then again not everyone is that smart.

Another problem is those kids who go out and end up buying stuff behind their parents back. Same lack of parental connection & supervision can be applied. In my case, when I was 21 I bought my trans am on my own without my dad knowing about it. I bought it through the result of influence from my stupid testosterone driven 21 year old friends who encouraged me to get such a car. When I brought it home, yea I got yelled at by my dad but in the end there was not much repercussion. I didn't realize what I had on my hands until I almost killed myself street racing.

That sense of logic was never instilled into my brain by my parents nor by my surroundings. Luckily though I was smart enough not to buy a bike until I knew that my maturity level could handle such a dangerous machine. Considering that most people are the product of their environment this is another factor to consider as well.

[kkim]

okay, you struck at the very reason I started this post. Yes, I know there are some that feel a post like this is useless and it's none of anyone business but theirs, but nothing anyone could say would change that locked way of thinking.

The thread was started to help beginner riders know that gearing up should be a mandatory safety precaution that everyone who rides should subscribe to. If making a new rider aware of this helps to prevent them injury in a mishap, I feel the other retorts are well worth it.

The main reason was the lack of riding pants I saw many forgo as a supplemental piece of riding gear. Somehow, it is always the last to be purchased and most times people who crash end up with knee/leg injuries.

While I fully understand that no amount of riding gear will ever prevent you from getting hurt, it is my belief you will suffer less damage with gear on than without when in a crash.

As for parents and their roles in guiding their children properly... not all are equipped with the experience and knowledge in every area needed when their child need advice/help. I feel an obligation to help in that regards to the newer riders on the board and openly pass on what I can from my years to help the learning process go smoother and with more success. Those who argue that they need to learn on their own and don't need anyone telling them what to do really don't see the big picture and perhaps never will.

[CZroe]

Originally Posted by k1prototype

...
For example: When I first bought my bike and gear I took a fishing trip with a friend of mine to Wisconsin, the mecca of Harley riders. Within the two day trip I saw at least 90/100 Harley riders riding with only jeans and a t-shirt (men and women included). Compared to that I have to say on a positive note out of the 20 sport bikes I saw at least 10 of those people had gear on. I know it isn't much butter but there seems to be at least a better trend for those on sport bikes to wear gear compared to the cruiser scene.
...

Gear is part of the sport bike look. No gear is part of the cruiser/chopper look. That Geico commercial where the cavemen show up wearing full gear (jumpsuits and full-face helmets) always looks a little weird... like they should be riding sport bikes but, hey, they're an insurance company. They want to appeal to cruiser customers and they also want to promote safety (less money to pay out in a crash!). While I would promote ATGATT to cruiser guys also, they are statistically less likely to be a thrill-seeking dare-devil and, therefore, more likely to ride responsibly in nearly every other way. Unfortunately, motorcycling also attracts the thrill-seeking dare-devil type of rider and it skews the safety statistics and raises rates for all of us.

I'll be wearing mine and begging others to wear theirs.

[OldGuy]

Originally Posted by kkim

As for parents and their roles in guiding their children properly... not all are equipped with the experience and knowledge in every area needed when their child need advice/help.

So true Kelly. I would suggest that if a parent does a reasonably good job of instilling the process of right and wrong, consequences for actions, don't follow the heard, and think before you act into their children that even when faced with situations and areas neither has the experience or knowledge for, there just might be the old "transference of skills" and one or the other might realize they need to seek out an expert (like Kelly ) before they make their big decision.

Originally Posted by kkim

I feel an obligation to help in that regards to the newer riders on the board and openly pass on what I can from my years to help the learning process go smoother and with more success.

And I can attest from my own situation you do that better than anyone I know and in a manner that is of a teacher and not a lecturer. Have I said thank you lately?

Originally Posted by kkim

Those who argue that they need to learn on their own and don't need anyone telling them what to do really don't see the big picture and perhaps never will.

Sadly these are the ones that all we can offer is hope and prayers that things will turn out OK.

[Sailariel]

Well, I had a 15MPH crash on my bicycle--front tyre blowout. Am looking at a month of PT twice a week to fix a messed up elbow. There is no PT for road rash. Hands and head are fine. I will need new gloves and a new helmet. Someday someone will invent some superlight bike clothes for us cyclists that prevent road rash. The Lycra/Spandex offers no proyection.

[OldGuy]

Blow out the back on a bike and you might have a chance but blow out the front and you don't event get to think about it. Sorry to hear about it Alex but glad it wasn't worse. Somehow I don't think we can come up with spandex that will provide the rash protection - at least not at prices we can afford.

[Sailariel]

Don, You are so right! A front tyre failure was a first for me---no warning, and the next thing you do is slide. I never thought one could get so messed up at 15MPH. I am glad that my arms and legs were still shaven from the TT last weekend. Made cleaning the rash easier. You know, a front tyre malfunction could be a bad scene on a motorcycle--all the more reason to suit up. I did 20 miles this morning. It is starting to get damn cold. I heartily endorse GIRO helmets. So far I have smashed two of them with no damage to the noggin.

[OldGuy]

Originally Posted by Sailariel

I did 20 miles this morning. It is starting to get damn cold. I heartily endorse GIRO helmets. So far I have smashed two of them with no damage to the noggin.

Those first couple of rides are rough but you do have to keep the "skin" stretched or it's a long wait. The GIRO are a good helmet. I've got an Atimos and sometimes you even forget you have one on.

Have a great weekend - we had our first snow this morning. Only a couple of inches but I think it was just a "warning".

[ninjabrewer]

Many many many moons ago when I used to wear the lycra riding shorts of a much younger lad, I had a few scrapes with the asphalt and left a bit of skin on the road. My father had a rear blow out a few hundred yds from the house. He didn't wreck and it scared the daylights out of him. Glad to hear that you are ok and that it wasn't more serious. The helmet and the gloves did their job and sacrificed themselves for you.

nb

[Sailariel]

That`s for sure. The episode sure drove home the rule that you wear all your gear all the time. I definitely got messed up at 15MPH--looks like the physical therapy will be longer than a month--did some serious tendon damage--just short of requiring surgery. Am still amazed that one can do so much damage at 15MPH. I have to say that a lot of it is my fault--I should have tucked in and rolled--that`s what I was taught in jump school. That was 40+ years ago and we tend to forget.

[GreezMunky]

Originally Posted by Sailariel

That was 40+ years ago and we tend to forget.

Bah, blame it on age all you want... I know another ranger that's retired and he's a little kooky. And two inches shorter.

[Sailariel]

Tor, That has to be it.

[kkim]

[ungluck]

went into airborne school at 5'7"..flew through that, got through RIp,selection, and got my tab and then landed in 2nd BN A Co 3rd platoon..

was there for a little over a year then went down to hunter with 1st B Co First platoon...long time ago.. spent a total of 6 years with Bn..

def shorter...last doc check i'm jus over 5'5"


anyway.. it boggles me the amount of people who knowingly ride without helmets, in slippers(flipflops), wife beaters, shorts, no gloves,etc...when they have seen it in someway, the damage, the rash,etc. yet they do it anyway.


it's like people who shoot heroine or smoke/snort meth...they know..but they do it anyway.

or people who cheat..they know they'll get caught.


so, to me..any impact and teaching,awareness made could change that persons perspective, especially as an adult or parent, just making or nicely persuading a beginner,etc to gear up..could change their perspective on gear and make them gear up, everytime. some won't..you can't lead every horse to water and make em or expect em to drink.

just how it is. influence is good, especially when it's good. especially to the youth,friends and family. but..their is the bad influence or the i don't give a fuk attitude.

win some lose some.


have a good un

[Anthony_marr]

Originally Posted by ungluck

it boggles me the amount of people who knowingly ride without helmets, in slippers(flipflops), wife beaters, shorts, no gloves,etc...when they have seen it in someway, the damage, the rash,etc. yet they do it anyway.

it's like people who shoot heroine or smoke/snort meth...they know..but they do it anyway.

or people who cheat..they know they'll get caught.

so, to me..any impact and teaching,awareness made could change that persons perspective, especially as an adult or parent, just making or nicely persuading a beginner,etc to gear up..could change their perspective on gear and make them gear up, everytime. some won't..you can't lead every horse to water and make em or expect em to drink.

just how it is. influence is good, especially when it's good. especially to the youth,friends and family. but..their is the bad influence or the i don't give a fuk attitude.

win some lose some.

have a good un

I have driven through over 44 states, and it is always a jolt to enter a state without helmet laws. I view them as the survivors in a war zone favored only by chance. On the other hand, I see almost no one riding without a helmet in those states with helmet laws. This shows me that where there is a reasonable law, 99% of the people will obey it. So this boils down to whether ATGATT can be legally enforced. Obviously, those who voluntarily abide by this rule do it because they value what they have beneath their necks as much as they do what is above it. And this in turn depends on whether they could set up a law to protect those who don't.

I see no economic objection to an ATGATT law where the legislators are concerned, since the outlay will come from the riders themselves, and the savings will be in the medical system.

[wvninja]

holy old thread bump batman ...

i ride in cargo shorts and my k-swiss. I'm reckless and cool at the same time!

Me and my bud out on a ride mid jan.

[ungluck]

funny helmet law thing..Hawaii has no helmet law..but i think a couple year old study said 93% of riders wore em..the helmet is gonna happen this year though. which is awesome.

[Flashmonkey]

I don't know how anybody can ride without a helmet on. All of that noise and wind...it must be hard as hell to breathe. Also...bugs. One big bug to the forehead and I'd probably stop riding altogether.

[kkim]

Originally Posted by wvninja

holy old thread bump batman ...

i ride in cargo shorts and my k-swiss. I'm reckless and cool at the same time!

Me and my bud out on a ride mid jan.

bump was for the new members on the forum that have been going down and realizing they are getting hurt when they do.

plz don't tell me that is really you in that pic?

for anyone that will listen, ATGATT.

[sombo]

Originally Posted by kkim

bump was for the new members on the forum that have been going down and realizing they are getting hurt when they do.

plz don't tell me that is really you in that pic?

for anyone that will listen, ATGATT.

LOL you think he would be dressed like that on a bike in WV in mid Jan considering the winters they've been having?

[kkim]

dunno... it's been warm and sunny here. Isn't it like that everywhere?

[Anthony_marr]

Originally Posted by Flashmonkey

I don't know how anybody can ride without a helmet on. All of that noise and wind...it must be hard as hell to breathe. Also...bugs. One big bug to the forehead and I'd probably stop riding altogether.

Once I was on the freeway, passing cars. Suddenly, SMACK! and I could see out of my right eye no more. It was a large green bug splatter on my face shield right in front of my right eye. Without the shield, the bug would have hit the right lens of my eye-glasses. Without my glasses, and sans the shield, it could have slammed right INTO my right eye ball. And I would have crashed at 80+ mph. To this day I have not determined what kind of a bug it was, but it was no mosquito or fly, I can tell that much. Maybe a large dragonfly or beetle.

[TenaciousD]

We've got a lot of big-ass bugs here in Florida. I have no idea how riders deal with no helmet on bikes with no windscreen. You'll probably survive a bug strike - it just wouldn't be fun. It's the pavement that you really gotta watch out for.

[kevlarorc]

Originally Posted by CC Cowboy

Your life is in your hands. Think about what you are doing and whether you should really be on a motorcycle.

So I take it you've never crashed before?

[Anthony_marr]

Vastly legitimized and popularized by Easy Rider, though not created by it. But what do you expect? Fonda's bike didn't even have front brakes!

[CC Cowboy]

Originally Posted by kevlarorc

So I take it you've never crashed before?

Why would you ever want to crash?

[Sailariel]

I'm selective--only crash bicycles--four crashes in seven years. Three were while racing.

[ungluck]

if we go to bicycles..then...call me evil kenievel(sp)

anyone ever taken a bumble bee to the chest?? that...effin sucks.


i have my sunglasses on under my visor..for the sun and secondary protection..need to clean the visor after yesterdays ride with kenji808 and another ninjette owner.

kevlar jeans are a good investment and a pair of padded underpants. it'll help the rash..but not too much for the impact.