Gear and how it's not safe

[fishdip]

I find it very interesting that the only gear that is tested and required to met some sort of regulation is a helmet. Do you think if the government made every manufacture test the gloves, pants or jacket they sale. That most of the gear on the shelf's right now will fail?

[csmith12]

Please no... There is enough laws and regulation already. And... it's expensive enough without adding something that will surely drive the price up even more.

[tfkrocks]

Armor can be CE certified.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

Armor can be CE certified.

but not the gear its in.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Please no... There is enough laws and regulation already. And... it's expensive enough without adding something that will surely drive the price up even more.

I for one think they do need to regulate gear. Its like the hoody some one posted. A noob is going to get that thinking they are riding safe with it on.

[indr]

Originally Posted by fishdip

I for one think they do need to regulate gear. Its like the hoody some one posted. A noob is going to get that thinking they are riding safe with it on.

That's the noob's fault. The noob has the internet at his/her fingertips and can educate his/herself on what works. There are numerous unaffiliated forums (like this one) that offer suggestions.

[cuong-nutz]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Please no... There is enough laws and regulation already. And... it's expensive enough without adding something that will surely drive the price up even more.

If you need the the government to tell you what have to wear, you might as well forfeit all your rights to life.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by indr

That's the noob's fault. The noob has the internet at his/her fingertips and can educate his/herself on what works. There are numerous unaffiliated forums (like this one) that offer suggestions.

To assume every one is using the internet is nave. heck look at most of the gloves ppl are using most wont even stand up in a 10mph crash.

[tfkrocks]

Helmets are only tested for impact, not for abrasion properties. Armor follows that. The rest is going to stay as the decision of the rider. How can one really regulate how abrasion resistant stuff should be? Who is going to decide that? Likely it would end up being lawmakers with no clue as to what is reasonable. Different materials have very different abrasion resistant properties. Set that too high and no one could afford gear.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

Helmets are only tested for impact, not for abrasion properties. Armor follows that. The rest is going to stay as the decision of the rider. How can one really regulate how abrasion resistant stuff should be? Who is going to decide that? Likely it would end up being lawmakers with no clue as to what is reasonable. Different materials have very different abrasion resistant properties. Set that too high and no one could afford gear.

It needs to be set to the fastest us speed limit to come to a safe stop.

[tfkrocks]

Originally Posted by fishdip

It needs to be set to the fastest us speed limit to come to a safe stop.

In that case, it's likely only leather would pass that and that's expensive... I'd much prefer a rider to wear some gear that they can afford than none at all.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

In that case, it's likely only leather would pass that and that's expensive... I'd much prefer a rider to wear some gear that they can afford than none at all.

But if we pass laws making full leather required to ride then we will not have this issue.

[tfkrocks]

Originally Posted by fishdip

But if we pass laws making full leather required to ride then we will not have this issue.

Requiring full gear like that is way too much babying. It's not reasonable at all. Hell, I like full leathers, but I also wear textiles for practical reasons. Textiles are better for rain IMO. I've also crashed in said textiles and been fine. Different gear for different purposes. Government mandates can't replace rider education.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

Requiring full gear like that is way too much babying. It's not reasonable at all. Hell, I like full leathers, but I also wear textiles for practical reasons. Textiles are better for rain IMO. I've also crashed in said textiles and been fine. Different gear for different purposes. Government mandates can't replace rider education.

With the required seat belt/ air bag system it will tho.

[fishdip]

I am going to contact CA and FL and push the government to pass the full gear law like 21 and under or something

[hirubhaiambani]

Nobody can fix stupid.

People who think safety is important will save up for good quality gear. Until then they may do with gear offering less protection or something that is better than a t-shirt and flip-flops.

People who think riding in flip-flops and t-shirt while doing a wheelie @ 80mph on the freeway is cool, no amount of government regulation will convince them to do otherwise.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by hirubhaiambani

Nobody can fix stupid.

People who think safety is important will save up for good quality gear. Until then they may do with gear offering less protection or something that is better than a t-shirt and flip-flops.

People who think riding in flip-flops and t-shirt while doing a wheelie @ 80mph on the freeway is cool, no amount of government regulation will convince them to do otherwise.

Its more of a need for a stander test. I don't think its some one being stupid as much as them just not knowing what gear is safe. Heck I have gone out in flip flops swim trunks and sunglass .

[ninjamunky85]

Drayko advertises that their pants are CE approved, and I'm pretty sure they come without padding. So obviously there is some kind of CE rating for the material and not just the armor.

[tfkrocks]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Its more of a need for a stander test. I don't think its some one being stupid as much as them just not knowing what gear is safe. Heck I have gone out in flip flops swim trunks and sunglass .

Even if governments pass such a thing, they wouldn't come even close to being as stringent as you are suggesting. They would likely be something like helmet laws; people who don't give a **** will comply only enough to not get in trouble, even if the gear doesn't actually do anything. DOT half helmets are certified and they aren't exactly great gear Hell, the military has stricter requirements than in the civilian world but it's still hardly anything. They require you to be covered (long sleeve shirt and pants) but it doesn't have to be actual riding gear. I doubt the government decision for the general population could do much better.

In the end, it's still up to riders to educate themselves and make smart decisions.

Originally Posted by fishdip

I am going to contact CA and FL and push the government to pass the full gear law like 21 and under or something

But you live in CO

[JELY1990]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

-snip-

In the end, it's still up to riders to educate themselves and make smart decisions.

Exactly. It's not the government's job.

[antiant]

Mussolini has risen. *eats popcorn*

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

But you live in CO

That's the point Your right and I don't think it needs to be a requirement for say it may jut come down to a test done with a 3rd party and is the recommended gear like snail is to helmets.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by antiant

Mussolini has risen. *eats popcorn*

Why thank you.

[tfkrocks]

Trolling?

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by tfkrocks

Trolling?

Trolling the ppl going on about the government yes. Making some sort of test no.

[Aggrotech]

Fish, id much prefer a law that bans ridiculously massive trucks like the one you own.

[JELY1990]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Trolling the ppl going on about the government yes. Making some sort of test no.

Wouldn't a regulation concerning a test go hand in hand with the government? The government would have to be the ones to employ it after all.

I guess I'm confused what you're going on about. You want a test and started a thread, but since people who have posted in it don't agree with you and say the government shouldn't do that, you're trolling them?

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Aggrotech

Fish, id much prefer a law that bans ridiculously massive trucks like the one you own.

Then how shall I roll lots of black coal in the face of the guy on the motorcycle behind me.

[Jiggles]

It's like watching a guy shoot fish in a barrel

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by JELY1990

Wouldn't a regulation concerning a test go hand in hand with the government? The government would have to be the ones to employ it after all.

I guess I'm confused what you're going on about. You want a test and started a thread, but since people who have posted in it don't agree with you and say the government shouldn't do that, you're trolling them?

I am trolling the ones who did not reply to the question and only posted the government shouldn't do that. Id hope it be more of a test that a group of motorcycle riders come up with and get the company's to use it.

[Aggrotech]

Originally Posted by fishdip

Then how shall I roll lots of black coal in the face of the guy on the motorcycle behind me.

Buy an older civic hatchback and take out the back seats.

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Aggrotech

Buy an older civic hatchback and take out the back seats.

But how will all my welding equipment fit plus tow live stock with it

[Aggrotech]

Originally Posted by fishdip

But how will all my welding equipment fit plus tow live stock with it

throw in a V8 and add a small trailer?

[Alex]

Originally Posted by fishdip

But how will all my welding equipment fit plus tow live stock with it

What type of welding does live stock require? How do you get them to stay still?

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Alex

What type of welding does live stock require? How do you get them to stay still?

Id tell you but then you ban me due to the graphic nature

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Aggrotech

throw in a V8 and add a small trailer?

only if you think It will tow 4 horses up a 8% grade and still get 14 mpg

[rasta]

Someone that buys a $50 pair of mesh pants should know what they're getting themselves into. Similar to how you can't expect a $5 fast food meal to be as good for you as a $50 meal at a decent restaurant. The government shouldn't have to protect its citizens from themselves.

That said, I think there is some merit in your point. We pay a premium for gear that's perceived to be "high quality", without REALLY knowing how well it will hold up in a crash. You don't know until it's too late.

So, I basically just talked in a circle and this post went nowhere

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by rasta

Someone that buys a $50 pair of mesh pants should know what they're getting themselves into. Similar to how you can't expect a $5 fast food meal to be as good for you as a $50 meal at a decent restaurant. The government shouldn't have to protect its citizens from themselves.

That said, I think there is some merit in your point. We pay a premium for gear that's perceived to be "high quality", without REALLY knowing how good it will hold up in a crash. You don't know until it's too late.

So, I basically just talked in a circle and this post went nowhere

We need to find some one with some balls that will put on different gear and jump out the back of a truck going 80 and see how it will stand up
I think it was the glove thread that got me really thinking about this.

[Alex]

@gfloyd2002 put together a blog entry awhile back on this topic:

Which Material is Best for Gear? Abrasion Resistance Tests

[fishdip]

Originally Posted by Alex

@gfloyd2002 put together a blog entry awhile back on this topic:

Which Material is Best for Gear? Abrasion Resistance Tests

Thanks for the link. This is what I am talking about must of this stuff is gone in a few sec
Seconds of Drag on Asphalt Before Getting Holes:

Denim ---------------------------------0.2 to 0.5
Textile gloves -------------------------0.6
Most leather gloves---------------------1.0 to 1.8
Keprotec stretch material---------------0.9
Poor Kevlar-----------------------------1.0
Two layers of waxed cotton------------ 1.3
1.3mm thick cow hide ------------------3.8
Two layers of 1.3mm thick cowhide------18
Three layers of 1.3mm thick cowhide-----55
Two layers of Kevlar plain weave---------5.6
Suede ---------------------------------18
Boot leather (generally 2.2mm thick)-----20
Leather stretch panels------------------20.4