ninjette.org

Go Back   ninjette.org > 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R > 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk

Reply
 
Thread Tools
Old July 15th, 2019, 07:04 PM   #1
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Exclamation 07 ex250 starter problems.

Ok so I got this bike on trade. Guy had the flywheel gear thing on backwards. Also the starter was busted and smoking like crazy. Went through everything, confirmed the clutch only turns one way. Now I got the new starter. Installed. Hit button. Freespinning. Noticed some crazy wiring on the starter solenoid/relay. Please help me get this thing working. Mechanically inclined. All the tools. Bikes arenít my thing. Gonna try a new battery and see if polarity is reversed. Going to tear down the case again and see if everything still spins and lines up. Any ideas please post. Iím sure Iíll be up all night trying to ride this thing. Ugh. 2nd ninja. Both been a nightmare.
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote




Old July 15th, 2019, 09:26 PM   #2
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Hi Rob! Welcome to Ninjette!

Your wiring is correct, don’t waste any time on that.

Sounds like starter-clutch is not gripping. Need to take out and verify three spring-loaded roller-bearing pawls are seated correctly.

This functions similar to freewheel on rear wheel of bicycle. It’s disengages when spun by engine on inside in one direction. But grips and turns engine when spun from outside edge by starter.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 15th, 2019, 09:34 PM   #3
greg737
-
 
Name: -
Location: -
Join Date: May 2009

Motorcycle(s): -

Posts: A lot.
When you've got the side cover off, remove the Starter Motor Idle Gear and test to see if the Starter Motor is turning in the correct direction (counter clockwise) when the button is pushed.

That's where I'd start. If the Starter Motor turns backwards (clockwise) you've got wiring to work on. If the Starter Motor turns in the correct direction when the button is pressed, WTF, I can't even imagine how somebody could install the Starter Motor Clutch backwards, I wouldn't think it was possible to reassemble it that way.


And just to make sure we're thinking correctly about how the Starter Motor Clutch is supposed to work: The Maintenance Manual Inspection instructions for the Starter Motor tells you to remove the Starter Motor Idle Gear, then, using your hands, try turning the Starter Motor Clutch Gear (the really big gear that sits behind the Alternator Rotor/Starter Gear combo). The Starter Motor Idle gear should turn by hand clockwise freely, but should not turn counterclockwise.
greg737 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 15th, 2019, 10:15 PM   #4
Theorist
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Eric
Location: MA
Join Date: May 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2005 250

Posts: 38
If I were stuck with the starter, I'd start to survey the rest of the bike to see what else might be needed, before putting too much effort into the starter.

Can you push start it?
Theorist is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 10:58 AM   #5
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Ok so I found it thanks for your guys’ help! The starter idler has been ground down, and the 2 gears spin freely, not with each other. Got new pets ordered! Hopefully this will fix it!
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 11:01 AM   #6
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Hereís some pics. The other gear would just spin. You could pop the smaller gear out of the large one. Thatís why it was just spinning. Starter turning idler but not turning the crank? Also got a new flywheel the tabs were damaged on the original. Also some stators, a new stator cover (found a large crack in mine) and some tires. Hopefully this fixes. All parts except idler gear are in. Tuesday on that.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg D789EA6D-B204-4F44-8556-0CF1E0645005.jpg (89.8 KB, 10 views)
File Type: jpg A884FDCF-0E8F-49B8-9CC7-DAEACCD95F09.jpg (80.8 KB, 11 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 06:49 PM   #7
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Okay new parts in. Been a nightmare. Busted gas hoses etc. new starter, magneto, starter idler, stator cover, and new gas. Bike turns over (sounds like grinding or a tight fit on a gear? But the engine spins. Can feel air coming from exhaust. After 4 minutes of holding button I heard it try to fire 3 or 4 times and it backfired with blue flame out of top of air box. Idk if itís jumped time or what. I just want this fixed or something I got screwed completely by the guy I bought this from.
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 06:50 PM   #8
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Hereís a video
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 06:51 PM   #9
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Crazy noise
Attached Files
File Type: mov C4908A4B-D03B-4CDE-9FFD-E33BE885A2D4.MOV (4.80 MB, 12 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 08:00 PM   #10
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Also sometimes the blinkers work, sometimes don’t? And they pulse with the engine when cranking it sometimes
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 10:01 PM   #11
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
That's OK, starter is causing battery to drop voltage due to drain. Do these tests.

1. measure battery voltage with everything off

2. measure battery voltage while pushing START button
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 20th, 2019, 10:27 PM   #12
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Will do first thing. Also tried cranking with a car battery (not on or hooked to anything) while I did most tried to start.
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 12:39 AM   #13
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
If battery power is OK, then next up is:

- verify petcock is operational, only flows when vacuum applied, then thorough carb-cleaning
- clear out all jets and bleed holes with guitar wire of matching size
- clear out fuel circuits, these are hidden secret passages in carb body that supplies fuel to jets
- clear out passages to carb venturi
- verify float valves are working, if not, replace
- check and set float level
- replace pilot o-rings and float bowl seals as necessary
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 09:15 AM   #14
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
If I pull the hose going from petcock to carb the gas just spills out. I cannot turn the fuel flow off with any direction on petcock knob. 11.48 volts off. 11.04 with bike on. 8.92 when using starter. This is without jumper cables on the bike, and I’m sure the battery is bad anyway.
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 09:33 AM   #15
ducatiman
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
ducatiman's Avatar
 
Name: Gordon
Location: new york
Join Date: Sep 2009

Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '98 HONDA VFR800 '07 DUCATI SS800 '19 HONDA CBR650R

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Nov '18, Mar '17
so petcock refurb or replace needed

battery is shot too

carbs?
__________________________________________________
Gordon
Custom Carb Service

www.customcarbservices.com
ducatiman is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 09:43 AM   #16
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Pulling carb now. How do I check timing? I see 2 punches on the sprockets. What are these for?
Attached Images
File Type: jpg F0F4C823-64C1-4D3C-A241-7F84CED9C4D4.jpg (142.5 KB, 2 views)
File Type: jpg CB3C653B-2D51-4B55-89DB-C21CE6BD37A0.jpg (122.7 KB, 2 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 10:29 AM   #17
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Carbs look good. Recently cleaned imo. Jets are clean. No residue whatsoever. Seal in petcock was bad. Gonna replace ASAP. What hose should connect to the nipples in the middle of carb? Nothing hooked up there, probably where my gas leak was. Pic attached
Attached Images
File Type: jpg C7DCB2A7-120F-4F5D-82E9-91CE9A904246.jpg (84.2 KB, 5 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 10:36 AM   #18
greg737
-
 
Name: -
Location: -
Join Date: May 2009

Motorcycle(s): -

Posts: A lot.
The gears shown in your recent picture are (I believe) the gears that drive the engine's balance shaft. Nobody messes with those gears.

The only time you would be messing with those two gears is if you were completely disassembling the entire engine (i.e. removing then reinstalling the crankshaft).

There are other timing marks on the engine, up at the camshafts and on the alternator rotor. Those are the ones you should be concerned about.
greg737 is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 10:59 AM   #19
ducatiman
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
ducatiman's Avatar
 
Name: Gordon
Location: new york
Join Date: Sep 2009

Motorcycle(s): '95 DUCATI 900SS/SP '98 HONDA VFR800 '07 DUCATI SS800 '19 HONDA CBR650R

Posts: A lot.
MOTM - Nov '18, Mar '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alabamanoob View Post
Carbs look good. Recently cleaned imo. Jets are clean. No residue whatsoever. Seal in petcock was bad. Gonna replace ASAP. What hose should connect to the nipples in the middle of carb? Nothing hooked up there, probably where my gas leak was. Pic attached
your pic shows the vent (upper, singular) rail nipple. A semi transparent, light brown vent hose normally attaches there. If you are spouting leakage from the vent ...you've got definite float system issues.
__________________________________________________
Gordon
Custom Carb Service

www.customcarbservices.com
ducatiman is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 21st, 2019, 02:53 PM   #20
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Ok. Thanks. Also found out that the sprocket that goes behind the one way crank thing and pops into it is not the right sprocket, and apparently doesnít go to this bike? Makes the gap too big between the case and sprocket, causing it to rub horribly. New sprocket ordered. I believe I fixed the carb. Not sure yet. Waiting on this sprocket and the starter idler gear to come in. Funds running low. What a nightmare 🤦 also, thanks, will try to check timing. Found some threads on here that could help.
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 8A2E3522-E66A-4F19-817C-1F813EEC8995.jpg (102.3 KB, 4 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 22nd, 2019, 03:21 PM   #21
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Sprockets replaces. New battery. Turns over smooth. Not firing. Won’t crank. Plugs and coils are good? How do I check the timing
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 22nd, 2019, 04:13 PM   #22
Alex
ninjette.org dude
 
Alex's Avatar
 
Name: 1 guess :-)
Location: SF Bay Area
Join Date: Jun 2008

Motorcycle(s): '13 Ninja 300 (white, the fastest color!), '13 R1200RT, '14 CRF250L, '12 TT-R125LE, '15 CRF110F, '13 TT-R50E

Posts: Too much.
Blog Entries: 7
/moved to pre-gen tech
__________________________________________________
Montgomery Street Motorcycle Club / cal24.com / crf250l.org / ninjette.org

ninjette.org Terms of Service, ninjette.org Member Map

Shopping for motorcycle parts or equipment? Come here first.

The friendliest Ninja 250R/300/400 forum on the internet! (especially Unregistered)
Alex is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 22nd, 2019, 06:41 PM   #23
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Quote:
Originally Posted by Alabamanoob View Post
Sprockets replaces. New battery. Turns over smooth. Not firing. Won’t crank. Plugs and coils are good? How do I check the timing
No need to check ignition-timing, it's fixed and computerised. Could check coils and spark:

1. measure resistance across coils' primary terminals. What is this number?
2. pull spark-plug wire, insert spare plug, ground-case of plug. Push START, do you see spark jumping gap at plug?

If so, entire ignition system between pick-up coils at crank to spark-plugs are fine. What's preventing bike from running is insufficiently cleaned carbs. They worked perfectly fine when bike left showroom floor. You need to clean carbs back to factory-fresh condition.

I. In addition to clearing out jets, did you clear out each bleed hole in pilot-jet and emulsion tube? Each tiny hole needs to be cleaned with matching size guitar wire. I also like to drip coloured-dye through centre of these and verify that every hole "bleeds" correctly.



II. You'll also need to clear fuel-passages in carb-body that delivers petrol to jets. It's similar to nozzle at end of garden-hose. You've been cleaning nozzle, but there's still clogs in hose. Need to clean hose as well.

Quote:
Originally Posted by n4mwd View Post
Here are the secret passages in the carbs. They are kind of hard to figure out sometimes and this picture guide will show where they are for cleaning purposes.

Carb Pilot jet Circuit


Carb Main Jet Circuit


Carb Fuel and Overflow Drain


Carb Diaphragm Intake, upper choke and vacuum ports


Carb Choke Circuit
Most important to clean are choke and pilot circuits to get bike started. But all other passages should be cleared with mechanical scrubbing as well.

III. Float-valves must seal and stop petrol flow for correct fuel-level in float bowl. If you've got petrol leaking out your vent/overflow tube, float-valves are not sealing. They must be replaced and their seats must be inspected for proper sealing.

Please review some threads linked at end of this thread:
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=336365
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 23rd, 2019, 11:26 AM   #24
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
Ok so we tore it down. I knew it jumped time.... it did. Bad. Cause= faulty can chain tensioner. Got it all cleaned up and working again, but before setting the case back on the chain had maybe 1/2Ē of slack in it. Should I replace the tensioner with a manual one? $60. At this point I have 2k in this bike. Might as well fix it. Engines mostly rebuilt with new parts, new clutch, replaced a lot of old brittle bolts. Carb should be good. It was spotless to begin with. Seems like someone tried everything except the timing. Before when it flipped over off the springs the left cam sprocket? Would skip a tooth. Causing it to jump time. Or will the chain tighten up when itís reassembled and turned over? Do t wanna pull cams again🤬
Attached Images
File Type: jpg 6CA42AAA-94EE-4879-9DBD-3B353EE1E0F9.jpg (86.8 KB, 3 views)
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 23rd, 2019, 12:12 PM   #25
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
Measure chain to make sure it's not worn out.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 23rd, 2019, 01:26 PM   #26
Alabamanoob
ninjette.org member
 
Name: Rob
Location: Athens
Join Date: Jul 2019

Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja ex250

Posts: 16
What should length be? If I pull it to measure it I may as well replace it .
Alabamanoob is offline   Reply With Quote


Old July 23rd, 2019, 08:19 PM   #27
DannoXYZ
ninjette.org certified postwhore
 
Name: AKA JacRyann
Location: SF East Bay
Join Date: Dec 2011

Motorcycle(s): CB125T, Ninja250R racer, Ninja250R street bike, EX250F#1, EX250F#2, EX250E, VF500F, CBR600RR

Posts: A lot.
MOTY - 2018, MOTM - Nov '17
I believe these are the specs for chain.

20 Link length
Standard: 127-127.4mm
Service Limit: 128.9mm

Check tensioner as it should travel in one direction only. If plunger can go back & forth, it's broken. Also if plunger is not smooth, this will also prevent it from moving and tightening. No need for manual-tensioner as working OEM one does good job. If yours isn't working, just replace with factory unit. Lubricate it with synthetic lithium grease before installing.

Also check chain-guide that tensioner pushes on. If it has excessive wear or is broken, cam-chain tension can't be maintained.
DannoXYZ is offline   Reply With Quote


Reply




Similar Threads
Thread Thread Starter Forum Replies Last Post
spy 5000m. starter problems !!! murle 2013 - 2017 Ninja 300 Farkles 0 July 16th, 2017 09:54 PM
Starter Relay/Starter Problem Time Mage 1986 - 2007 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 13 July 13th, 2012 05:02 AM
Starter Problems rmacgillis 2008 - 2012 Ninja 250R Tech Talk 3 March 26th, 2012 01:24 PM


Thread Tools

Posting Rules
You may not post new threads
You may not post replies
You may not post attachments
You may not edit your posts

BB code is On
Smilies are On
[IMG] code is On
HTML code is Off

Forum Jump


Motorcycle Safety Foundation

All times are GMT -7. The time now is 04:26 AM.


remote server monitor
Powered by vBulletin®
Copyright ©2000 - 2019, Jelsoft Enterprises Ltd.
User Alert System provided by Advanced User Tagging (Lite) - vBulletin Mods & Addons Copyright © 2019 DragonByte Technologies Ltd.
Except where otherwise noted, all site contents are © Copyright 2019 ninjette.org, All rights reserved.