Why I think the 250 is a good beginner bike

[Ninja Rob]

In my motorcycle lifetime which is about 2 months so far, I have learned a lot of things. I have not fallen, thank God.
However, I

-Saw how fast 10 mph really is.
-have dropped my bike 3 times (parked)
-burned my leg on the exhaust. (pants rode up while I was parking)
-have almost been hit twice in moderate 35 mph hour traffic.
-have fish-tailed many times at varying speeds less than 45 mph.
-Hit the bottom of my foot on the street going 20 mph because I fish-tailed and almost fell.
-The bike has turned off on me because I didn't understand the petcock (within a mile of my home) and had to walk it home. (then dropped it because I didn't balance it right)
-The bike turned off on me about 3 miles away from home and had to charge the battery. (eventually got a new one)
*Got over-confident and cocky, resulting in distracted driving and once again, fish-tailed.

Then I,
-Understood why I would fish tail so much.
-Didn't drive for 3 weeks because of the cold and a dead battery, and had to touch up on my beginner skills when I finally got my bike running again.
-Understood how many mistakes I make very often.
-Understood how the Ninja 250 is forgiving on how bad SOME beginner riders can be.
-Understood that the 250, even though forgiving, can still be dangerous.

Up to this point, I have learned a lot. I do wear gear as well. I hope that I never fall even though I know it is a possibility. The way I see it is like this.
Someone warns you way ahead of time that you are going to fall. You have time and resources for you to choose how is it that you will prepare and protect yourself for that fall.

In my short experience and the listed things that I have learned ( I did leave many other's out) I think the 250 is a great beginner bike. I know other people will say other things and we all have our opinions and experiences. Personally for me, the 250 is doing an awesome job as a beginner bike. I do plan on getting a Ninja 300 in the future because I like the style and it's not much heavier than the 250. I do not speed so I do not think I will need anything that goes over the fastest speed limit there is. The 250 is capable enough for anything that I would ever need. I also will enroll in the MSF course. (I know I should have enrolled before but I had to learn some how!) Just waiting for my Friday night class to be over and I graduate from college. Which is in about 3 weeks.That class interferes with the MSF course. Also I will not ride in the street (just in my parking lot) until I graduate to make sure that I DO graduate and not have an accident before.

In my previous post, you can see how I learned how to ride.
There are various entries in there.
https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=197353

By safe riding and always being open to learning and be coached by others, I hope to live long enough to one day be able to mentor and teach others.
I enjoyed sharing my experiences so far.

[Snake]

Rob, it sounds like you have learned a lot in your short 2 months of riding.
I have been riding motorcycles my whole adult life so I can say that every ride is a learning experience.

[csmith12]

[cbinker]

[Sirref]

That is quite a lot of experience for 2 months of riding. My first few months were rather slow, I got my bike in december and wasn't fully comfortable with riding yet which combined with the cold led me to a slow paced introduction to riding. That first spring was the greatest thing ever though. I will never forget that spring and summer and those rides that felt so amazing and how I felt like I was going quick/fast when looking back I was barely even moving compared to what I can do now. Those small quirks with the bike that popped up, like a vacuum issue with the tank that caused the bike to act as though it was out of gas when it wasn't because the tank didn't have air pressure to push the gas through (or something like that)

These memories will stay with you for a long time to come, enjoy the ride and work on being as safe as possible and everything else will follow. That goes for any sized bike though, you need a good head on your shoulders to ride safely. I've been riding for a few years now (feels weird to say that) and I'm still experiencing those new feelings all over the place and I know there will be many more new experiences to come, such as picking up a 600cc track bike and attempting to master the bike while also continuing to build my pregen as the ultimate bike (for me) as a track bike now and maybe a street bike again someday.

[Skullz]

The most important thing to learn is to have fun.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Skullz

The most important thing to learn is to never stop having fun.

fixed it.

[Snake]

My best advise would be: "Ride like you are invisible."

[Ninja Rob]

I lean more towards feeling pleasure from it when I shift through the gears just right and hit a high speed on an empty street. At that high speed, everything slows down for just a second or two. The adrenaline starts pumping and I can feel every individual heart beat. I get a "high" from it.

[cbinker]

yes pretending to be invisible is the best way to ride, until a cop tries to pull you over...

[Ninja Rob]

Originally Posted by Snake

My best advise would be: "Ride like you are invisible."

I do. I even drive like I`m invisible when I drive my car.

[cbinker]

i hide in my car(truck) when driving.

[Sirref]

Originally Posted by Ninja Rob

I lean more towards feeling pleasure from it when I shift through the gears just right and hit a high speed on an empty street. At that high speed, everything slows down for just a second or two. The adrenaline starts pumping and I can feel every individual heart beat. I get a "high" from it.

I remember this feeling, this is one of the best parts of starting small. It's still quick to you until you adjust, then you ride a faster bike and your mind is blown all over again.

[kdogg2077]

Take the MSF course and watch Twist of the Wrist II on DVD.

[Ninja Rob]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

Take the MSF course and watch Twist of the Wrist II on DVD.

Already googling it!

[JohnnyBravo]

Spot on!!!

[Baron]

Keep it up mate!
Ninjettes, all 250s for that matter, are extremely underrated bikes. hanging around with riders, even good ones there are a few things you'll hear on a regular basis:-

• 250s aren't powerful enough
• 250s aren't suited for long trips
• 250s aren't suited for the highways
• 250s are too small for track days
• You'll outgrow a 250 in a season
• It's a little girls bike

All fallacies. A look at half of the threads on this forum and you'll see that not one of those is true.
It's more or less because they think the more the CC's the better it is. At the end of the day the good points about a 250 absolutely decimate the one argument being made by people who think along those lines.
You've learnt a lot for your first season, more than I did. The only thing I would say that is to stick to it. If you want to upgrade later on, do so but removes the kinks in the way you ride on the 250. Don't carry them over to a bigger bike, those kinks will only be magnified.
The rest can probably give you better advice than me.
I'm a n00b.
Cheers

[indomie]

that was a good post OP! keep learning! and be safe out there!

[Sirref]

Originally Posted by Baron

Ninjettes, all 250s for that matter, are extremely underrated bikes. hanging around with riders, even good ones there are a few things you'll hear on a regular basis:-

• 250s aren't powerful enough
• 250s aren't suited for long trips
• 250s aren't suited for the highways
• 250s are too small for track days
• You'll outgrow a 250 in a season
• It's a little girls bike

While I agree all of those things can be done it is not the ideal bike to do some things on.

-Not a 250, but my 300 beat a few cars off the line (to 60) that are generally regarded to be "fast cars" shortly after I got it. Mazda Rx8, bmw M1, Lotus exige (driver sucked at shifting), etc
-250s are not ideal for long trips, however they will do them just fine with the rider in relative comfort. You may wish to invest in a corbin/spencers seat in that case
-highways, I never understood how people could say that the 250 couldn't handle the highways when I had my 250 on the road a solid 2/3rds of the mileage was highways and I passed people more often than I got passed.
-Track days depends on the track, I would never dream of taking a 250 to daytona for instance but there are a lot of tracks where the 250 can dominate with the right rider (most of these are really 600cc tracks though)
-outgrow a 250 in one season, sure if straight line acceleration is all you care about but the bike isn't ideal to that person in the first place. The typical rider could spend a lot of time on a 250 and be fine with that and never realizes this. There are a lot of people who get bigger/better/faster bikes and then wish they had their 250.
-

[Hero Danny]

Some people really need to start on a 250. I firmly believe that, but I also believe not everyone needs to as well. The only mistakes I made on my 250 was that I burnt my leg on the exhaust (pregen) and that's because It was hot from riding, I switched to my bathing suit and jumped in pool and jumped right out, pushed my bike into the shed and I lost a little balance and it moved towards me and burnt my leg. I never dropped any of my bikes. Had 2 months experience before going to the MSF course which I passed with flying colors.

My only mistakes I've made while riding were locking up my rear brake and that's only happened on my 300. Never once happened on my 250.

Good thing you started on a 250 man. You would probably be dead if you started on a 600. Many others have died starting on a 600. And I think everyone should start on a 250/300 because you don't know what kind of rider you'll be until after you start riding... mine as well start on a easy, slow, forgiving bike like the 250.

[ally99]

Originally Posted by Snake

My best advise would be: "Ride like you are invisible."

YES! Say this in your head over and over again while riding on the street. "That cager has no idea I'm even here." Be ready with your escape plan for the times that mantra proves itself true.

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

Take the MSF course and watch Twist of the Wrist II on DVD.

Or read the book, highlight the hell out of it, and practice the strategies safely.

[Hero Danny]

Originally Posted by Sirref

While I agree all of those things can be done it is not the ideal bike to do some things on.

-Not a 250, but my 300 beat a few cars off the line (to 60) that are generally regarded to be "fast cars" shortly after I got it. Mazda Rx8, bmw M1, Lotus exige (driver sucked at shifting), etc
-250s are not ideal for long trips, however they will do them just fine with the rider in relative comfort. You may wish to invest in a corbin/spencers seat in that case
-highways, I never understood how people could say that the 250 couldn't handle the highways when I had my 250 on the road a solid 2/3rds of the mileage was highways and I passed people more often than I got passed.
-Track days depends on the track, I would never dream of taking a 250 to daytona for instance but there are a lot of tracks where the 250 can dominate with the right rider (most of these are really 600cc tracks though)
-outgrow a 250 in one season, sure if straight line acceleration is all you care about but the bike isn't ideal to that person in the first place. The typical rider could spend a lot of time on a 250 and be fine with that and never realizes this. There are a lot of people who get bigger/better/faster bikes and then wish they had their 250.
-

Yeah, the 250 can do all those things but it definitely isn't optimal. 250 is not a touring bike, a 650 or even a harley is better at touring since it has high handle bars and comfortable seat. Only thing is the 250 has great gas mileage.

The 250 can handle the high way perfectly fine. Only thing is that the wind blast will move the bike back and forth with a light rider on it (like myself) which can be scary at times.

Most girls ride 250's? I guess that may be true. I don't know, doesn't bother me either way. If anything it gives me something to relate to them with.

Out grow in one season? I would say that more riders outgrow their 250's in one season than any other bike. I understand that. I do think the 250 can be a great bike and i'd always want one but preferably I'd have my 300 and a 600 sitting next to each other in the garage.

I still believe the 250/300 is faster than most cars out there regardless of what you guys say. I think that it can beat 80% of the cars from 0-60. I think it is more than powerful enough for the streets. On the highway is where it starts to lag behind a bit, but not too bad.

The track is complete bs. 250's going on the tracks and kick 600's butts all the time. Especially the old 250rr's with the inline 4's.

[Baron]

Originally Posted by Sirref

While I agree all of those things can be done it is not the ideal bike to do some things on.

-Not a 250, but my 300 beat a few cars off the line (to 60) that are generally regarded to be "fast cars" shortly after I got it. Mazda Rx8, bmw M1, Lotus exige (driver sucked at shifting), etc
-250s are not ideal for long trips, however they will do them just fine with the rider in relative comfort. You may wish to invest in a corbin/spencers seat in that case
-highways, I never understood how people could say that the 250 couldn't handle the highways when I had my 250 on the road a solid 2/3rds of the mileage was highways and I passed people more often than I got passed.
-Track days depends on the track, I would never dream of taking a 250 to daytona for instance but there are a lot of tracks where the 250 can dominate with the right rider (most of these are really 600cc tracks though)
-outgrow a 250 in one season, sure if straight line acceleration is all you care about but the bike isn't ideal to that person in the first place. The typical rider could spend a lot of time on a 250 and be fine with that and never realizes this. There are a lot of people who get bigger/better/faster bikes and then wish they had their 250.
-

True.
My point was that when these statements are made they are made in absolutes and there in lies my problems with them. :P

[Worldtraveller]

Funny how many people the 250 isn't a good track day bike.

Tell that to those of us who race ours. One of the vendors at our race club rents 250s all set up for the track, for about $300/day (discounts for weekends, or the whole season), and some of the guys that normally race on big bikes have started racing with us and they all say just how much of a blast a 250 is on the track.

I was running better lap times on my 250 than I did on my 600 for a good while (my skills on the 600 have improved to the point where that's not true anymore, but it's easier to go fast on the 250).

[Rifleman]

250cc vs. 1000cc

the heaviest 250 is still lighter then the lightest 1000

the crappiest 250 can still be horsed around easier then the perfect race set up 1000cc

etc.

As I see it, the 1000cc bike can simply get you in trouble faster then the 250... taking off, top speed, acceleration, brakes, cornering, handling, tires...

less margin for error.

that doesn't mean a 250 can't toss you on your head.

that doesn't mean you will fair any better when the mother of 3 in the mini van yackin away on the cell phone doesn't see you and butt fwangs ya.

it just means that some mistakes on a 250 will result in... "holy crap, i'm not doing that again" and on a 1000cc will result in "Dr. how long have I been in a coma and why are 2 of my fingers missing"

thus a beginner with little to no road time can make those mistakes and live to tell about it, that a noob squid on a 2015 Gixxer 1k will wad to unrecognizability.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Yeah, the 250 can do all those things but it definitely isn't optimal. 250 is not a touring bike, a 650 or even a harley is better at touring since it has high handle bars and comfortable seat. Only thing is the 250 has great gas mileage.

hmm. hmm. hum. hmmm yep

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

The 250 can handle the high way perfectly fine. Only thing is that the wind blast will move the bike back and forth with a light rider on it (like myself) which can be scary at times.

all bikes i have ridden/owned have been sucky with winds, tire size and profile help.

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Most girls ride 250's? I guess that may be true. I don't know, doesn't bother me either way. If anything it gives me something to relate to them with.

i have been passed by a girl at the track, sex means nothing...

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Out grow in one season? I would say that more riders outgrow their 250's in one season than any other bike. I understand that. I do think the 250 can be a great bike and i'd always want one but preferably I'd have my 300 and a 600 sitting next to each other in the garage.

most people over the age of 18 are done growing, so technically they will not "out grow" the 250. Skill development vs. desire to go fast is a different story. They think because they can start and stop on a 250 that they are ready for the next bike.

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

I still believe the 250/300 is faster than most cars out there regardless of what you guys say. I think that it can beat 80% of the cars from 0-60. I think it is more than powerful enough for the streets. On the highway is where it starts to lag behind a bit, but not too bad.

drag racing on the streets is illegal and a hefty fine, just saying.

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

The track is complete bs. 250's going on the tracks and kick 600's butts all the time. Especially the old 250rr's with the inline 4's.

A skilled rider on a 250 can crush any novice on a 600. but a skilled rider on a 600 will destroy a skilled rider on a 250. I was 7 seconds faster at the track on my 600 vs 250 at the track. 1'46 vs 1'39.

[Sirref]

I experienced similar at mid-O riding my pregen 250 vs @csmith12's r6

My lap times between the two were virtually the same but my approach riding each bike was drastically different. I was trying to safely find the limit of my 250 while I was actively holding back on the r6 in the corners and just enjoying the straight line acceleration down the back straight (I'm not used to 600cc power and didn't want to break traction/crash mid corner when it's not my bike, don't judge lol)

[Hero Danny]

Originally Posted by cbinker

all bikes i have ridden/owned have been sucky with winds, tire size and profile help.

Yeah.... "tire size" guess what? 600's have bigger tires... lol. Also they weigh more... therefore they will handle the highways better....

Originally Posted by cbinker

i have been passed by a girl at the track, sex means nothing...

When did I ever say sex meant something?!?!?!? Goodness....

Originally Posted by cbinker

most people over the age of 18 are done growing, so technically they will not "out grow" the 250. Skill development vs. desire to go fast is a different story. They think because they can start and stop on a 250 that they are ready for the next bike.

I don't even know where to begin on this one??? Who actually refers to "out growing" as a literal meaning. lmao. It's figurative.

People out grow 250's a lot more often than they out grow a 600. Think about it. I'm not saying that everyone who upgrades from a 250 to a 600 is "actually" ready for it. But who really can out grow a 600? I mean, come on. I guess it can happen but for the most part a 600 is more than you could ever need. A 250... well, that's another story. (I regret saying that on a ninjette forum since you guys probably gonna jump all over me, but it is true)

Originally Posted by cbinker

drag racing on the streets is illegal and a hefty fine, just saying.

Oh my god... so isn't speeding, Seriously you're just being ridiculous now. The point is the ninja 250/300 can accelerate just fine....

[cadd]

Originally Posted by Ninja Rob

Then I,
-Understood why I would fish tail so much. (my boot unconsciously pressing the rear break while I open the throttle)

Does not compute....

OP, can you explain why or how these two actions (applying rear brake + opening the throttle) caused you to fishtail?

I would imagine applying the front brake and opening the throttle would cause fishtailing.

[Ninja Rob]

Originally Posted by cadd

Does not compute....

OP, can you explain why or how these two actions (applying rear brake + opening the throttle) caused you to fishtail?

I would imagine applying the front brake and opening the throttle would cause fishtailing.

You`re right. Or maybe I pressed the rear brake while slightly steering a little. I don`t remember too well because it happend so fast. Going to edit post.

[mikromo]

As a guy who learned to ride on a Yamaguchi 50 (in Tiawan) circa 1964, then returned to the states and rode 50's, 90's, and 100's, I think even smaller is the right way to go. Back in the day a dropped bike meant a new scratch, maybe a bent lever (not much was plastic) a scraped knee, maybe some bruised pride. We moved from Cali to FLA and I got a Yamaha "Twin Jet" 180,
a bike capable of over 80 mph and thought I had finaly graduated to a "big bike". I took my 1st long road trip on that bike.....Jax beach FLA to Petersburg, VA and back, never thought it was too small. Learned ALOT on that bike.....which was a good thing as my next bike was a Norton 750 Commando.....now THAT was a graduation, AND an eye opener.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Yeah.... "tire size" guess what? 600's have bigger tires... lol. Also they weigh more... therefore they will handle the highways better....

I was pretty much messing around, but go check curb weights of currend 600s vs 250, they are closer then you think.

[Hero Danny]

Originally Posted by cbinker

I was pretty much messing around, but go check curb weights of currend 600s vs 250, they are closer then you think.

Yeah, my 300 weighs like 185 wet and I believe a zx6r is something like 430 wet or whatever (top of my head please don't factnazi me). That 50lbs does make quite the difference when on the highway.

I noticed a slight difference from my 250 to 300 (the 300 weighs about 10lbs more than 250).

[Baron]

I say one thing and everyone goes

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Yeah, my 300 weighs like 185 wet and I believe a zx6r is something like 430 wet or whatever (top of my head please don't factnazi me). That 50lbs does make quite the difference when on the highway.

I noticed a slight difference from my 250 to 300 (the 300 weighs about 10lbs more than 250).

185? is that a KX250?

Curb weight 2010 ZX6R: 421.2 Resource
Curb weight 2010 250: 374.9 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R:427.8 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R(ABS):423.4 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 300: 379.3 Resource

Curb weight 2014 300(ABS): 383.7 Resource

[Hero Danny]

Originally Posted by cbinker

185? is that a KX250?

Curb weight 2010 ZX6R: 421.2 Resource
Curb weight 2010 250: 374.9 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R:427.8 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R(ABS):423.4 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 300: 379.3 Resource

Curb weight 2014 300(ABS): 383.7 Resource

Why did I say 185? Lmao, I think I was tired... I do love how I said not to factnazi me and that's exactly what you did. Can't tell if trolling or not. I'm going to assume you are.

But using your numbers the 300 and zx6r are about ~40lbs different, which is close enough to my 50 number and still stands to provide a point...

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

Why did I say 185? Lmao, I think I was tired... I do love how I said not to factnazi me and that's exactly what you did. Can't tell if trolling or not. I'm going to assume you are.

But using your numbers the 300 and zx6r are about ~40lbs different, which is close enough to my 50 number and still stands to provide a point...

no, i am sharing information that others may be interested in knowing and also sharing a website that has all the information. too many people throw out numbers on the internet with out any backing, when i share numbers i like to share the source.

[iliveforcurves]

I agree that the Ninja 250 is a good beginner bike, however, it would be even better if it was a naked bike. All that plastic is expensive to replace in a crash. I was surprised to find out that it cost less to insure my Yamaha FJR1300 than my EX250, mainly because the average age of FJR buyers is 50 years old and has some experience.
I suggest reading the book "Proficient Motorcycling" by David L. Hough. I learned things from it and I had been riding over 30 years when I read it.

[Hero Danny]

Originally Posted by cbinker

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R:427.8 Resource

Curb Weight 2014 ZX6R(ABS):423.4 Resource

So ABS weighs less than no ABS?

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

So ABS weighs less than no ABS?

thats the numbers they have for the '14