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Old May 31st, 2019, 04:06 AM   #1
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Question NEW tires available in sizes for our 16" wheels?

I appreciate the wealth of experience that has gone into the FAQ at https://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/What_t...fit_the_250%3F on tire models that will fit our classic first generation Ninjettes, but it hasn't been updated in 6 years.

Many of the tires recommended there have been discontinued (and I'm not fond of buying new old stock when it comes to tires.). Some of the tires are no longer available in our sizes.

It seems that some new tires have been released in our sizes, even a few that include an option for our front wheels and a few that aren't designed for heavy cruisers.

Can people share their experiences with newer tire options?

Is there a good thread or place that's compiled data updating the old FAQ that I've missed?

Is there a place with good motorcycle tire tests or reviews? Even for tires in our old, now outdated or rare, sizes? For car tires I like tirerack.com, tyrereviews, caranddriver, and consumerreports. I haven't found anything comparable for motorcycle tires yet.
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Old May 31st, 2019, 03:27 PM   #2
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Yeah, I agonised about this for couple weeks. Solved that issue by swapping in newgen rear-swingarm+shock and front-end along with 17" wheels.

Staying with 16", following are decent tyres:

100/80-16 = Shinko SR740, decent tyre, much better than originals
100/90-16 = Pirelli Sport Demon
110/90-16 = Bridgestone BT45, really good dual-compound tyre

130/80-16 = Shinko SR741, better than original tyres and in stock size too!
130/90-16 = Shinko 777, heavy-duty tyre
130/90-16 = Pirelli Sport Demon
139/90-16 = Bridgestone BT45, can't go wrong with this one.
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Old June 1st, 2019, 12:41 AM   #3
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Thank you.

The SR740, SR741 are original equipment tires on the Hyosung GT250 and widely derided by the GT250 riders, so I had hoped our OEM Dunlops might be a bit better, at a worse price. Then again I've seen repeatedly that original equipment car tires are reviewed much more poorly than tires that manufacturers don't choose to equip new cars with, even when those original equipment tires test well. I guess that we know our own individual preferences best. That and we feel more comfortable criticizing tires chosen by the manufacturers' engineers and accountants and less comfortable criticizing tires we choose as harshly. It's good to hear the SR740/SR741 aren't too bad for the price given our more limited options.

The richer tire options was the only thing (and how the bike's frame fit my 6 foot frame) I miss about the GT250 that I left in Seattle. Don't judge me too harshly; it was free. Rather the price was taking it away on a trailer, a pretty fair price for a Hyosung. I got it running but could never get it to run as well as our Ninjas. I was tempted when I saw the write up on the 17" wheel conversation, but then I looked at the alternative of making do with the limited 16"options now and planning to pick up a very affordable used 300ABS or even a less aggressively discounted 400ABS or z400.

Does anyone have experience with any of Continental's newer tires, especially the TKV 11/12 or ContiGo?
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Old June 4th, 2019, 09:44 AM   #4
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Thank you.

The SR740, SR741 are original equipment tires on the Hyosung GT250 and widely derided by the GT250 riders, so I had hoped our OEM Dunlops might be a bit better, at a worse price. Then again I've seen repeatedly that original equipment car tires are reviewed much more poorly than tires that manufacturers don't choose to equip new cars with, even when those original equipment tires test well. I guess that we know our own individual preferences best. That and we feel more comfortable criticizing tires chosen by the manufacturers' engineers and accountants and less comfortable criticizing tires we choose as harshly. It's good to hear the SR740/SR741 aren't too bad for the price given our more limited options.
I would say that this has more to do with the abilities of these riders who are complaining. I used the 17" versions of SR740/741 on my street newgen after wearing out factory BT45 tyres. I'd say they are just as good for grip, just won't last as long. Have enough traction for stoppies and can easily let you grind kickstand bracket on one side and muffler on other. Which is going way, way faster than anyone should be riding on street safely.

I don't think you can go wrong with those tyres. I'm on my 4th set of Shinko radials on my CBR600RR. Shinko are made in the former Yokohama plants, so lots of experience in those tyres. Shinko 003 tyres are exact same as Yokohama 003, they didn't even bother to change model name! They're way more capable then most riders' demands on street.

https://www.ninjette.org/forums/show...13#post1001513
http://vfrworld.com/threads/shinko-t...-review.15098/ - also read 2nd UPDATE review 1/2-way down too
http://xjrider.com/viewtopic.php?t=6630
http://www.ex-500.com/15-suspension-...s/27122?page=1
https://www.bikebandit.com/tires-tub...e-tire/p/19582 - check out reviews

Here's video of some guys I've ridden with; we all love Shinko tyres.

Link to original page on YouTube.


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Old June 7th, 2019, 02:30 PM   #5
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Thank you.

Yeah, it must be people's typical complaining about OEM tires or an OEM specific version for Hyosung with longer wear.

The most common complaint was wet traction, but the larger 150/70-17 rear tire on a similar bike with a dry weight of 330 pounds could be partly to blame.

With the attractive price and your recommendation, I think I'll go with Shinko's 741 on the rear. I had wanted something grippier, but worried about creating a traction imbalance with the relatively new OEM Dunlop in front, and I can't afford to replace both tires at this time.
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Old July 5th, 2019, 09:04 AM   #6
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Question New Metzeler Roadtec 01 in our size, rear 130/90-16

Apparently Metzeler makes its newest sport touring tire, the Roadtec 01, in sizes for our bikes, 100/90-16 54H or 110/90-16 59V for the front and 130/90-16 67V for the rear. Unfortunately I can't find anyone who sells out size for the rear in the US. It is on their website at https://www.metzeler.com/en-us/produ...res/roadtec-01 and in their pdf catalog or 'technical data book' with a product or IP code 3241800.

Has anyone found a way to get this tire in the US?

Has anyone used this tire on their classic Ninjette 1988-2007?

At least we can get the front tire in our size, but I currently need a rear.
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Old July 5th, 2019, 05:21 PM   #7
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This is World market now, you can get anything everywhere! https://www.ebay.com/itm/362618782967

One of my pre-gens came with those oversize tyres (Pirelli). It made bike really heavy-feeling with slow handling due to extra weight and more inertia from larger diameter. Really took all fun out of Ninjette as compared to my other exact bike with factory-sized tyres. When I wore those out, I put on factory-sized tyres on, 100/80-16 and 130/80-16
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Old July 6th, 2019, 08:44 AM   #8
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Similarly is a 120/80-16 rear tire more fun with less inertia and easier lean in?

I imagine putting 17" wheels and tires would really add spinning unsprung mass and seriously say the bike, even if they give a broader choice of new sport and sport touring tire technology.
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Old July 6th, 2019, 10:31 AM   #9
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If I may suggest, find your local area Metzeler dealer using their website which you posted, contact them for availability for the M1 in your required size would answer the availability question. If anyone can get them, they should be able. For all you know, they may even have em.

I'm currently running their M7RR on a couple of my rides, good stuff.
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Old July 6th, 2019, 03:15 PM   #10
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Thanks. I called all 5 official (on Metzeler's website dealer finder) Metzeler dealers anywhere nearby. None of them could get it. I called a couple of their distributers and they said they can't do special orders but they'd recommend getting this size to their buyers, when I pointed out how many 1988-2007 Ninjas are still on the road and that this would be the only good fit using technology that isn't 10 to 30 years old.

It seems that Danno's suggestion is the best, to order overseas at a higher cost, or get a different tire. I don't know if receiving a large parcel from Europe might require me to pay excise tax.
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Old July 6th, 2019, 03:33 PM   #11
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Curious....odd that Metzeler own authorized dealers unable to provide.

I'd be compelled to jump rank and call their US headquarters, perhaps they can offer another domestic source. If not, I'd be curious to hear their explanation as to why their product is advertised, meanwhile proclaimed "unobtainable" by their dealer network.

Pirelli Tire LLC
100 Pirelli Drive Rome, Georgia 30161-7000
tel.:1-800-PIRELLI (800-747-3554) ;

Hey, an 800 number, not costing but little time. Some interest may prompt them into action, actually stocking their own, current, advertised product listed for the rare 16" size market.
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Old July 6th, 2019, 05:34 PM   #12
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I don't know if receiving a large parcel from Europe might require me to pay excise tax.
Depends upon who's working customs desk that day. I've had international packages delivered to my door and an invoice mailed for import fees. In other cases, package was held at customs and I had to fetch at Oakland docks and pay fees before release. In yet other instances, package arrived on doorstep and no notice of any fees due ever showed up.

Not sure what relationship dealers have with manufacturers. I tried getting Dunlop Alpha-13 & 13-SP in 140/70-17 sizes as they were made in that size. The one and only single importer/dealer in U.S. market said flatly that no such size existed. At exact same time I'm on phone and looking at Dunlop website showing that size is made. And UK, Italian and Japanese sites had them for sale too! I suspect it's some of monopoly thing.

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Old July 11th, 2019, 08:20 AM   #13
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Import tires missing DOT codes and approval?

One helpful dealer pointed out that imported tires may not come with DOT codes and approval, making them illegal for street use in the US. My state requires an annual safety inspection in which the inspector is supposed to check the tires, so they, any police officer, or an accident investigator could take issue. I don't know if any other countries require US DOT codes. Some tires sold in other countries come from the same production batches with DOT codes, but a tire bought from another country may not have the codes.

Does anyone know of any other countries that require US DOT codes on tires sold there?
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Old July 11th, 2019, 09:10 AM   #14
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New ContiScoot: are 'performance' scooter tires really performance tires?

Continental has a new premium scooter tire with some loose connection to their latest ContiRoadAttack 3 sport touring tire. The Conti Scoot rear 120/80-16 tire is extremely affordable at less than $70 locally and less than $60 online. Continental talks it up (surprise) and refers to internal tests against two unspecified benchmark tires https://www.contimotousablog.com/con...-scooter-tire/ and one German online retailer ranks it highest among all maxi scooter tires https://bikereifen24.de/maxi-scooter...fen-test-2019/, but it's too new to find trustworthy reviews or tests. It will be interesting to see how this performs on our 16" wheel Ninjas.

Has anyone taken their Ninja to the track on sporty scooter tires? How have they performed? It concerns me that all the scooter tires in our sizes are only P speed rated for speeds up to 93mph. That's lower than the Q rating for car snow tires. I can stay below 93, but don't want to risk a blowout at lower high speeds or make my Ninja handle or feel like a fast scooter.
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Old August 18th, 2019, 03:58 PM   #15
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Earlier this year Pirelli started selling a new sport touring tire, their Pirelli Angel Scooter tire.

Several online retailers have marked the Demon Scooter as a closeout item.

Does anyone here have experience with the new Pirelli Angel Scooter tire?
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Old August 19th, 2019, 06:46 AM   #16
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Originally Posted by Theorist View Post
Earlier this year Pirelli started selling a new sport touring tire, their Pirelli Angel Scooter tire.

Several online retailers have marked the Demon Scooter as a closeout item.

Does anyone here have experience with the new Pirelli Angel Scooter tire?
Not that tire specifically, but I have a fair amount of experience with Pirelli cycle (3 sets) and auto tires (2 sets).

In both cases, the tires dried and cracked quickly - way before they should have. On the car you could feel the loss of traction anytime the road was wet, as they would spin easily. I'm not talking a sports car here either.

My son liked the Diablo Scooters we had on one Ninja better than the MT-75s on the other, but both deteriorated quicker than they should have.

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Old August 19th, 2019, 02:33 PM   #17
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Pirelli has always had racing as their 1st priority in business with road & consumer products as side-effect (similar to Ferrari's philosophy). Their pure racing-only slicks is second to none in performance for motorcycle & auto-racing. However, other factors such as longevity and durability hasn't had much focus. Their road products could use some more R & D in those areas.

Great all-around tyres I really like is Michelin (kinda like Honda of tyres).
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Old August 20th, 2019, 06:16 AM   #18
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Pirelli has always had racing as their 1st priority in business with road & consumer products as side-effect (similar to Ferrari's philosophy). Their pure racing-only slicks is second to none in performance for motorcycle & auto-racing. However, other factors such as longevity and durability hasn't had much focus. Their road products could use some more R & D in those areas.

Great all-around tyres I really like is Michelin (kinda like Honda of tyres).
Michelin has proven to be my favorite as well.

I've had 2 sets of auto tires that lasted well, didn't crack, and held decent traction throughout their life.

Currently running Power RSs on my SV and they have been very good also, though they like to be hot. Next time I'll be going with Road 5s most likely as I have a hard time getting the RSs up to temp in most of my riding.
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Old August 20th, 2019, 08:42 PM   #19
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Slim Michelin offerings for pregen

It's too bad Michelin doesn't offer more for our 1st gen Ninjas.

The Michelin Commander 2 cruiser tire is extremely well reviewed, available in a rear size 130/90-16 73h, and seems to have a more sporting profile than most cruiser tires. Unfortunately it's a heavy 17.7 pounds and doesn't offer a matching size for the front.

The Michelin City Grip is well rated and the rear tire is extremely light at 9.6 lbs in size 120/80-16 60p. The light load rating, 93 mph speed rating, and just 2 plies, and focus on city speeds and comfort may be concerning.
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Old August 21st, 2019, 12:23 AM   #20
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I think selection criteria should be defined in objective terms. I really think this is splitting hairs as any of available tyres is more than adequate. Some may last longer than others. But as far as day-to-day riding, they all can handle anything you require of them. They will all allow sufficient traction to do 2-finger stoppies under braking. They will all let you drag centrestand and exhaust under cornering. Which is way, way faster than any sane person should be doing on streets. After all, some of these tyres were designed for bikes weighing +200lbs more with 8x power!
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Old March 14th, 2020, 06:00 AM   #21
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Sorry to bring back an old thread. But, I have had experience with the Michelin City Grip tires and they are fantastic! I use the 120/80-16 rear (which weighs 5 lbs less than the stock dunlop) and a 90/80-16 up front (4 lbs off the front tire over the stock dunlop). The grip is outstanding in dry and wet weather. I get about 4-5k out of a rear and double for a front. Excellent handling tires, the bike even felt noticeably quicker in acceleration, the braking felt better at high speeds (hard braking into sharp corner), and the suspension seemed to track a little better over minor imperfections in the road (it felt more responsive, but less sloppy). Overall, I'd give them a 8.5/10 for the tires. Excellent price point, great grip, and less weight! It's got great benefits all around.
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Old March 14th, 2020, 08:23 AM   #22
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Thank you. Up to date feedback on how the new generation of tires do on our ninjettes is helpful to many of us!
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Old March 14th, 2020, 10:29 AM   #23
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Sorry to bring back an old thread. But, I have had experience with the Michelin City Grip tires and they are fantastic! I use the 120/80-16 rear (which weighs 5 lbs less than the stock dunlop) and a 90/80-16 up front (4 lbs off the front tire over the stock dunlop). The grip is outstanding in dry and wet weather. I get about 4-5k out of a rear and double for a front. Excellent handling tires, the bike even felt noticeably quicker in acceleration, the braking felt better at high speeds (hard braking into sharp corner), and the suspension seemed to track a little better over minor imperfections in the road (it felt more responsive, but less sloppy). Overall, I'd give them a 8.5/10 for the tires. Excellent price point, great grip, and less weight! It's got great benefits all around.
Awesome data, thank you!!!
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Old March 14th, 2020, 10:35 AM   #24
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Yeah, I had tried out a set of Pirelli MT75's. I only got 1700 miles of hard riding out of it (last 300 miles where non-stop 90+ mph sweepers and I ride the same way with the City Grips, and they get much better mileage and handle just as good, and even better in the rain.. The starting picture is at 1100 miles, the following is after 2 days of riding (300 miles each day) through middle Tennessee, just south of Land Between The Lakes.



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Old March 15th, 2020, 02:54 AM   #25
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Just say no to Pirelli street tyres eh? Seems they have not embraced the benefits of silica compounds that gives lower rolling-resistance, more grip AND higher durability.

One note about speed-ratings. It’s a measure of tyre’s ability to tolerate load and heat. Rating is maximum continuous speed (at maximum load) where tyre can shed heat as fast as it builds it. Thus achieving balance that can be sustained indefinitely. There's criss-cross function where less-than-max loaded tyre can handle more speed and vice-versa. I don’t plan on holding more than 80-mph for long periods of time on my commutes, so any tyre with higher speed rating than that is fine.

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Old January 22nd, 2024, 03:13 AM   #26
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Another 4 years have passed, any updates on reviews between current 16" stock size or lighter options for handling, grip, and overall performance on a pregen, and where to order from?
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Old January 27th, 2024, 10:53 AM   #27
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Is there a more active forum where can talk to people about current tire options? Any sites where folks still track pregen 250s?
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Old January 27th, 2024, 02:22 PM   #28
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The last tires I got for my 250 are the Bridgestone BT45s that are on it now. They and the previous set have done a good job for me for close to ten years. I'd be interested in what else is currently available, but I might not try anything different anyway.
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Old January 31st, 2024, 11:31 PM   #29
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Have plenty of competitive auto racing and wheel/tire tuning experience, and on bikes track schools, but not bike tire/suspension tuning, love some help.

For pregen 16s, looking to minimize weight especially unsprung and rotating, current options in 70 or 80 sidewall, without going taller than stock to 90 sidewall are:

Shinko SR 740
Bridgestone Battlax SC1
Continental Conti Scoot
Michelin City Grip 2
Avon AM63 Viper Stryke
Pirelli Angel

1. Anyone have experience on more than one of these/could compare their results? Use is spirited twisty roads, warm to hot weather, humid, at times can get heavy rains, but don't plan to ride in rain, not much mileage, prefer handling, feel, and grip over mileage.

2. Anyone tried a 90 width front tire, how would profile change over the narrow pregen front rim, and how would it affect handling, feel, grip? If keeping rear at 120, would it create an imbalance, shifting traction loss to the front first instead of the rear?

3. Anyone tried a 70 series sidewall and could compare it to the stock 80 sidewall for handling, feel, grip? Consider the lower gearing a plus.

4. Would a 110/70 or 90/80 weigh less? Where can the tire weights be found?

@memphisninja , @DannoXYZ , @Theorist , @adouglas, @Sirref, @petrolhead anyone who has data/experimented, love your input.

Last futzed with by oldnewninjarider; February 1st, 2024 at 12:59 AM.
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Old February 13th, 2024, 02:22 AM   #30
Mohawk
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I switched to KR-1S front end on my ZZR so run a 17" wheel now.
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Old February 17th, 2024, 12:26 AM   #31
oldnewninjarider
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Quote:
Originally Posted by Mohawk View Post
I switched to KR-1S front end on my ZZR so run a 17" wheel now.
@Mohawk can you feel the acceleration, responsiveness difference due to the extra weight/inertia/rotational mass further out on the 17s vs 16s?

Quote:
Originally Posted by memphisninja
I use the 120/80-16 rear (which weighs 5 lbs less than the stock dunlop) and a 90/80-16 up front (4 lbs off the front tire over the stock dunlop).
@memphisninja what were the actual weights of those Michelin's, did you measure them?
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Old February 17th, 2024, 12:12 PM   #32
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Theres not really much difference as the ZZR came with a 17" wheels. That said the KR1-S forks & swingarm moved both wheels backward relative to the frame. That definitely improved the turn in, this thing now turns on a thought.

Weight is the only real difference between different wheel/tyre size combinations & 16" came to the fore because they were lighter than the normal 18" wheel/tyre combination of the day. The down side was they needed higher profiles to get the correct rolling circumference, but that had its own issues. So 17" became the preferred option due to lower profile tyres reducing weight even if the rim weighed a little more.
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