Bike won't start after valve adjustment

[Soundtrackzz]

Hey all I recently adjusted my valves. After that my bike started for about thirty seconds and then would die if you ever gave it throttle. Now it just wont start at all. It will still crank but no ignition. So heres what Ive done so far. I put in new spark plugs and I do have a spark. I removed and cleaned the carbs, they were filled with loose air filter particles. I disassembled the entire carburetor and cleaned every part of it. I cant sync the carbs because obviously the bike wont start. What do I do now? a compression test? Thanks for the help

[VaFish]

Are you sure you are getting fuel through the carbs?

[Soundtrackzz]

Fuel comes out when you drain the float bowls if thats what you mean. But I dont know more than that.

[ducatiman]

disintegrated air filter media in carbs is tough.

Did you remove both the pilot screws AND jets...blowing back and forth between the 2 openings with compressed air and carb cleaner spray?

Also the air correction jets (on the inlet/backside of the carb body) need to be clear. The offset one is pilot...center is main. Best to clear these with the emulsion tube and needle jet AND the pilot screw/jet ALL removed.

See pic, though these not 250 carbs, air corr jets marked in red.

PS under the pilot screws reside springs, washers and orings...beware, return in their original order.

Compressed air is compulsory to clear all this. Didja?

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

Hey all I recently adjusted my valves. After that my bike started for about thirty seconds and then would die.........

Normally, the problem is in the last disturbed thing: the adjustment of the valves.

Could it be that you used the wrong gauges, or used the wrong position of the cams?

Welcome, Zach !!!

[Soundtrackzz]

I removed every single piece of the carb possible and sprayed carb cleaner through it. I got a alot in my eyes. I didnt use compressed air however. I will recheck the valves tonight, Its entirely possible I screwed it up. Also some new info, I just did a compression test and im only at about 90 psi on both cylinders. So I guess i need to get down to the psitons but what exactly am I looking for?

[SLOWn60]

Let's step back a bit.
How did the bike run before you started working on the valve adjustment.
Why did you decide to adjust the valves? Was something going on that made you decide to adjust them?
Have you adjusted valves before?
Why do you think the air filter disintegrated (what caused it to disintegrate?)
ALWAYS wear eye protection!

[Soundtrackzz]

The bike ran decent except at low idle. But this is my first bike so not a lot to judge off of. The main issue I was having is that at stop light the bike would die unless given constant throttle, and then even still sometimes it would die. A bad idle seems to be indicative of bad valves, or at least that what everyone told me, so I decided to adjust them. And no Ive never adjusted valves before this. I really don't know why the air filter disintegrated, I do know that in the year i have owned it that i haven't put any oil on it. I would assume the same has happened through out its 13 year life.

[SLOWn60]

Great answers. It gives us a better understanding of what was going on as well as your experience pulling wrenches.

My suggestion is you first very methodically; recheck you're valve clearances and also make sure the valve timing is correct too. (The piston position and cam positions).

Thoroughly re-clean the carbs. Not because filter material has clogged them; there's no way for it to get into the fuel passages though it could affect moving parts.

See if you can get it to fire up.

Report back.

Don't worry about the compression test just yet. There may be a wee bit of filter material messing with a valve but it shouldn't prevent getting some fire in the holes and should clear or pound out of a valve seat after a bit of run time.

[VaFish]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

The bike ran decent except at low idle. But this is my first bike so not a lot to judge off of. The main issue I was having is that at stop light the bike would die unless given constant throttle, and then even still sometimes it would die. A bad idle seems to be indicative of bad valves, or at least that what everyone told me, so I decided to adjust them. And no Ive never adjusted valves before this. I really don't know why the air filter disintegrated, I do know that in the year i have owned it that i haven't put any oil on it. I would assume the same has happened through out its 13 year life.

I adjusted my valves for the fist time a couple weeks ago. I followed the steps in the manual, thought I had everything right, got it all buttoned back up, and started it up, only to hear a clicking noise. Had to wait a week until I had more time to pull it back apart again. I had 1 valved too loose and 2 of them too tight. So based on my experience I would say it's pretty easy to mess up your first time.

The low compression makes me wonder if you don't have leaking valves now.

As @Motofool said (and I have said before) the last thing you messed with is probably the source of the problem. Make sure you have the cams in the right position, make sure you are using the correct feeler gauges. (not confusing inch and metric markings)

[Soundtrackzz]

I did both those things. I used .005 inch or .127 mm for both intake and exhaust just to keep things simple. The gauge slides in but there is some resistance. Tomorrow Ill go get another set of feeler gauges and try again. I also recleaned the carbs with compressed air, but really they seem in good shape not gummy or anything. I forgot to mention that when I was waiting for the air filter to come in the mail I was at least able to get the bike to start for a moment by fully covering the carb intakes with a towel and my hand.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

....... I forgot to mention that when I was waiting for the air filter to come in the mail I was at least able to get the bike to start for a moment by fully covering the carb intakes with a towel and my hand.

Is it possible that during the valve adjustment, some of the vacuum tubes get disconnected?

In order to operate properly, the chamber above the diaphragms must receive strong signal from the vacuum created by the aspiration of the cylinders.

[Soundtrackzz]

Its entirely possible that I did and probably explains why i have this tube that I cant figure out what it goes to. Is there a picture or diagram somewhere I can look at to make sure I have all the tubes connected correctly?

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

Its entirely possible that I did and probably explains why i have this tube that I cant figure out what it goes to. Is there a picture or diagram somewhere I can look at to make sure I have all the tubes connected correctly?

This section should have some info or photos -

http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Ninja250_Howto

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

Its entirely possible that I did and probably explains why i have this tube that I cant figure out what it goes to. Is there a picture or diagram somewhere I can look at to make sure I have all the tubes connected correctly?

That one is to drain accumulated oil from the front right corner of the air box, next to the right carb's intake.

That one is located upstream of the ventury (throat of the carbs) and does not affect the vacuum signal that the diaphragms and petcock need.

Find pictures here:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Carburetor_photos

[SLOWn60]

Originally Posted by Motofool

Find pictures here:
http://faq.ninja250.org/wiki/Carburetor_photos

I knew you or someone else would come through and find it faster than I!

[Soundtrackzz]

IT LIVES! the valves were just a little too loose. So i readjusted. It revs high and a little spazy right now but with a carb sync and idle adjustment ill get it worked out. Thanks so much for everyone that helped. I really appreciate it

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

IT LIVES!..........Thanks so much for everyone that helped. I really appreciate it

You are welcome

[CaliGrrl]

Whooo!

[VaFish]

It took me 2 tries to get my valves right.

Glad you got it worked out.

[Soundtrackzz]

New issue though. After changing the tires I took it for a first test ride around the neighborhood. The bike ride fine at first but the revs would become erratic and it died at the first stop sign. The only way to get the bike started again and not have to push it back home was open the throttle all the way. Then it would rev barely to mid-range and only go less than 5mph. It would go faster after a few minutes but then of course die at the next stop sign

[SLOWn60]

hoses are not connected properly or completely. That's where I'd look first.

[Soundtrackzz]

The pilot jet came out. But it now's rpms at the redline in 1St and 2ND and gets really high in 3RE as well. The idle adjustment knob is all the way in and the throttle cable isn't too tight

[InvisiBill]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

The pilot jet came out. But it now's rpms at the redline in 1St and 2ND and gets really high in 3RE as well. The idle adjustment knob is all the way in and the throttle cable isn't too tight

If you're saying that it's idling too high, turn the knob out to lower it. The more you have it screwed in (righty-tighty), the more it will hold the throttle open, raising your idle.

[Soundtrackzz]

The screw is all the way out. A high idle isn't the problem. The problem is when the throttle gets touched

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

.....The bike ride fine at first but the revs would become erratic and it died at the first stop sign. The only way to get the bike started again and not have to push it back home was open the throttle all the way. Then it would rev barely to mid-range and only go less than 5mph. It would go faster after a few minutes but then of course die at the next stop sign

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

The pilot jet came out. But it now's rpms at the redline in 1St and 2ND and gets really high in 3RE as well. The idle adjustment knob is all the way in and the throttle cable isn't too tight

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

The screw is all the way out. A high idle isn't the problem. The problem is when the throttle gets touched

The last posts result a little confusing to me.
Do you mind explaining the new problem a little more?
Thanks

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Soundtrackzz

The pilot jet came out. But it now's rpms at the redline in 1St and 2ND and gets really high in 3RE as well. The idle adjustment knob is all the way in and the throttle cable isn't too tight

It sounds like something is not assembled correctly in the carbs and they are not going fully closed when they should be.

With the engine off you should be able to open the throttle all the way and it should snap back quickly. Also check that the slides are not hanging-up and are all the way down when not running.

Don't ride it until you have it working properly!

EDIT: Julius has a good point - could be an intake leak. I would spray something around the intake boots to see if there's a change in RPMs. That's assuming it will run at a moderate RPM and not redline the entire time.

[juliusmichaelhonrada]

sounds like a vacuum leak , cracks in the intake manifold or boots try using the choke if it will idle normally without throttle

[ducatiman]

way back in the original post, he reported air filter media inside the carbs...

could that junk be preventing slide return? or jammed up the throttle shafts?

agree with jkv45....don't ride until you control dangerous "runaway" condition.

I'd suggest starting with a carb pull.