November 20th, 2014, 08:42 AM | #1 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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Batteries in Winter
I'm confused reading about winter storage.
It seems that everyone recommends battery tenders, but it also seems that the battery stays in the bike with the negative terminal disconnected. I took my batteries out completely and have them in my house. Why couldn't I just keep them there, charge them up before re-installing, and be on my way?
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November 20th, 2014, 08:49 AM | #2 |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
Location: Northern KY
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Nothing really wrong with doing that as long as you keep the battery charged during the storage. It's letting batteries sit around dead that kills them.
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November 20th, 2014, 08:49 AM | #3 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Nick
Location: Ontario
Join Date: Feb 2012 Motorcycle(s): '09 Ninja 250r (SOLD) - Black. 2011 ZX-6R Green/Black - 2001 Garbage Bag Green KLR650 Posts: 275
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Leaving it in the bike over the winter with a tender is fine if you live in a warmer climate.
I've always removed my battery from the bike, stored it inside on a tender, and have never had a single issue at the beginning of the year. |
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November 20th, 2014, 08:51 AM | #4 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
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So if they're currently all charged up they can just sit?
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November 20th, 2014, 08:52 AM | #5 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Lee
Location: Monroe, LA
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Battery tenders are designed to stay connected. When the battery needs charging, they charge it. Once it's charged, they shut off. That's how they differ from the old style charger that would continue to charge after the battery was "full". No need to disconnect the negative terminal on the battery unless there is some kind of short in the electrical system that would drain the battery.
Cold weather won't hurt a charged battery. It can only damage the battery when its been discharged and it gets really cold. Keeping the battery inside and charging before riding is fine as long as the battery doesn't discharge excessively during storage. Excessively discharged batteries, especially older ones, may not be restored by charging. My rule of thumb is to charge stored batteries every month or so. |
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November 20th, 2014, 08:55 AM | #6 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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I don't have a tender, I do have a car-battery charger. Trying to decide if the tender is worth it.
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November 20th, 2014, 09:02 AM | #7 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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Also I have two batteries so I think I would need two tenders, so even the cheapest Tender Jr. that's $50 I'd rather not spend if I don't have to.
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November 20th, 2014, 09:03 AM | #8 |
wat
Name: wat
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i read somewhere that you aren't supposed to charge chem or agm bats under -20c. random info.
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November 20th, 2014, 09:10 AM | #9 |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
Location: Northern KY
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Does your current charger have a 2amp setting? If so, just use that and you don't have to have a tender hooked up all the time. I have 4 bikes and 3 4wheelers and only 2 tenders. I just rotate them once a week, so buying just one isn't really a problem.
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November 20th, 2014, 09:52 AM | #10 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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I'll have to check the settings - I know it has a slow trickle, fast trickle, and a 50A quick-start. I don't remember the amp settings for the trickles.
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November 20th, 2014, 10:14 AM | #11 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
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Even though my bikes are garaged, if i dont ride them once a month for a good ride, i will put them on the tender for a day or so. So no need to buy numerous tenders. As long as you charge it monthly for a day or 2 you SHOULD be OK.
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November 20th, 2014, 10:37 AM | #12 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Paul
Location: UK
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Quote:
Lead acid batteries self discharge over time, even new they lose at least 5% a month and the flatter they are the faster they degenerate. Last futzed with by Ninjinsky; November 20th, 2014 at 01:03 PM. |
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November 20th, 2014, 10:52 AM | #13 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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I think that my charger is 2/10/50.
The manual for the Elite says: "Standard charging current 0.4 A, maximum 4A" Does that mean that 2A is fine?
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November 20th, 2014, 12:50 PM | #14 |
EX500 full of EX250 parts
Name: Bill
Location: Grand Rapids-ish, MI
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Get a Schumacher battery tender from TSC for $20. http://www.tractorsupply.com/en/stor...intainer-6-12v Switch it between the batteries every so often to keep them both topped off.
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November 20th, 2014, 01:48 PM | #15 |
cadd cadd cadd
Name: Cadd
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2 amps sounds right. Just charge it for an hour or two. Then test the battery. Once it gets to 13V, stop charging the battery.
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November 20th, 2014, 02:08 PM | #16 |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
Location: Northern KY
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As a general rule of thumb, no more than 2amps while charging or you take away from battery life. I threw 10amps at my brand new r6 battery while at the track one weekend. It fried it in 2 days. Not to mention, I think that to much amps while the battery is installed in the bike can damage other electrical components. Basically, it's the same reason they say to not jump start a bike off a running car.
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November 20th, 2014, 02:35 PM | #17 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Paul
Location: UK
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Quote:
Also I know that with the car if I take the battery out the engine management forgets its profile and it runs bad for a day or two while it re-maps. Not sure if the new ninjas injection is that complex but worth knowing. |
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November 20th, 2014, 02:52 PM | #18 | |
ninjette.org sage
Name: Lane
Location: Medford, OR
Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250 (trackbike), CBR600RR, GS500F Posts: 588
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Quote:
Look at it this way: The tender is typically a little less than the price of a new battery. If it extends the life of a single battery long enough to keep you from having to replace it once, it's paid for itself. ...and motorcycle batteries tend not to last as long as car batteries, and they need more charging even if you ride a lot (I had an electrical engineer explain it to me once). I have three motorcycles in the garage. Two have the tender pigtails installed, and the other has the old style clamp on the electrode, since it's easy to access. I rotate the tender between the three bikes every other day. Every battery is at least 5 years old at this point, and I haven't had any issues with them. |
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November 20th, 2014, 05:29 PM | #19 |
Inline 4!!!
Name: Danny
Location: MA
Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2008 CBR600rr, 1987 KLR 250 Posts: A lot.
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New battery is ~$60
battery tender is ~$30, just saying
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November 20th, 2014, 05:30 PM | #20 |
Cat herder
Name: Gort
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Battery tender jr: $22.95
New battery: Approx. $35 Math rules. I bought my battery tender in 1987 or thereabouts. Still works fine, looks exactly like the new one. Just buy the thing. Bonus tip: Do the permanent-install harness and run it into your tail. Get a USB charger that plugs into the special end on the harness (Battery Tender offers one but there are others. Hey presto.. you now have a built-in tap to charge your phone. Extra bonus tip: Unplug the USB charger widget when you're not using it or you'll drain your battery.
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November 20th, 2014, 07:37 PM | #21 |
ninjette.org guru
Name: Lee
Location: Monroe, LA
Join Date: Feb 2014 Motorcycle(s): Rebel 250s, Ninja 250s VN750s (currently nine total) Posts: 465
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My battery tender, which is not a Battery Tender brand, will charge at one or two amps. I use the one amp rate, which I believe is the better choice of the two rates. Think I paid $20 for it at Target a few years ago.
If you need a new battery, Yuasa sells an AGM battery that fits the Ninja. Great, long lasting batteries at reasonable prices. Amazon usually has the best price. Crappy Chinese batteries may sell for a few dollars less, but they usually don't last half as long as a Yuasa, and often not that long. |
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November 24th, 2014, 11:38 PM | #22 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Edward
Location: Arcadia
Join Date: Oct 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250 Posts: 24
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Interesting, it seem like to me battery tender + electric bill always > a new battery.
Where my Maths goes wrong? |
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November 24th, 2014, 11:45 PM | #23 |
Private Joker
Name: Ben
Location: Towson, MD
Join Date: Nov 2012 Motorcycle(s): '99/'01 Ninja 250 "sketchy", '13 Ninja 300 "yoshi", '03 GSXR 600 "merlin" Posts: A lot.
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I've never actually winterized a bike of mine but I'm doing so with my track pregen this winter. Would firing the bike up once every week to every other week and running it for ~10-20min keep the battery from dying or should I just fully winterize the bike and put it on the tender?
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November 25th, 2014, 07:13 AM | #24 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jay
Location: CT
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If i dont keep mine on a tender (which would be for 1 or 2 days per month) then it is because i will take it for a 20 minute ride every month. Granted both my bikes are 2011 so they are relatively new, but they are OEM batteries and i havent had an issue. The 250 was bought new and the 1000 was bought with 1,000 miles on it.
I could be wrong but i dont think it needs to be weekly thing, monthly has worked for me thus far. They are also stored in a (somewhat) heated garage. it doesnt get below 50 degrees in the basement/garage. I wouldnt start the bike up and just let it idle/rev. If your not going to ride it around, bring it to temp and get some load on it, then just put it on stands and put the battery on a tender. |
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November 25th, 2014, 07:28 AM | #25 |
antiant
Name: antiant
Location: Cali
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Or you could just get a lithium battery and not worry about this stuff and save weight in the process!
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November 25th, 2014, 07:41 AM | #26 | |
Cat herder
Name: Gort
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Quote:
When I plug mine in at the end of the season, the red (charging) light goes on for a few seconds while the box is sensing the voltage of the battery -- which is of course already fully charged. Then it flips to green (maintenance) and stays there all winter. Electricity usage is minimal... pennies. Still cheaper than buying a new battery. Plus there's the environmental cost of recycling the old battery. Yes, they do recover the heavy metals but it's still a dirty process. Far better to maintain what you have than treat it as disposable.
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I am NOT an adrenaline junkie, I'm a skill junkie. - csmith12 Nam et ipsa scientia potestas est. Heri historia. Cras mysterium. Hodie donum est. Carpe diem. |
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November 25th, 2014, 07:51 AM | #27 | |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jason
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Quote:
The battery tender is a one time thing, not a consumable, so, if it lasts 5 years, that is $4 a year ($2 a year if you use http://www.harborfreight.com/automat...ger-42292.html which works just fine) keeping a battery fully charged will cost pennies. keeping an approximately $25 battery ( cheapest i could find in 2 second search) alive for the same 5 years costs $5 a year so Let's say that you pay another $2 in electricity (extreme case I'm sure) to keep the battery topped up. That's $9-11 a year for 5 years = $45-55 1 battery a year at $25 for 5 years = $125
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November 25th, 2014, 07:55 AM | #28 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jason
Location: Monroe, MI
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you beat me! I'm in a plant, and had to go to work, I was looking for usage chart like that
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November 25th, 2014, 08:02 AM | #29 | |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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Quote:
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November 25th, 2014, 08:17 AM | #30 |
ninjette.org certified postwhore
Name: Jason
Location: Monroe, MI
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LOL more like this....
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'82 XV920: Soon to be tracker--'00 KLR685:adv --'04 DRZ400E--'12 Super Tenere --'13 Versys Ride more, worry less. |
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November 25th, 2014, 08:20 AM | #31 | |
The Corner Whisperer
Name: Chris (aka Reactor)
Location: Northern KY
Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much.
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Quote:
It's a track bike, it takes about .5h to winterize and will only cost you about 10 red-bulls tops. Just do it mang! Don't be lazy with any bike you push your luck on.
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Goal: Shake A Million Hands | Look through the corners | Track Day Prep | Closest track? | The Mid-Ohio School |
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November 25th, 2014, 11:43 AM | #32 | |
Cat herder
Name: Gort
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It won't wear out. Ever. Buy the right thing once. Take care of it. Don't lose it. You're set FOR LIFE. Some other stuff I bought a long, LONG time ago that's still just fine: Archer (Radio Shack) six-outlet cord reel: 1979 Sears Digi-Tork torque wrench: 1984 Sears 1/2" breaker bar: 1983 Sears toolbox: 1980 Harbor Freight floor jack and jack stands: 1992 8 oz (?) bottle of Permatex anti-sieze: 1984, should last the rest of my life etc.
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November 25th, 2014, 12:44 PM | #33 | ||
EX500 full of EX250 parts
Name: Bill
Location: Grand Rapids-ish, MI
Join Date: Jul 2012 Motorcycle(s): '18 Ninja 400 • '09 Ninja 500R (selling) • '98 VFR800 (project) • '85 Vulcan VN700 (sold) Posts: A lot.
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Quote:
Quote:
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November 26th, 2014, 07:29 AM | #34 |
Old and slow
Name: Lohman
Location: Aiken, S.C.
Join Date: May 2014 Motorcycle(s): Suzuki TL1000R, Honda CBR600F3, Ninja 250 Posts: 889
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Perfect and Ideal.
pull the battery from the bike, bring it to a temp controlled area, place on battery TENDER (not charger)... so I have this shallow plastic dish/pan thing, put the batt in there and on the tender and on the shelf in the laundry room from Dec to April. Almost as good leave it on the bike, attach the batt tender, turn the ignition on (do not start the engine) about once a month and then turn it off and see that the tender shifts from "maintain" to "charge" (most tenders have a yellow "charging" light and a green "tending" light. You want to see that it shifts from green to yellow... and then back to green with in an hour. note, this will mean that your battery will live between 5 - 10 years... not forever. a fully charged battery will have an acid content that will keep it from freezing down to -60'F... even then, the liquid in the battery is sort of "slushy", not frozen... only with the batt discharges can it freeze and crack. biggest killer, running a battery to zero or letting it sit to zero. A battery will lose about 10% of its charge a month sitting still doing nothing. The CBR ran on the OEM battery for 9 years... finally pooped out, so got a new one. The regulator/rectifier crapped out the next summer and ran the batt down to zero... charged it to full, and with in a month it was leaving me by the side of the road. New battery run to zero died at one year old. Quick winterization for the bike... 2 oz of sta-bil in the gas tank, fill the tank all the way up, as full as you can get it. put the bike up on stands (if you have them ) or just thin wooden blocks between the wheels and the concrete, battery on the tender, blanket over the top... PUT THE KEY SOMEPLACE YOU WILL REMEMBER, like in the seat latch lock (if you have a seat latch) |
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November 26th, 2014, 10:10 AM | #35 |
Long Time Rider
Name: Blue
Location: Charlotte, NC
Join Date: Sep 2010 Motorcycle(s): 2009 Kawasaki Ninja 250R Posts: A lot.
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Kawasaki recommends using a 1.5 Amp Automatic Charger. The Schumacher Model XM1-5 is a charger and maintainer.
I've had the same battery in my 2009 for almost 6 years and no problems. The battery was charged more frequently whenever the temp dropped and stayed below freezing. https://www.ninjette.org/forums/show...4&postcount=18 https://www.ninjette.org/wiki/Battery |
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December 1st, 2014, 04:26 PM | #36 |
ninjette.org member
Name: Edward
Location: Arcadia
Join Date: Oct 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2005 Kawasaki Ninja 250 Posts: 24
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Ha, so interesting and learn so much when you guy are discuss so depth about it.
Just got my first commute bike and maybe my city would not snow and never think of idle the bike in winter. Thanks for the input. |
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December 1st, 2014, 05:00 PM | #37 |
Daily Ninjette Rider
Name: Steve
Location: Hollywood, FL
Join Date: Jul 2014 Motorcycle(s): 2012 Ninja 250R, 2015 Vespa GTS 300 IE Super, 1989 Honda Elite 80 (SOLD) Posts: 402
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I just ordered this one: http://www.amazon.com/gp/product/B00...?ie=UTF8&psc=1
The battery connector will be nice as well. It's a PiTa getting to the battery on the 250.
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