In-car audio advice needed.

Mountain Dew · January 17th, 2014, 05:29 PM

Current setup in a 1978 Ranchero:

Head unit: Alpine CDE-135BT

Speakers: Alpine 6x9 SPS-609 2x door-mounted

Subwoofer: Alpine 10" S-10 (not sure if it's 2 or 4-ohm voice coils)

Amp: Alpine MRP-M500 500w

Since I have a few extra dollars this paycheck, I figured I'll upgrade something here (instead of buying a lens, like I had planned). Lots of bass, an doesn't distort until you get to higher volume. But I want to go past that, since sometimes it isn't loud enough on the freeway.

I have a 1000w Lanzar VIBE421 amp sitting in my garage from a while ago. By JUST replacing the 500w amp with this, will that give me any sort of improvement over the current setup? If not, what should I do?

I plan on swapping out the amps regardless, because my dad wants it for the Vette, since we're not doing a crazy system in there. Unless of course it would be detrimental to my truck.

TnNinjaGirl · January 17th, 2014, 05:46 PM

Is it your subs distorting or your 6x9s? You probably need some crossovers

csmith12 · January 17th, 2014, 08:09 PM

Yea, maybe crossovers but I would have to ask what kind of enclosure? You have to have enough cu. volume or it will not perform to par.

That sub requires sealed box volume: 0.54-0.89 cu. ft. and ported box volume: 0.79-1.34 cu. ft. and its a 4-ohm voice.

csmith12 · January 17th, 2014, 08:09 PM

Oh, another question. Firing the sub forward or backward?

csmith12 · January 17th, 2014, 08:10 PM

Also, for full disclosure. I haven't done this stuff since I was 17yrs old. So my knowledge could be a big dated.

I might learn a thing or two here.

Mountain Dew · January 18th, 2014, 12:18 AM

Sounds like the sub is distorting the speakers. I'll look into a crossover. I have no idea what firing the sub forward or backwards means. I'm not sure how big the box is. I didn't do this setup, it was there when I got it.

csmith12 · January 20th, 2014, 11:27 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by Mountain Dew

Sounds like the sub is distorting the speakers. I'll look into a crossover. I have no idea what firing the sub forward or backwards means. I'm not sure how big the box is. I didn't do this setup, it was there when I got it.

Firing the sub forward or backward simply means which direction the sub is facing, toward the front of the vehicle or rear of the vehicle. In your Ranchero, they are most likely firing forward. In some vehicles (mostly small cars) the acoustics between the sub and other speakers lends itself to fire the sub backward.

The very first thing I would do is ensure the volume of the enclosure. Get out your measuring tape and do up some 8th grade math

to ensure you have enough air space for the sub to work. Once you have validated that you have enough air space in the enclosure then maybe look into an electronic crossover. Crossovers are just fancy filters ya know...

I would also "think" (never had one of those) that the extra amp you have would work just fine. it has a 500w channel you can use to power the sub as they seem to be compatible.

TnNinjaGirl · January 20th, 2014, 02:40 PM

I think it kind of depends on what the distortion sounds like. If the amp is "clipping" or there isn't enough/or too much air the box the woofer can bottom out or the cone with "smack" the air. Thiele/Small Parameters blah blah amp power blah blah signal clipping blah blah..

There is a lot of math that goes into an audiophile system. Or really any system you want to sound halfway decent.

TnNinjaGirl · January 20th, 2014, 02:47 PM

Oh, that Alpine amp is more powerful in that it can produce 500w x 1 channel at 2 ohms. That should be a perfect match for your s-10's

If you are using your head unit to power your 6x9's I can almost guarantee there is slipping because it only puts out 18w per channel.

You might be able to get away with just setting the in unit low pass filter. It should have all kinds of slopes programmed into it but I think 12db is pretty standard if I remember correctly.

Definitely look into the subwoofer box volume. Check into the crossovers which whould be built into your head unit and/or amplifier and if possible put an amplifier on your 6x9's

Mountain Dew · January 21st, 2014, 04:25 PM

Okay, I'm going to preface this that I have no experience or knowledge in audio systems.

The sub is firing upwards. It's laying down in the smuggler's box. It's raining right now so I'll measure the box when it stops.

I don't believe it's clipping. I youtubed it, and it didn't sound like it. Definitely sounds like it's coming from the speakers. I can't really explain what it sounds like.

I believe the speakers are wired into the amp, I'll have to check that too. With the quality of everything else when it was restored (paint, wheels, interior, etc), I want to say it was done properly.

alex.s · January 21st, 2014, 05:25 PM

you're going to burn out your alternator if you don't put a cap between it and that amp.

don't bother running woofers off the deck. its a waste of time, run an amp for the woofers and an amp for the sub. if you have separate tweeters they are fine off the deck. be sure you are using hipass and lowpass filters on the separate amps so you don't have distortion from trying to jam too much sound into all your speakers... it sounds best if you can separate each frequency range into the appropriate driver... low to sub, mids to woofers, high to tweeters... also the difference between two voice coils in series vs parallel (the difference between 2 ohm and 4 ohm) is pretty huge so make sure its right for your amp setup

TnNinjaGirl · January 21st, 2014, 05:29 PM

@Mountain Dew can you take a quality audio clip so we can hear what's going on?

csmith12 · January 21st, 2014, 06:53 PM

Do you hear a sort of clicking sound from the sub?

Mountain Dew · February 16th, 2014, 01:56 AM

Link to original page on YouTube.

January 17th, 2014, 05:29 PM	#1
Mountain Dew Ambrosia. Name: Jaymie Location: Oahu, Hawaii Join Date: Aug 2011 Motorcycle(s): 1974 Honda CB550K0 W.I.P. Posts: A lot.	In-car audio advice needed. Current setup in a 1978 Ranchero: Head unit: Alpine CDE-135BT Speakers: Alpine 6x9 SPS-609 2x door-mounted Subwoofer: Alpine 10" S-10 (not sure if it's 2 or 4-ohm voice coils) Amp: Alpine MRP-M500 500w Since I have a few extra dollars this paycheck, I figured I'll upgrade something here (instead of buying a lens, like I had planned). Lots of bass, an doesn't distort until you get to higher volume. But I want to go past that, since sometimes it isn't loud enough on the freeway. I have a 1000w Lanzar VIBE421 amp sitting in my garage from a while ago. By JUST replacing the 500w amp with this, will that give me any sort of improvement over the current setup? If not, what should I do? I plan on swapping out the amps regardless, because my dad wants it for the Vette, since we're not doing a crazy system in there. Unless of course it would be detrimental to my truck. __________________________________________________ Life's better on the Mountain.

January 17th, 2014, 08:09 PM	#3
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Yea, maybe crossovers but I would have to ask what kind of enclosure? You have to have enough cu. volume or it will not perform to par. That sub requires sealed box volume: 0.54-0.89 cu. ft. and ported box volume: 0.79-1.34 cu. ft. and its a 4-ohm voice. __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

January 17th, 2014, 08:09 PM	#4
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Oh, another question. Firing the sub forward or backward? __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

January 17th, 2014, 08:10 PM	#5
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Also, for full disclosure. I haven't done this stuff since I was 17yrs old. So my knowledge could be a big dated. I might learn a thing or two here. __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

January 18th, 2014, 12:18 AM	#6
Mountain Dew Ambrosia. Name: Jaymie Location: Oahu, Hawaii Join Date: Aug 2011 Motorcycle(s): 1974 Honda CB550K0 W.I.P. Posts: A lot.	Sounds like the sub is distorting the speakers. I'll look into a crossover. I have no idea what firing the sub forward or backwards means. I'm not sure how big the box is. I didn't do this setup, it was there when I got it. __________________________________________________ Life's better on the Mountain.

January 17th, 2014, 05:46 PM	#2
TnNinjaGirl Ms. Personality Name: CB Location: Murvill, TN Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): Depends on the week you ask Posts: A lot.	Is it your subs distorting or your 6x9s? You probably need some crossovers

January 20th, 2014, 02:40 PM	#8
TnNinjaGirl Ms. Personality Name: CB Location: Murvill, TN Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): Depends on the week you ask Posts: A lot.	I think it kind of depends on what the distortion sounds like. If the amp is "clipping" or there isn't enough/or too much air the box the woofer can bottom out or the cone with "smack" the air. Thiele/Small Parameters blah blah amp power blah blah signal clipping blah blah.. There is a lot of math that goes into an audiophile system. Or really any system you want to sound halfway decent.

January 20th, 2014, 02:47 PM	#9
TnNinjaGirl Ms. Personality Name: CB Location: Murvill, TN Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): Depends on the week you ask Posts: A lot.	Oh, that Alpine amp is more powerful in that it can produce 500w x 1 channel at 2 ohms. That should be a perfect match for your s-10's If you are using your head unit to power your 6x9's I can almost guarantee there is slipping because it only puts out 18w per channel. You might be able to get away with just setting the in unit low pass filter. It should have all kinds of slopes programmed into it but I think 12db is pretty standard if I remember correctly. Definitely look into the subwoofer box volume. Check into the crossovers which whould be built into your head unit and/or amplifier and if possible put an amplifier on your 6x9's

January 21st, 2014, 04:25 PM	#10
Mountain Dew Ambrosia. Name: Jaymie Location: Oahu, Hawaii Join Date: Aug 2011 Motorcycle(s): 1974 Honda CB550K0 W.I.P. Posts: A lot.	Okay, I'm going to preface this that I have no experience or knowledge in audio systems. The sub is firing upwards. It's laying down in the smuggler's box. It's raining right now so I'll measure the box when it stops. I don't believe it's clipping. I youtubed it, and it didn't sound like it. Definitely sounds like it's coming from the speakers. I can't really explain what it sounds like. I believe the speakers are wired into the amp, I'll have to check that too. With the quality of everything else when it was restored (paint, wheels, interior, etc), I want to say it was done properly. __________________________________________________ Life's better on the Mountain.

January 21st, 2014, 05:25 PM	#11
alex.s wat Name: wat Location: tustin/long beach Join Date: Sep 2009 Motorcycle(s): wat Posts: Too much. Blog Entries: 5 MOTM - Oct '12, Feb '14	you're going to burn out your alternator if you don't put a cap between it and that amp. don't bother running woofers off the deck. its a waste of time, run an amp for the woofers and an amp for the sub. if you have separate tweeters they are fine off the deck. be sure you are using hipass and lowpass filters on the separate amps so you don't have distortion from trying to jam too much sound into all your speakers... it sounds best if you can separate each frequency range into the appropriate driver... low to sub, mids to woofers, high to tweeters... also the difference between two voice coils in series vs parallel (the difference between 2 ohm and 4 ohm) is pretty huge so make sure its right for your amp setup __________________________________________________

January 21st, 2014, 05:29 PM	#12
TnNinjaGirl Ms. Personality Name: CB Location: Murvill, TN Join Date: Jan 2009 Motorcycle(s): Depends on the week you ask Posts: A lot.	@Mountain Dew can you take a quality audio clip so we can hear what's going on?

January 21st, 2014, 06:53 PM	#13
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Do you hear a sort of clicking sound from the sub? __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School

February 16th, 2014, 01:56 AM	#14
Mountain Dew Ambrosia. Name: Jaymie Location: Oahu, Hawaii Join Date: Aug 2011 Motorcycle(s): 1974 Honda CB550K0 W.I.P. Posts: A lot.	Link to original page on YouTube. __________________________________________________ Life's better on the Mountain.

Similar Threads
Thread	Thread Starter	Forum	Replies	Last Post
Advice Needed About Getting Back Into Riding.	Brad Turner	General Motorcycling Discussion	25	February 6th, 2013 08:42 PM
Predicament: Advice Needed.	Mako	General Motorcycling Discussion	34	May 6th, 2011 08:39 AM
Car audio peeps	Apex	Off-Topic	11	April 7th, 2011 09:48 AM
Audio equipment for your car- GPS nav and more!	CThunder-blue	Miscellaneous	1	April 6th, 2011 10:10 AM
Some Cornering Advice Needed	patw	Videos	3	April 16th, 2010 08:20 AM