Exhaust cracked at weld

cbinker · January 14th, 2017, 06:54 PM

should I just re-weld it? its my race bike? Its the area p exhaust i got this past summer, i did crash on the right side, but not sure if the crack is because of the crash, as you can see where the crack is.

csmith12 · January 14th, 2017, 07:34 PM

@kbryant

I would guess you are the best to answer this question.

Motofool · January 14th, 2017, 07:54 PM

I would remove it from the bike and take it to a welding shop that has TIG equipment and a skilful operator.
Tungsten inert gas (TIG) welding, is a manual welding process that is especially useful for welding thin materials.
If you try any welding on the bike, disconnect the battery previously.

It could be from the crash or from fatigue of the material, if the set up allows cycling bending stress on that welding.

https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(material)

JohnnyBravo · January 14th, 2017, 07:56 PM

100

jkv45 · January 14th, 2017, 08:40 PM

I would send Area P the photo and see what they have to say about it. It may be a common issue that they will take care of - or at least want to know about.

I agree with Motofool - remove it and take it to a good welder that is familiar with TIG welding stainless.

britx303 · January 15th, 2017, 06:24 AM

Whoa!bad weld job. Only surface coverage(filler just laying on top of the joint) and no root fusion in order to crack like that. I'd have a word with the manufacture if its only a year old.Ive sommersaulted bikes and bent up exhaust into pretzels and welds never break,the rest of the pipe bends.

NinJim · January 15th, 2017, 07:28 AM

Agreed, ugly weld with NO penetration. Yuk...
That's one to take back to the dealer. If they won't help, try this.

Pull the plastic so a welder can get to it. Take the bike to the weld shop and have it tack welded in several spots. Return home, pull the pipes off and return them to the weld shop. They will re-weld the joint; then reinstall and go.

This is the cheapest way to do it; and you'll learn something new. If you lived close to me, I'd do it for you. Gratis...

Being it's your race bike, get it fixed now. I tech a lot at the Miller Track, and wouldn't pass it for racing, but OK for practice. You don't want to be running around trying to find a welder on the weekend that you paid a lot of money to do something fun.

Now, go get you hands dirty,
Cheers,

PS: If this was your main ride, you could go to the auto-parts store and get some exhaust pipe wrap. It will keep you on the road until a time window opens for a proper repair.

Triple Jim · January 15th, 2017, 07:38 AM

As a manufacturer of motorcycle parts myself, I agree that the folks who made this pipe should have the chance to see what happened. It's great to get positive feedback from customers, but knowing about problems is more important, and if I were the maker, I would repair it free, to thank you for pointing out the problem.

Failing a free repair, I would follow NinJim's advice and not take it off and take it to a welder, because it would be very easy to get it out of position, and even a small error could affect the pipe's fit. I would tack weld it in place, and then remove it to complete the weld.

kbryant · January 15th, 2017, 10:25 AM

Chris - We'll be happy to take a look at it for you and take care of it. Obviously the crash can contribute to it cracking along with many other possibilities. Regardless, we should be able to repair it for you and get you back on the track. I see you e-mailed us as well today. We'll contact you with return information.

arnvc · January 15th, 2017, 10:45 AM

How many more laps have you done after the crash on the right side ? Did you hear the exhaust leak before the h/p went soft ?

cbinker · January 15th, 2017, 11:00 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by arnvc

How many more laps have you done after the crash on the right side ? Did you hear the exhaust leak before the h/p went soft ?

I crash during qualifying round 1. Didn't notice anything till I was changing the oil last night when I had the bike running and I could feel the air coming from the crack. Probably done at least 50 laps since the crash.

jkv45 · January 15th, 2017, 12:26 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by NinJim

Pull the plastic so a welder can get to it. Take the bike to the weld shop and have it tack welded in several spots. Return home, pull the pipes off and return them to the weld shop. They will re-weld the joint; then reinstall and go.

If it would come apart completely, you should do something to make sure it's in the correct position before welding.

I guess I would make some marks on it with a Sharpie to make sure it's not rotated out of position when welded. I think that's all it would take as it would be easy to get it positioned forward/backward by just closing the crack.

cbinker · January 15th, 2017, 08:33 PM

This not an issue from AreaP just so everyone is clear, I bought a pipe from them and installed it myself with a few fabrications, I just need ideas on how to fix it. I'm not familiar with welding and welds. But I have a few friends local where that is their profession and have asked them about it too.

csmith12 · January 16th, 2017, 09:29 AM

Can you post a pic of your complete system as best you can? If your mounting configuration may have factored in the failure, then we all can learn and be on the lookout for it in the future.

britx303 · January 16th, 2017, 10:19 AM

Quote:

Originally Posted by cbinker

This not an issue from AreaP just so everyone is clear, I bought a pipe from them and installed it myself with a few fabrications, I just need ideas on how to fix it. I'm not familiar with welding and welds. But I have a few friends local where that is their profession and have asked them about it too.

Going to be the bad guy here for a moment......as a professional welder,yes this is an issue from the manufacture'.That being said,its good not to hide it so the maker can address the issue properly so he may improve his product from here on out,and as they even said they are going to repair it....correct? ALL manufacture's have failures at some point and must address them.....even the big 4 from japan have had frame weld recalls,etc. **** happens.....dont sugar coat it.Thats how products improve.

cbinker · January 16th, 2017, 04:04 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by csmith12

Can you post a pic of your complete system as best you can? If your mounting configuration may have factored in the failure, then we all can learn and be on the lookout for it in the future.

best on i have right now

NinJim · January 16th, 2017, 07:57 PM

Quote:

Originally Posted by jkv45

If it would come apart completely, you should do something to make sure it's in the correct position before welding.

I guess I would make some marks on it with a Sharpie to make sure it's not rotated out of position when welded. I think that's all it would take as it would be easy to get it positioned forward/backward by just closing the crack.

Hi jkv45,
Thin walled tube, like this exhaust pipe, takes a little prep to keep it aligned so it will fit correctly along its intended path. If you were to remove it, then weld it in a continuous weld using marks like a sharpie, it would not be close to fitting back on the bike. The warping of thin steel is quite pronounced.

All tube assemblies are cut to close tolerances, then held in alignment using robust hold-down jigs. They are then tacked on all sides. The final welding is done using a "stitching" technique, which means you weld for half an inch then go to the other side and do the same.

By tack welding it while on the bike, you are using the most effective jig, the bike itself. Once it's tack welded in four or so spots, it will not lose it alignment as the rest of the weld is completed. If you are interested for more in depth info, go to YouTube and search "welding tube clusters". It's aviation site with good info.

I hope this helps. It takes longer to explain than it does to complete the weld.
Cheers,
NinJim

January 14th, 2017, 06:54 PM	#1
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	Exhaust cracked at weld should I just re-weld it? its my race bike? Its the area p exhaust i got this past summer, i did crash on the right side, but not sure if the crack is because of the crash, as you can see where the crack is. __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com

January 14th, 2017, 07:34 PM	#2
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	@kbryant I would guess you are the best to answer this question. __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School Last futzed with by csmith12; January 15th, 2017 at 09:18 AM.

January 14th, 2017, 07:54 PM	#3
Motofool Daily Ninjette rider Name: Hernan Location: Florida Join Date: Mar 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2007 Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTY - 2016, MOTM - Dec '12, Jan '14, Jan '15, May '16	I would remove it from the bike and take it to a welding shop that has TIG equipment and a skilful operator. Tungsten inert gas (TIG) welding, is a manual welding process that is especially useful for welding thin materials. If you try any welding on the bike, disconnect the battery previously. It could be from the crash or from fatigue of the material, if the set up allows cycling bending stress on that welding. https://en.m.wikipedia.org/wiki/Fatigue_(material) __________________________________________________ *Motofool* *.................................Never ride faster than your guardian angel can fly* "Mankind is composed of two sorts of men — those who love and create, and those who hate and destroy. Love is the bond between men, the way to teach and the center of the world." - José Martí
	2 out of 2 members found this post helpful.

January 14th, 2017, 07:56 PM	#4
JohnnyBravo Certifiable nontundrum Name: Harper Location: NC Milkshake stand Join Date: Mar 2013 Motorcycle(s): 2013 SE NINJA 300 Posts: Too much. MOTM - Sep '13, Sep '16	100 __________________________________________________

January 15th, 2017, 07:28 AM	#7
NinJim ninjette.org member Name: Jim Location: Utah Join Date: Apr 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja250-3x; CBR600 & R6 (track bikes); lots of dirt stuff Posts: 25	Awful weld Agreed, ugly weld with NO penetration. Yuk... That's one to take back to the dealer. If they won't help, try this. Pull the plastic so a welder can get to it. Take the bike to the weld shop and have it tack welded in several spots. Return home, pull the pipes off and return them to the weld shop. They will re-weld the joint; then reinstall and go. This is the cheapest way to do it; and you'll learn something new. If you lived close to me, I'd do it for you. Gratis... Being it's your race bike, get it fixed now. I tech a lot at the Miller Track, and wouldn't pass it for racing, but OK for practice. You don't want to be running around trying to find a welder on the weekend that you paid a lot of money to do something fun. Now, go get you hands dirty, Cheers, PS: If this was your main ride, you could go to the auto-parts store and get some exhaust pipe wrap. It will keep you on the road until a time window opens for a proper repair. Last futzed with by NinJim; January 15th, 2017 at 07:39 AM. Reason: grammar

January 14th, 2017, 08:40 PM	#5
jkv45 Rev Limiter Name: Jay Location: WI Join Date: Jul 2013 Motorcycle(s): '06 SV650n, '00 Derbi GPR, '64 CA77 Dream 305, '70 CL450 Scrambler, numerous dirt bikes Posts: A lot. MOTM - Jun '18, Oct '16	I would send Area P the photo and see what they have to say about it. It may be a common issue that they will take care of - or at least want to know about. I agree with Motofool - remove it and take it to a good welder that is familiar with TIG welding stainless.

January 15th, 2017, 06:24 AM	#6
britx303 ninjette.org member Name: AJK Location: Maryland Join Date: Jul 2015 Motorcycle(s): TOOOOOO MANY!! Posts: 87	Whoa!bad weld job. Only surface coverage(filler just laying on top of the joint) and no root fusion in order to crack like that. I'd have a word with the manufacture if its only a year old.Ive sommersaulted bikes and bent up exhaust into pretzels and welds never break,the rest of the pipe bends.

January 15th, 2017, 07:38 AM	#8
Triple Jim Guy Who Enjoys Riding Name: Jim Location: North Carolina Join Date: Jul 2016 Motorcycle(s): Ninja 250 Posts: A lot. MOTM - Oct '18, Aug '17, Aug '16	As a manufacturer of motorcycle parts myself, I agree that the folks who made this pipe should have the chance to see what happened. It's great to get positive feedback from customers, but knowing about problems is more important, and if I were the maker, I would repair it free, to thank you for pointing out the problem. Failing a free repair, I would follow NinJim's advice and not take it off and take it to a welder, because it would be very easy to get it out of position, and even a small error could affect the pipe's fit. I would tack weld it in place, and then remove it to complete the weld. Last futzed with by Triple Jim; January 15th, 2017 at 12:40 PM.

January 15th, 2017, 10:25 AM	#9
kbryant Area P Name: Kerry Location: SoCal & South Florida Join Date: Dec 2008 Motorcycle(s): Too many to list Posts: 439	Chris - We'll be happy to take a look at it for you and take care of it. Obviously the crash can contribute to it cracking along with many other possibilities. Regardless, we should be able to repair it for you and get you back on the track. I see you e-mailed us as well today. We'll contact you with return information.
	3 out of 3 members found this post helpful.

January 15th, 2017, 10:45 AM	#10
arnvc ninjette.org member Name: ar Location: esco Join Date: Apr 2016 Motorcycle(s): ex250 Posts: 77	How many more laps have you done after the crash on the right side ? Did you hear the exhaust leak before the h/p went soft ?

January 15th, 2017, 08:33 PM	#13
cbinker Track Clown Name: Chris Location: Kingman, AZ Join Date: May 2012 Motorcycle(s): '08 250R, 21 MV F3 800, Kawasaki 400 build Posts: A lot. MOTM - Sep '15	This not an issue from AreaP just so everyone is clear, I bought a pipe from them and installed it myself with a few fabrications, I just need ideas on how to fix it. I'm not familiar with welding and welds. But I have a few friends local where that is their profession and have asked them about it too. __________________________________________________ TEAM ALFALFA www.apexassassins.com
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

January 16th, 2017, 09:29 AM	#14
csmith12 The Corner Whisperer Name: Chris (aka Reactor) Location: Northern KY Join Date: May 2011 Motorcycle(s): 2010 250 (track), 1992 250, 2006 R6 (street/track), 2008 R6 (track) Posts: Too much. MOTY 2015, MOTM - Nov '12, Nov '13	Can you post a pic of your complete system as best you can? If your mounting configuration may have factored in the failure, then we all can learn and be on the lookout for it in the future. __________________________________________________ Goal: Shake A Million Hands \| Look through the corners \| Track Day Prep \| Closest track? \| The Mid-Ohio School
	1 out of 1 members found this post helpful.

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