Oil Change

[mcwidave]

I'm getting all my supplies ready to perform an oil change and have a question that I hope someone has had some experience with. It's regarding an oil filter I am looking at buying and I can't find a clear answer to it anywhere on the old "Google Machine". I found the Fram CH6012 oil filter at my local wally world and it's supposed to be compatible with my 06 ninjette. So, here's the question: the Fram oil filter clearly states it comes with both of the "O rings" but does it include the crush washer??? And if it doesn't is that a part I will need to go to a dealer for?

Thanks in advance!!!!

[adouglas]

I'm pretty sure the answer to the first is no, and the answer to the second is definitely no.

You can get crush washers at an auto parts store or Cycle Gear.

Do yourself a favor... order a bunch off of Amazon or eBay. Cheaper that way and you'll be set for life.

It is not a crime to re-use a crush washer. Your bike won't explode or hemorrhage oil. I wouldn't do it more than once or make a habit of it, though.

[mcwidave]

Awesome! Thank you for the quick response! Sorry if this was a dumb question I am pretty inexperienced in all of this.

[sh123469]

The 6012 does not have the crush washer but does have both O rings.

I just changed my oil this weekend and used one of those.

[Ghostt]

FYI the crush washer is 12mm very common at any parts store.

It's a good move to buy in bulk, so order some, along with the filters.

Personally I went with a Flo Stainless Steel Reusable Oil Filter

[mcwidave]

@Ghostt is the flo stainless steel filter available in auto parts stores or cycle gear? Or is it an order online thing? I'm assuming that pic contains everything in the box?

[mcwidave]

@sh123469 thank you! That's exactly what I was looking for, somebody who has personally used that specific filter!

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

@Ghostt is the flo stainless steel filter available in auto parts stores or cycle gear? Or is it an order online thing? I'm assuming that pic contains everything in the box?

It comes with everything in the picture I posted. As far as where to get it, I seriously doubt that the auto parts carries them. I got mine off eBay, but I'm sure if you do a search online you'll find it



Some examples,

https://m.denniskirk.com/307362.sku?..._3VBoCdFzw_wcB

http://www.ebay.com/itm/181661598423

[mcwidave]

Cool, I'll make sure to try that model next.

[FrugalNinja250]

I'm at 82K miles and am on my second crush washer. The only reason I'm on my second one is that I had to swap the motor at 55K and it came with another crush washer.

[Proteus]

I've reused crush washers several times over the years on bikes and cars, @adouglas said it best.

[mcwidave]

@FrugalNinja250 and @Proteus Thank you for the reassurance. I just got my bike about a month ago, it has 16.5K miles on it. Obviously buying used means you have no idea how the previous owner cared for it but so far everything appears to be in decent shape. However, I couldn't find an answer anywhere on if it was frowned upon to reuse the crush washer. Now I can go ahead and do my oil change without stressing!

[mcwidave]

Update on the oil change: I got it all done and cleaned and replaced everything. I went through the process of filling with new oil slowly, starting the bike, letting it idle for a min, shutting it off and checking/refilling with oil until I got an accurate reading (which I left just below the upper mark on the window). After riding it into work this morning the oil level in the sight glass is showing higher than last night when I finished filling it. Is this normal with an oil change? Or should I be checking for anything?

[jkv45]

I would expect it to be slightly higher because it's hotter after reaching operating temp than when you tested it last time after brief idling.

It should be checked after turning the engine off and waiting 3 minutes for the oil to drain down from the top end and passages. If you wait longer it might be higher - lower if you check it immediately. Hotter oil will drain down faster also.

[mcwidave]

I figured it would be something like that. I just wanted to make sure because I check the oil every time before I get on the bike. This morning before I left for work, it was at the same spot as last night, but then when I got to work it was higher. So basically it's due to the oil being hot and flowing quicker?

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

I figured it would be something like that. I just wanted to make sure because I check the oil every time before I get on the bike. This morning before I left for work, it was at the same spot as last night, but then when I got to work it was higher. So basically it's due to the oil being hot and flowing quicker?

Yup, unless your head gasket, or float needle valve are shot , but you'd noticed that pretty quick.

[mcwidave]

@Ghostt I did have that issue a while back that I wrote about on ninja250 where I had a strong gas smell in my garage. I thought I checked the petcock and everything pretty thoroughly then. The oil didn't smell like gas in the crankcase or in the oil pan that I drained the old stuff in. Is there a possibility that I have a shot float needle and being inexperienced I'm missing it? Is there a clear way to check for it other than what I've already done?

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

@Ghostt I did have that issue a while back that I wrote about on ninja250 where I had a strong gas smell in my garage. I thought I checked the petcock and everything pretty thoroughly then. The oil didn't smell like gas in the crankcase or in the oil pan that I drained the old stuff in. Is there a possibility that I have a shot float needle and being inexperienced I'm missing it? Is there a clear way to check for it other than what I've already done?

It could be, hard to say without inspecting the carburetors, which have some consumable parts, but assuming they've never been replaced, and given the age of the bike, I would recommend having them refurbished thru @ducatiman https://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=226815

Also if your in doubt about the petcock, I'd just get a new one, also given the age as well.

Your petcock is shot, save your time, and money and get a new one, the cost of rebuilding it isn't much cheaper, due to you need two separate kits, as they for some reason don't make just one.

New one cost about $65.00

http://www.partzilla.com/parts/detai...1023-1139.html

Also be sure to order the orings(92022-183 WASHER,6.2X11X1.5)and new bolts(92001-1091BOLT,6X20),trust me you'll be better off in the long run.

Rebuilding kits are about $60 total.

K&L Supply Diaphragm Only for Fuel Petcock Repair Kit 18-6638 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B0055DWO60..._s1CGub1W9N3PH

K&L Supply Fuel Petcock Repair Kit 18-2723 https://www.amazon.com/dp/B001KO2JRW..._U1CGub05DT5NT

IMHO not worth it rebuilding, also be sure to check vacuum and fuel lines for wear, holes, and cracks, if in doubt replace them. Also replace the two small O-rings on the bolts for the Petcock part# 92022.

Also have you installed a fuel filter?

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

I figured it would be something like that. I just wanted to make sure because I check the oil every time before I get on the bike. This morning before I left for work, it was at the same spot as last night, but then when I got to work it was higher. So basically it's due to the oil being hot and flowing quicker?

I assume oil will expand somewhat when hot, so the level will be higher when hot even if you have given it adequate time to drain down hot or cold. It's possible more oil will drain down in the same amount of time when it's hotter.

Just make sure it's not over the full mark when you check it fully hot (and after sitting for 3 min) and you are fine.

Most Ninja 250s will use some oil when running higher RPMs (and that's most of the time), so check it often.

[mcwidave]

I have not done the fuel filter. The last known maintenance on the bike before everything I've done was April '14. That was when the prev owner did the 15K service. It's now at 16,700. I may just play it safe and have it refurbed. IF there was gas getting into the oil, wouldn't that create a pretty big problem pretty quickly?

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

I have not done the fuel filter. The last known maintenance on the bike before everything I've done was April '14. That was when the prev owner did the 15K service. It's now at 16,700. I may just play it safe and have it refurbed. IF there was gas getting into the oil, wouldn't that create a pretty big problem pretty quickly?

I would advise you install a fuel filter, and buy a few extra.

I seriously doubt that when they did the service they refurbished the carburetors. The float needles have a small viton/rubber tips. As the picture below shows the difference between old Vs new. This is a picture of mine, which lead to this posting "How to clean the crankcase, and airbox without disassembling"

Gas and oil don't mix well for engine lubrication, also consider replacing the petcock, it does have a rubber diaphragm, which after time needs/should be replaced, along with O-rings etc.....

If your planning to keep the Ninjette for awhile, all this I would say preventive maintenance.

[mcwidave]

Thank you for all the great info! I contacted ducatiman and I am most likely going to have him service my carb. I guess while I wait on that I can perform all this other stuff since the bike will be out of commission.

I'm not planning on keeping THIS bike very long, I am 95% sure I will be getting a '14 or '15 ninja 300 within the next 6 months. So, if I may ask, in your opinion is this all worth it or do I just let her live out her last few months?

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

Thank you for all the great info! I contacted ducatiman and I am most likely going to have him service my carb. I guess while I wait on that I can perform all this other stuff since the bike will be out of commission.

I'm not planning on keeping THIS bike very long, I am 95% sure I will be getting a '14 or '15 ninja 300 within the next 6 months. So, if I may ask, in your opinion is this all worth it or do I just let her live out her last few months?

I'm afraid I can't answer that one, I keep things forever, and if I may ask why move to the 300? Why not something bigger like a Used or new 600? Maybe a litre bike?

The 250 is an extremely good bike, and with a few inexpensive modifications it handles, and runs very good, and the best part is parts are dirt cheap.

[mcwidave]

I would like to get a 600, but I'm a smaller guy (5'7" 135lbs) and I absolutely love the displacement and weight of the 250/300. The handling and everything is perfect for me. My ultimate plan was to get a newer 300 in a few months, spend a few years on it, then move to a 600 or litre.

Who knows, maybe I'll keep this one (her name is Rizelda) as a project and to keep things fresh and one day hand it down to the first born.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

I would like to get a 600, but I'm a smaller guy (5'7" 135lbs) and I absolutely love the displacement and weight of the 250/300. The handling and everything is perfect for me. My ultimate plan was to get a newer 300 in a few months, spend a few years on it, then move to a 600 or litre.

Who knows, maybe I'll keep this one (her name is Rizelda) as a project and to keep things fresh and one day hand it down to the first born.

Once again why 300? Is it for the styling? Etc... Or you just want it? And keep in mind the costs involved. Personally I'd keep the 250, til your ready to move up the bigger bore bikes.

[mcwidave]

Yeah, I'm partial to the newer style. Plus the little extra power, ABS and fuel injection. But beyond that I think it's the peace of mind. This 250 has 16K miles of unaccounted for use and maintenance. With a brand new bike I can start from scratch and if something goes wrong it's on me you know? I was originally going to buy a new 300 but saw this one on CL and got it for a sweet deal so I thought I would give it a shot.
The main reason I would take a 300 over a 600 6 months from now is just the difference in price.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

Yeah, I'm partial to the newer style. Plus the little extra power, ABS and fuel injection. But beyond that I think it's the peace of mind. This 250 has 16K miles of unaccounted for use and maintenance. With a brand new bike I can start from scratch and if something goes wrong it's on me you know? I was originally going to buy a new 300 but saw this one on CL and got it for a sweet deal so I thought I would give it a shot.
The main reason I would take a 300 over a 600 6 months from now is just the difference in price.

Okay those are excellent reason, no one can argue those points.

Well to get back to your question, is it worth doing work to? As far as the bike's reliability goes I'd say yes, personally if I don't/can't trust a vehicle, then I either fix it, or sell it.


Come sale time, it makes a nice selling point, but adds little or nothing to the resale value.

[jkv45]

Don't be in any hurry to "step-up". I think the 300 would be a good move for you, but give yourself some time on the 250 first. A 600 SS is a HUGE step up, not only in outright performance, but weight and insurance as well. Bigger isn't always better, and a 600 SS is a much different ride than what you are familiar with.

I've been riding for over 35 years, and have yet to want a liter bike. I've had a 750 SS, but prefer a more streetable (not as racer-ish) bike like the 250 or my SV650. The SV feels a bit on the heavy side after coming off of a 250. The power (torque) of the 650 is nice, but I rarely call on max power, and probably would be happy with a Ninja 300 myself.

A riding buddy (also with over 30 years of experience) of mine just sold a newer Triumph Daytona 675 and bought a KTM RC390. He's got less than 1/2 the power he had before, but is much happier with the smaller/lighter KTM.

[mcwidave]

Good point. I suppose I will want someone to be able to enjoy it after me.

I'll send the carbs off to ducatiman, and while I wait on those I'll replace the petcock and fuel pump. If I understood your advice correctly, that should cover all the bases as far as the gas getting in the oil right?

[mcwidave]

@jkv45 that is exactly what I feared about getting a 600 so soon. I'm used to riding HD's but always wanted a Ninja. I never made the switch because I feared the differences in style and having all the available power of a 600/litre bike. Then I found out about the 250/300, I don't think I'll move past a 300 for quite some time. I have had my 250 for about a month and not once have I used all the power. Plus, there have already been 3 occasions that if I had a 600 underneath me I would have at least some bumps and bruises. The forgiveness that these bikes have is absolutely incredible.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

Good point. I suppose I will want someone to be able to enjoy it after me.

I'll send the carbs off to ducatiman, and while I wait on those I'll replace the petcock and fuel pump. If I understood your advice correctly, that should cover all the bases as far as the gas getting in the oil right?

Yes, and install a fuel filter as well, also no fuel pump, the Ninjette uses the oldest method, called gravity feed.

[mcwidave]

LOL. My bad, I meant fuel filter. I have a feeling I may be searching forever trying to locate the fuel pump.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

LOL. My bad, I meant fuel filter. I have a feeling I may be searching forever trying to locate the fuel pump.

LOL, you'd be correct. Is there already a fuel filter on the bike?

[mcwidave]

I'm not sure actually.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

I'm not sure actually.

It's easy enough to spot, it's an inline the fuel line between the tank and the carburetors.

[mcwidave]

No fuel filter on this bike. I will definitely have to look into adding one.

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

No fuel filter on this bike. I will definitely have to look into adding one.

Definitely, motorcycle shop should have them.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by mcwidave

@jkv45 that is exactly what I feared about getting a 600 so soon. I'm used to riding HD's but always wanted a Ninja. I never made the switch because I feared the differences in style and having all the available power of a 600/litre bike. Then I found out about the 250/300, I don't think I'll move past a 300 for quite some time. I have had my 250 for about a month and not once have I used all the power. Plus, there have already been 3 occasions that if I had a 600 underneath me I would have at least some bumps and bruises. The forgiveness that these bikes have is absolutely incredible.

That's a great way to put it - you hit the nail on the head. That's a huge plus factor, especially for a new or newer rider.

The minute you move up to a bigger/heavier/more powerful cycle you quickly give some of that away.

My son has been riding cycles since he was 4, and I still insisted he start street riding on a 250 - that was 3 years ago. He is still riding his original 250, and bought another as a project because he likes the light weight, quick handling, and high revving engine - so not everyone "outgrows" their 250.

I'm getting some flack right now on another forum for suggesting the SV650 isn't the great starter bike everyone thinks it is, and suggesting that starting on a 250 is a much better idea.