Ram air is here for the ninjette

[overload]

Hi guys just thought y'all might wanna check this out ...
http://www.kawiforums.com/ninja-250r...ail-250rs.html

for the members that dont belong to kawiforums i took the liberty of grabbing the essence outta that article

the guy looks a bit dodgey though but i guess he got it right

[HKr1]

Sounds like they ripped someone off for 300 bucks.

[Sailariel]

Looks pretty sleazy to me. That Kawi Forum reads like a C Novel---sure gives one an appreciation of the hard work Alex does----and the self policing by members of this forum. My blood pressure would be sky high if I had to contend with that for any length of time.

[Alex]

What a load of crap. Ram air, done well, adds 1 - 2% at the top speeds of supersport bikes (150 mph+). An aftermarket kludge on a carbed bike that barely nudges 100 mph isn't going to get close to that 1 - 2%. A rider would get more performance benefit by taking a solid #2 before heading out on the bike.

[bob706]

Ram air for the ninjette. Cool. Wonder why no one thought of that before. Kawiforum seems as useful as ram air

[mike_sema]

just in case someone falls for this DON'T even thought it is worthless and will not do a dame thing you will probably never get it if you do order it this guy or company will rip you off search the other boards and you will see what I mean. Do any of you remember the GP style exhaust he was trying to sell with no pics and he wanted the money up front that went no ware fast he never even sold any that I know of .I tried on countless times to get a hold of him and meet up so I could see the exhaust but I don’t think that he or they ever had one in the 1st place

[Sailariel]

Originally Posted by bob706

Ram air for the ninjette. Cool. Wonder why no one thought of that before. Kawiforum seems as useful as ram air

Actually, I was thinking more like a screen door in a submarine.

[Cedilla]

I watched that thread go downhill a few days ago, that guy completely destroyed any kind of rep he had in that one thread.

[Angel-be-Good]

Originally Posted by Alex

What a load of crap. Ram air, done well, adds 1 - 2% at the top speeds of supersport bikes (150 mph+). An aftermarket kludge on a carbed bike that barely nudges 100 mph isn't going to get close to that 1 - 2%. A rider would get more performance benefit by taking a solid #2 before heading out on the bike.

What if you've already gone #2 for the day?

[Banzai]

Originally Posted by Angel-be-Good

What if you've already gone #2 for the day?

Then you'd probably already have a pretty good indication of how much this ram air would be worth!

[overload]

Originally Posted by Cedilla

I watched that thread go downhill a few days ago, that guy completely destroyed any kind of rep he had in that one thread.

Pathetic really

But i do have one question ... when its raining and you are riding a zx6-r is it good for the bike to ride it cuz of the ram air in rainy conditions ?

[ztrack157]

The air would still need to pass through the filter. So not sure how much liquid would actually get through. that said don't aim a water hose down the ram intake.

[Verus Cidere]

To whoever thinks this mod is useful or worth the money:

[Verus Cidere]

And a few more:

[Racer x]

Ram air is not just a hose hooked to the carb. It is a hose that hooks to an air box. The hose has a way to let water out. But it also has spescal shapes as dose the air box.

These shapes hold a certain volume of air and at speed pressure is created inside the air box to meet the exact resonance of the engine . Honda spent millions of dollars developing there system.

I guess they should have just bought a vacuum cleaner hose from this guy.

[overload]

Originally Posted by Racer x

Ram air is not just a hose hooked to the carb. It is a hose that hooks to an air box. The hose has a way to let water out. But it also has spescal shapes as dose the air box.

These shapes hold a certain volume of air and at speed pressure is created inside the air box to meet the exact resonance of the engine . Honda spent millions of dollars developing there system.

I guess they should have just bought a vacuum cleaner hose from this guy.

lol ... well i just read on wikipedia.org that there are new superchargers coming out ... ELECTRIC superchargers that run off your battery ... what you guys think ?

[CRXTrek]

Motowerx is a Joke :thumbdown:

[Greg_E]

Ram air on a carb is not very easy. you need to pressurize the fuel tank, around the outside of the carb, as well as the air going down the throat. FI is easier since you only need to monitor the pressure in the throat unless you are using multiple throttle bodies and then I have no real idea what they are doing.


As far as electric superchargers, I have a feeling that it takes a much larger motor than most people expect. Maybe for very small pumps, but I don't think it is feasible on even something as small as the 250cc engines. You would be better off bolting a pulley to the cam drive and let the engine spin the pump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I haven't seen a reliable electric supercharger yet so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, would love to get one for several different projects starting with my Buell.

[rockNroll]

I have an old shop vac with larger diameter convoluted hose... I'd get more air in thair

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by overload

lol ... well i just read on wikipedia.org that there are new superchargers coming out ... ELECTRIC superchargers that run off your battery ... what you guys think ?

I think that TANSTAAFL.

There Ain't No Such Thing As A Free Lunch.

[Snake]

Originally Posted by Alex

What a load of crap. Ram air, done well, adds 1 - 2% at the top speeds of supersport bikes (150 mph+). An aftermarket kludge on a carbed bike that barely nudges 100 mph isn't going to get close to that 1 - 2%. A rider would get more performance benefit by taking a solid #2 before heading out on the bike.

[overload]

Originally Posted by Greg_E

Ram air on a carb is not very easy. you need to pressurize the fuel tank, around the outside of the carb, as well as the air going down the throat. FI is easier since you only need to monitor the pressure in the throat unless you are using multiple throttle bodies and then I have no real idea what they are doing.


As far as electric superchargers, I have a feeling that it takes a much larger motor than most people expect. Maybe for very small pumps, but I don't think it is feasible on even something as small as the 250cc engines. You would be better off bolting a pulley to the cam drive and let the engine spin the pump. Maybe I'm wrong, but I haven't seen a reliable electric supercharger yet so feel free to correct me if I'm wrong, would love to get one for several different projects starting with my Buell.

ah man you totally dashed my hopes lol jk but seriously i know turbocharging or supercharging a ninjette just isnt economically feasible but man i just want to see someone do it just for the heck of it ... andto break that damn 40HP at the rear wheel .;.

[Greg_E]

Here is a good read on the subject, seems to be well laid out without too much math involved:

http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9508_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9910_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9912_ram/index.html

Note the CBR600F4 and ZX-6R comments in the second part of the article about the carbs.

I still think that a pregen with no headlight would make a nice intake scoop if done properly. Not sure how I would deal with the 08/09 scoops.

[ztrack157]

Greg the sportisi work has a front scoop in it but i still wouldn't think of doing a ram intake. Heres a pic although the scoop is not as big as it looks in the pic.

[Greg_E]

For RacerX and his top speed quest, any little bit might be worth doing. If it got him 1mph faster that seems to be a big deal since he said in another thread that it was down to hundreths of a mph to decide the winner. The Sportisi could be modified to have a nice duct and it certainly is right in the middle of where the high pressure air happens.

I wonder if you could hook up a vacuum/boost gauge to the carb sync line to see what the pressure in the intake is at full throttle? Might have to attach it farther down stream to get a good idea.

If going with carbs I wonder how you would balance the pressure between the intake and the fuel bowl with the little tube. If it was easy then getting the carbs from one of those old bikes might be an easy method to accomplishing this task. I still say EFI is the way to go here, let the computer do the work for you.

[overload]

Originally Posted by Greg_E

Here is a good read on the subject, seems to be well laid out without too much math involved:

http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9508_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9910_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9912_ram/index.html

Note the CBR600F4 and ZX-6R comments in the second part of the article about the carbs.

I still think that a pregen with no headlight would make a nice intake scoop if done properly. Not sure how I would deal with the 08/09 scoops.

Thanks definitely made for some good reading Well it might only be a limit of .27 milibar but .4 psi is pretty good on most smaller turbos man after my ninjette i'mtotally going for a zx6-r

[Greg_E]

Consider that they also measured a negative amount of pressure without the ram air, so the net result is a lot higher. I have a feeling that it is up to the volume of the scoop as well as the pressure of the air that helps determine the final amount of boost. With a net of 50millibar you get about .73 psi and I'm sure the intakes are compromised because of the headlights.

[stealth250]

Originally Posted by Alex

A rider would get more performance benefit by taking a solid #2 before heading out on the bike.

[Racer x]

Originally Posted by Greg_E

Here is a good read on the subject, seems to be well laid out without too much math involved:

http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9508_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9910_ram/index.html
http://www.sportrider.com/tech/146_9912_ram/index.html

Note the CBR600F4 and ZX-6R comments in the second part of the article about the carbs.

I still think that a pregen with no headlight would make a nice intake scoop if done properly. Not sure how I would deal with the 08/09 scoops.

Read what they are using for an air mover to test on the dyno. The compressor they are using has enough air volume to operate a jack hammer.
.

[Greg_E]

That may be but also remember that they are using airbox pressure as the control. Pressure was measured running on a track and then they feed in the air to match what they found on the track. Without a wind tunnel it is the best they could do. It would be neat to stick some ram air bikes in a wind tunnel and see if things really did work the same way.

[welcome2thedawn]

i accually read that whole thread...man...that's better than a reality tv show...i kept thinking someone would try to put an end to it...but no...they just kept attacking each other for nine pages...the best is when someone acts like they didn't just step into the war zone and tries to ask a question about the ram air's dyno numbers....wow

[overload]

Originally Posted by welcome2thedawn

i accually read that whole thread...man...that's better than a reality tv show...i kept thinking someone would try to put an end to it...but no...they just kept attacking each other for nine pages...the best is when someone acts like they didn't just step into the war zone and tries to ask a question about the ram air's dyno numbers....wow

+1

[Rayme]

I was thinking of putting an old zx-6/zzr600 air intake on the ninjette...for looks, as I dont know how the hell I could route the air to the carbs

[TrueFaith]

Why would you even bother doing this when you could have pulled the airbox and improved the air flow months ago? People have been doing that since the new-gen '08s first arrived. Any HP improvement you see from this is probably in the single digits...and the really low ones at that.

[headshrink]

Originally Posted by Sailariel

Actually, I was thinking more like a screen door in a submarine.

Or an airbag on a motorcycle.... oh wait, Goldwing. I hear Honda is actually putting screen doors on submarines next year - I wonder if they will sell any more with that new innovative "feature."

[NorCal_250R]

This will screw up the entire setup on the carb. As the pressure goes up you need to have the same pressure increase to the main jet or it won't matter, it will just lean out the mixture and eventually goes some major motor damage...

[greg737]

A rider would get more performance benefit by taking a solid #2 before heading out on the bike.

I've heard that a really good 3-coil steamer will get you 5% on the top end.

[bob706]

Originally Posted by greg737

I've heard that a really good 3-coil steamer will get you 5% on the top end.

[KJohnson21]

I thumbed through most of the KF thread.

Comical.

[sixer]

Rotflmao!