February 1st, 2013, 05:04 AM | #1 |
ninjette.org newbie
Name: Richard
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Took off fuel tank and petcock is dripping gas...
Hi I had some help yesterday taking off the fuel tank to clean my carbs after the bike was sitting for a few months. I noticed after removing the hoses for the fuel and vacuum line that gas has been leaking out of the vacuum line (like maybe one drop every 15 seconds). Is this normal after removing the fuel tank? It was sitting on the drive way and the only reason I noticed was because there was a small puddle forming under the tank.
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February 1st, 2013, 05:22 AM | #2 |
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You must replace or repair the petcock. I would strongly suggest a new one. If you leane it gas can seep past the carb while the bike is parked. This leads to thin oil and bearing /engine failure. You will not know what happen. This is a lucky find.
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February 1st, 2013, 05:51 AM | #3 |
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Same thing happened to me. You can get parts to rebuild it or buy a new one.
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February 1st, 2013, 06:12 AM | #4 |
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Is this a common problem?
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February 1st, 2013, 09:14 AM | #5 |
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Common, I wouldn't say it's so much a common thing. When you took off the tank, did you set it down on the petcock? Could it have been damaged in any way while it was off the bike?
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February 1st, 2013, 09:35 AM | #6 |
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i wouldn't say it common but, a 5 year old vacuum operated part with rubber internals is bound to wear out sooner or later.
eta: i recommend replacing it with a new one
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February 1st, 2013, 10:38 AM | #7 |
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February 1st, 2013, 12:06 PM | #8 |
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Thanks y'all, the gas is actually dripping out of the gas line not the vacuum line, would I still need to replace? If the floats are valved wouldn't that prevent the carbs from over leaking to the engine? I don't think I damaged it but I did turn the metal L thing that the rubber hose attaches to thinking that was the on and prime switch... Would that damage the petcock?
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February 1st, 2013, 12:27 PM | #9 |
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Oh my gosh... We are terrible.
Welcome Richard, start an intro thread in the new members section. Hope you get your leak fixed. That video looks promising.
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February 1st, 2013, 12:34 PM | #10 |
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Yeah that video looks like its for a standard not a vacuum prime and on only petcock, thanks tho slick415!
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February 1st, 2013, 12:43 PM | #11 |
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Yes. A lot of us have leaky EX250J petcocks.
Except that it is. If you search, you'll see. Not everyone investigates why, but there is a common defect inside the petcock with a plastic-like ring (Teflon?) that is not a complete ring for the petcock to seal against. Mine leaks too and my oil smells like gas and my cam chain rattles (probably way out of spec), so racer x's warning is particularly relevant. Edit: Here's why. |
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February 1st, 2013, 12:52 PM | #12 |
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I guess common is "relative". I have had 10+ bikes in my life, some old and some new and still have never had to rebuild a petcock. Am I lucky?
It's a seal, it will fail at some point like many other seals on the bike. It's common to change the oil, it's not common to rebuild the petcock but it is "expected" at the end of it's lifespan.
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February 1st, 2013, 12:55 PM | #13 |
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I bet I just jinxed myself. I bet I will have to rebuild a petcock this year. lol
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February 1st, 2013, 01:04 PM | #14 | |
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Quote:
Also, instead of "leaky petcock" threads, you see "exploded cam chain!" threads. It's a LOT more common than you'd think. |
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February 1st, 2013, 01:06 PM | #15 |
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fair enough.
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February 1st, 2013, 01:08 PM | #16 |
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Also, I edited this in above so you might have missed it:
http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=44054 It's not always a simple case of "seals fail." There's a genuine defect that we should all be aware of. |
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February 1st, 2013, 02:26 PM | #17 |
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February 1st, 2013, 04:16 PM | #18 |
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You don't want to rely in the carb needle as a seal. You will not notice the little bit of gas seeping into the oil.
I have seen this a lot . The flat aluminum part that turns gets pitted.
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February 1st, 2013, 04:34 PM | #19 |
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February 1st, 2013, 09:43 PM | #20 |
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I'm pretty sure it's dead enough.
Parts need replacing. Things need adjusted. Things break. It's part of owning a vehicle. For $60, you can get a brand new petcock that works perfectly and never have to worry about it again. Just replace it and consider it a rite of passage. |
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February 2nd, 2013, 01:07 AM | #21 | |
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Quote:
If it's the petcock problem we were warning him about then it's not something that broke and then needed replacing, as you suggest. See? It's something that never worked and caused serious and expensive seemingly-unrelated collateral damage to the rest of the engine for me and other unsuspecting newgen users. It's also something that people would overlook as the cause of their engine trouble and specifically choose to do nothing about, assuming they ever even knew about the leak. Note racer x's quote above: "you will not know what happen[ed]." The only way some people can know is if we talk about it. I know I would have appreciated the warning. Even once I knew about the leak, I made no connection with my gassy-smelling oil because: A) I didn't know oil wasn't supposed to smell like that (both are petroleum products), B) it happened very fast after each oil change, C) no one I inquired with about the smell warned me, and D) I had no idea how gas flowing from where it was meant to flow would get in my oil. I didn't know what was up until my cam chain started making a horrible racket. |
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February 2nd, 2013, 09:41 AM | #22 | |
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CZroe, so far Andrew is the only person I've seen who had a bad petcock, and you're the only one who's taken up the cause and run with it, blowing it up out of proportion. Whenever you are in the business of producing 100's of thousands of parts, there's going to be x percentage that aren't quite perfect. If we've only seen 2 cases of bad petcocks, I'd say that's pretty good. |
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February 2nd, 2013, 10:01 AM | #23 | |
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However, the internet makes every small problem big. While in most cases there is nothing to worry about, the information is nice for the few who experience the issue. Fyi I replaced my cam chain as a preventative measure. |
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February 4th, 2013, 08:42 AM | #24 | ||||
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MINE was bad. #4. Do a search and you'll see a TON of J/K bikes with bad petcocks.
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If you only mean bad petcocks like Andrew's, well, that's because absolutely no one else took theirs apart and took pictures. I mean, if we aren't publishing a meticulously researched and peer-reviewed study, why bother when he already showed us why they leak? The chances that the only person to take his apart happened to have a defect that none of the others with year-old leaky petcocks have are pretty slim, and when you consider just how many don't even know theirs leaks, the numbers simply must be high enough to be better explained by a common defect. http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=99501 http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=82883 http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showp...93&postcount=3 Quote:
http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=113279 http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=120500 You're right though: We should get more proof. We aren't going to get it if we just act like there is no problems and keep telling people to buy replacements without pointing them to this problem. I'm going to take apart my petcock and start asking everyone else with a leaky J/K petcock to do the same. |
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February 4th, 2013, 08:54 AM | #25 |
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Mine is leaky. I was plannin on takin it apart today.
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February 4th, 2013, 09:48 AM | #26 | |
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Lets take a step back and look at this without the sarcasm or capital letters. Say that you somehow discover that every leaky petcock that we know of is due to a flawed design or a bad manufacturing process that leaves imperfections inside the petcock that cause it to malfunction. Now compare the number of bad petcocks you find to the number of bikes on the road. Let's say you find 100 that are leaky because of a flaw inside the petcock. How many millions of Kawasaki Ninja 250R's are there on the road? I bet that small percentage of allegedly flawed petcocks falls right into Kawasaki's tolerances for faulty parts. I guess I'm just not sure what you're trying to accomplish by proving that Kawasaki has a part with a possibility of leaking. Petcocks (on all bikes) are known to leak sometimes. It's not realistic to expect every single part on a vehicle to be perfect for the lifetime of the vehicle. Are you trying to get a recall from Kawasaki? Are you trying to sue Kawasaki for selling flawed parts to the public? What is the point of trying to prove that there's a flaw? I'm not sure what you're going for with this whole thing. That's why I told you to stop beating a dead horse. |
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February 4th, 2013, 10:35 AM | #27 | |||||
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Similarly, we can't ignore the realities of leaky petcocks. Most owners will have no idea because most owners don't ever try to drain a carb. Quote:
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Even if I felt the same way you do, I'd ask the OP to take his apart and show us instead of prematurely calling the horse "dead." How can it be dead if only one member ever looked inside and so many had leaky petcocks in barely over a year (IOW, barely outside of warranty)? @Navigon: Will you take yours apart after replacing it and tell us if you find something similar to Andrew? |
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February 4th, 2013, 02:04 PM | #28 | |
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Anyhow, have fun. I don't think this is as widespread as the xbox overheating issue, but if you think it is, go for it. |
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February 4th, 2013, 04:45 PM | #29 | ||
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Quote:
Eventually racer x and others on these forums began warning people with stuck float valves and leaky petcocks of the risk of gas getting past the piston rings and into the engine oil and I picked up on all of that, but it was never in response to me or the smell in my oil. My petcock leaks to this day, but I haven't ridden that bike in over a year (cam chain replacement is way beyond my comfort level). At least I know better than to use the unused Shell Rotella T6 that's been sitting in it. Quote:
Obviously, I can't keep expecting people to check theirs if I haven't even taken apart my own, so expect that shortly. |
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February 4th, 2013, 06:15 PM | #30 |
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Okay, now it makes more sense to me. Thank you for spelling that out for me.
If you find that yours is flawed, not just degraded from long exposure to gas, what's the game plan? Fix it? replace it? if you replace it, I'm assuming you'd check the new one for the flaw as well? |
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February 4th, 2013, 06:17 PM | #31 |
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Just took apart my petcock and put it back together. Now its leak free!
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February 4th, 2013, 07:16 PM | #32 | ||
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Edit: Nope. Took mine apart today. Last futzed with by CZroe; February 5th, 2013 at 08:33 PM. |
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