Winterizing Bike

[Sylenthunter96]

Hello I own a 2011 250r ninja and was wondering if i could get some tips on how to prepare it for winter storage. I will not be able to store it inside and the best situation is under a car port. I was wondering what kind of maintenance should i perform before i put the bike away for the winter. I have heard covers can be good and bad, also am worried about tire damage. As of right now I do not have a back tire stand but plan on getting one. Is a front stand necessary and if i don't have one will my front tire get a flat spot. Also wondering what fluids to change and top off. Thanks for reading and have a great day.

[jkv45]

Important things are fresh oil in the engine, coolant that is safe for the low temps in your area, and a full tank of gas with stabilizer.

Draining the floatbowls is a very good idea, as is blocking the intake and exhaust openings.

I'd make sure the tires are about 10 psi above their normal running pressure to keep the sidewalls from flexing as the temps drop. I believe that current tires will not flatspot from sitting, but higher pressure would help that as well.

[dcj13]

Put the battery on a smart charger. If it gets really cold where you are, you might remove the battery, bring it in the house, and put it on the smart charger.

Wine corks fit pre-gen exhaust pipes perfectly. If I were wintering a bike in a carport, I'd use a motorcycle cover.

[Sylenthunter96]

Where is the intake located and how do I drain the float bowls. Also can I leave the battery tender outside for winter. Also I am new to riding and this is my first bike, does it have engine oil and transmission oil. If so i cannot find how to replace the transmission oil.

[Ghostt]

If your battery tender is going to be outside, get the waterproof model, also do not drain carburetors. And remember to treat the gas with a treatment that works with ethanol fuels.

Add gas treatment, fill the tank, ride for at least 1/2 hr, to make sure the treated fuel is fully in the carburetors, then park it, hook up tender.

http://www.goldeagle.com/product/mar...ent-stabilizer

http://www.goldeagle.com/product/sta...ent-stabilizer

The favorite one is the Marine.

[Sylenthunter96]

I'm confused do you mean don't drain the float bowls or the entire carburetor, is there a difference?

Also this is the tender i was looking to get :

http://www.bikebandit.com/manuals-to...-tender-junior

[Ghostt]

Originally Posted by Sylenthunter96

I'm confused do you mean don't drain the float bowls or the entire carburetor, is there a difference?

Also this is the tender i was looking to get :

http://www.bikebandit.com/manuals-to...-tender-junior

Leave the treated fuel in the carburetors, don't do anything.

And this is the tender I was referring to

Battery Tender 022-0150-AAA Waterproof 800 Charger/Maintainer https://www.amazon.com/dp/B007X4S3XM..._qodiwbHDFZGSS

[Sylenthunter96]

Okay thank you for your help. Should I do anything about the tires? Also worried about rust and weather damage.

[dcj13]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

Leave the treated fuel in the carburetors, don't do anything.

OK. I'll bite. What's the rationale behind leaving gas in the float bowls?

[Ghostt]

If you remove the fuel, then you have air, and that leads to problems.

You leave them full, so the treated fuel can keep doing it's job, @ducatiman can explain it much better than I can.

[ducatiman]

The reason for leaving treated fuel in carbs....the carbs are vented to atmosphere, between humidity changes and temp swings draining will allow condensation, your all important jets and float valve are now exposed....no good. The treated fuel simply acts as a protective buffer. Make sense?

The Stabil Marine formula contains higher percentages of the active ingredients as compared to their red stuff. Marine application (boats in water environment, incredibly humid conditions) is engineered for those particularly nasty conditions. I can attest from personal experience, that stuff does work.

AFA battery...I'd suggest to remove, bring indoors, convenient to tender/monitor.

I see you're in PA...so between now and spring...rain, snow, cold, ice, etc. Yup, stabilize and leave.

Leave tank filled with stabil fuel too. Same concept...any exposed metal inside prone to moisture/condensation for same reasons.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Sylenthunter96

Also this is the tender i was looking to get :

If you choose to buy that one, go to wal-mart and buy it. They are only $25 NOT on sale, but can be had for $15 on sale. And they will price match an ad if you can print it out and take it with you.

I have 2 of them, they do their job just fine and the tether is awesome!

[Ghostt]

Thxs @ducatiman , told you all he could explain it better than I could.

[Ghostt]

I got mine from Amazon, for about $25

Battery Tender 021-0123 Battery Tender Junior 12V Battery Charger https://www.amazon.com/dp/B000CITK8S..._udfiwb6KEK4DB

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by Sylenthunter96

Where is the intake located and how do I drain the float bowls. Also can I leave the battery tender outside for winter. Also I am new to riding and this is my first bike, does it have engine oil and transmission oil. If so i cannot find how to replace the transmission oil.

No there is no separate transmission oil.

Underneath the engine you'll find a round plate with a bolt in the middle. That's the cover for the oil filter, which is a cartridge type (different from the spin-on type on your car).

You'll also find the drain plug. You will need to drain the oil, remove and replace the filter





The drain plug has a washer called a crush washer. You're supposed to replace this each time you change the oil, but you can get away with re-using it once or twice.

The oil filter comes with a gasket that you'll use to replace the one on the filter cover, and a smaller one that goes around the bolt that holds the cover on.

The oil filter has several other parts associated with it. Just make sure it gets put back in the same way it came out. It'll be obvious when you take it all apart.



Be careful not to over tighten this stuff.... common newbie mistake is to think that tighter is better. If you screw up you'll do major damage.

Use proper tools. This is not a job for vise grips. If you're going to do maintenance on your bike, then take the time to learn to do it right and buy the tools... and the maintenance manual. It's a really good idea to enlist the help of someone with experience the first time you do this. At the very least study up via Youtube and other online resources.

[adouglas]

I use this. I also agree with the fill-the-tank and stabilize-the-fuel strategy. Once you winterize the bike, don't start it until spring.... if you don't get it good and warm, all you'll do is create condensation inside the engine and that's bad.


If it were me I'd take off the seat, remove the battery, bring it inside and put it on the battery tender. Not because it's bad to leave it outside, but because you'll be running a live extension cord outside all winter long to power the tender.

[jkv45]

I would say bringing the battery inside is a good idea. You can charge it occasionally at 1A if you don't have a tender. My SV650 sat in an unheated shed over the IL winters for 5 years and always fired right up. I changed the oil, brought the battery in (charged it occasionally), checked the coolant, and filled the tank with ethanol-free stabilized fuel (and run enough to get into the entire system).

I always drain the fuel out of the floatbowls in engines with carbs. I've never had an issue with corrosion. The bowls are only about 3/4 full, the fuel in the floatbowls will lose volatility because there is airspace and venting, which will make starting more difficult after sitting.

In warm weather, fuel sitting for an extended period in the floatbowl will lose volatility, evaporate, and create varnish in the bowl and jets. Stabilizer won't stop that.

Use ethanol-free gas if it's available.

[ducatiman]

Originally Posted by jkv45

I always drain the fuel out of the floatbowls in engines with carbs. I've never had an issue with corrosion. The bowls are only about 3/4 full, the fuel in the floatbowls will lose volatility because there is airspace and venting, which will make starting more difficult after sitting.

After draining, that same airspace and venting will immediately lead to exposure to atmospheric humidity, condensation and eventual damage to exposed carb innards.

Additionally, this bike is being winter stored in a carport, for the most part open to the elements.

Does your theory apply to the fuel tank, too, or just the carbs? Draining the tank for storage will not lead to corrosion?

[adouglas]

If the tank is left open to vent, you won't get condensation. An empty or near-empty tank, sealed, could still have moisture in it. If you wash a drinking glass and leave it upside down to dry, it'll say wet inside for a long time because the moist, trapped air has nowhere to go. Same idea.

A full tank minimizes the amount of air available to hold moisture. I'm a private pilot and standard practice is to fill the tanks after landing for the same reason. Keeps condensation from happening. Water in your fuel is a Bad Thing... and part of every preflight is to drain a little fuel out of each tank as well as the carb to check for/eliminate any trapped water.

Leaving the tank open to the atmosphere implies draining the system completely, of course. Personally I don't think it's necessary for winter storage provided you have a full tank of stabilized fuel.

I like the convenience. Come spring, all I have to do is air up the tires, unplug the tender, wheel it outside and go. Always fires right up.

If I were storing a bike for a very long time (vs. just a few months over the winter) I would drain the whole thing... plus do some extra prep like spray fogging oil in the cylinders.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by ducatiman

After draining, that same airspace and venting will immediately lead to exposure to atmospheric humidity, condensation and eventual damage to exposed carb innards.

Additionally, this bike is being winter stored in a carport, for the most part open to the elements.

Does your theory apply to the fuel tank, too, or just the carbs? Draining the tank for storage will not lead to corrosion?

I've not had that happen in the 35 years I've owned cycles. I drain the gas from the floatbowls of all my small engines (snowblowers, lawnmowers) before storing, and I've owned and maintained some of them since the 80s. I work on my own equipment, rebuild carbs when needed, and have an ultrasonic cleaner. I rarely use it on my equipment. They start first pull after storage. If there was corrosion in the floatbowls caused by draining the fuel I would know it by now. I would think leaving gas with ethanol in the bowls would cause more corrosion than nothing at all.

Tank should be full to the top with stabilized (non-ethanol) gas, as I said before.

[Sylenthunter96]

What about intake of the bike i was told to block the intake and exhaust but cannot find where the intake is for my bike. Also about stands is a front stand necessary or just a back stand?

[dcj13]

Originally Posted by Ghostt

If you remove the fuel, then you have air, and that leads to problems.

You leave them full, so the treated fuel can keep doing it's job, @ducatiman can explain it much better than I can.

Originally Posted by ducatiman

The reason for leaving treated fuel in carbs....the carbs are vented to atmosphere, between humidity changes and temp swings draining will allow condensation, your all important jets and float valve are now exposed....no good. The treated fuel simply acts as a protective buffer. Make sense?

The Stabil Marine formula contains higher percentages of the active ingredients as compared to their red stuff. Marine application (boats in water environment, incredibly humid conditions) is engineered for those particularly nasty conditions. I can attest from personal experience, that stuff does work.

Thanks Ghostt and Ducman!

Seems rational. It’s just dumb luck that the stabilizer I buy at my local service station is the marine stuff (as the station is near a marina). Timely discussion, too, as I’m going to mothball the KLR250 next week and break out the K75 for a few months.

[choneofakind]

It makes sense.

I usually just drain the bowls because I put the stabilizer in after the bike is in the garage for the winter... no issues yet.

I've also left the tank nearly empty in previous winters. What was in it was stabilized. No issues there either I attribute that to the fact that it was stored indoors more than the fact that it was stabilized...?

[Ghostt]

This is one of those subjects that has WHATEVER WORKS FOR YOU written all over it, like oil, tires, etc....

Everybody has their own way of doing things, I've stated mine. It's worked for me for a lot of years, add the fogging of oil into the cylinders for long term storage, which is totally up to the individual.

[Sylenthunter96]

Last question. Should I start my bike periodically throughout the winter or let it sit till spring then start it?

[choneofakind]

Let it sit if you're not going to ride it to warm it thoroughly by putting load on the engine. It hurts, but you have to let it sit if you're going to store it.

[Ghostt]

If you can, and the opportunity presents itself on nice winter days, bundle up, and go for a ride.

Otherwise just let it sit.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Sylenthunter96

Last question. Should I start my bike periodically throughout the winter or let it sit till spring then start it?

That's an easy one - no.

After changing the oil, start the engine and run it for about 10 seconds, then don't start it again until you are ready to ride for real.

The fresh oil will coat the engine internals and prevent corrosion during storage. Starting the engine adds moisture, acids, and unburned fuel to the oil - contaminating it. No amount of idling will burn it off, just make it worse. It takes about 20-30 minutes or real riding in warm weather to get the oil (not just the coolant) up to operating temp and begin to remove contaminants.

[cadd]

I always drained the carb bowls in the past. No issues. Starts right up in the spring after I prime it.

I personally store the bikes in the garage with a full tank treated with fuel stabilizer. Then drain bowls. In recent years, I added front and rear lifts. However, in the past, I just had the tires on a few sheet of plywood.

No flat spots. Then again, I only store it for about 3.5 - 4 months.

[adouglas]

Here's the thing.

The whole question of moisture in the system and the possibility of corrosion is not a black-or-white thing. Neither is any of the other stuff associated with winterization.

A closed system with little or no fuel in it left outside (where the temp will swing a lot) COULD get corrosion inside. Doesn't mean it will.

Same with the whole thing about stabilized fuel, or battery maintenance, or getting the tires off the ground. All these things could be done "wrong" and the owner might go year after year and never have a problem starting up in the spring.

Absence of proof is not proof of absence.

You've already heard from people who religiously drain the carbs and have never had a problem. You've also heard from people who religiously leave them full of stabilized fuel and have never had a problem. That should tell you that it's really not that big a deal and you won't damage anything.

Fact: Fuel does go bad over time, so stabilization is a good idea.

Does that mean it'll go bad over the few months of winter storage? Probably not. But why not engage in best practice?

Fact: Air holds moisture and under the correct conditions, you'll get condensation inside your tank.

Does that mean your tank will rust, or that it'll even happen? Probably not. But why not avoid the potential in the first place?

Fact: Lead-acid batteries self-discharge over time and suffer from sulfation if not kept topped up.

Does that mean your battery will be dead in the spring? Probably not. Buy why not keep it charged?

Fact: Tires left sitting will develop flat spots over time, so it's a good idea to get them off the ground.

Does that mean it'll happen over a few months? Probably not. But why not......

You get the idea.

[Sylenthunter96]

Thanks for all the advice guys it really helped me out.

[Kurgan]

I would add one very important thing to all of the above.....

In addition to removing the battery and keeping it on a tender, at least once every 2 to 3 weeks put the battery back on the bike and start it up, get it running and get it up to operating temperature. This takes at least 30 minutes.

This will ensure that the carbs get fresh stabilized fuel in them every few weeks instead of letting the fuel with large amounts of Ethanol sit in the float bowls and possibly dry out, leaving nasty sludge in the jets which equates to a MAJOR headache when riding time finally comes.

It also keeps fresh oil coating the engine and transmission parts so it doesn't all leak back down into the pan. And it also keeps the coolant system flowing so it doesn't clog up and create problems.

Just resist the temptation to actually go out for a ride every time you start up the bike during the winter, motorcycles and snow can be a lethal mix.

[cadd]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

I would add one very important thing to all of the above.....

In addition to removing the battery and keeping it on a tender, at least once every 2 to 3 weeks put the battery back on the bike and start it up, get it running and get it up to operating temperature. This takes at least 30 minutes.

.....says the guy in Texas. I want to see you do this in Buffalo, NY where temps are in the single digits daily.

[choneofakind]

No. Idling until the temp is in operating range is not the same as riding it. That's not an even heating. Once it's off for the winter, leave it. Oil film strength and vapor pressure will make sure everything stays coated in oil.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by Kurgan

I would add one very important thing to all of the above.....

In addition to removing the battery and keeping it on a tender, at least once every 2 to 3 weeks put the battery back on the bike and start it up, get it running and get it up to operating temperature. This takes at least 30 minutes.

Absolutely not. That's a terrible thing to do when you are storing an engine.

Running for 30 minutes in a garage isn't going to get the oil up to operating temp. It may get the coolant up to operating temp, but in the process is contaminating the previously fresh oil with unburned fuel, moisture, and acids.

It takes 30 minutes of real riding in warm temps to bring the oil up to operating temp (200F +). Running in the garage in cold temps won't even get it close.

[Hero Danny]

This guy on facebook just covers the bike with a couple tarps and puts a whole can of WD-40 over the whole bike.

I honestly would just try and buy some winter storage. I know some places will store your bike all winter for $400 (December - April) The have a camera on it that you can access from home so you can check up on your baby whenever you'd like. Ya can't beat the price either

[michvin]

Question about Sta-bil: The one I used last winter is no good already or I can still reuse it?
It is more of a theoretical question, getting another bottle is not a problem.

[jkv45]

Originally Posted by michvin

Question about Sta-bil: The one I used last winter is no good already or I can still reuse it?
It is more of a theoretical question, getting another bottle is not a problem.

Stabil (in the original container) last for years and years. I have some that's probably 5 or 6 years old that I have used without any problem.

[michvin]

Did some research (should get a habit of doing research BEFORE asking questions ).
As I suspected, stabil prevents fuel oxidation by taking the hit of oxidation onto itself, so its shelf life is not unlimited. However, in air-tight original package it should be good for two years, given the color didn't become much darker than original and there's no sediment in the bottle. I'll reuse the one I have then this year.

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by Hero Danny

I honestly would just try and buy some winter storage. I know some places will store your bike all winter for $400 (December - April) ... Ya can't beat the price either

I can beat $400 all day long by storing it myself.... $400 would buy, what, new tires, plus enough oil and other supplies to maintain the bike for a year, plus at least part of a track day? Something like that. Every year. I know which I'd choose.

For someone with zero options for storage -- as in living in an apartment in a sketchy neighborhood -- then maybe. Even then I'd go a long way to avoid paying hundreds of dollars to store a bike.

Personally, I could only justify paying if it was an expensive bike. We all love our motorcycles, but hey, the Ninjette is an entry level machine.