Who's taken off their Kleen Air System?

[walty87]

I'm talking about this DIY: http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9948

Just curious on who's done it? I have a slip on mgp growler, and today I shimmed my carbs w/ 2x 3mm washers and took off the CA emissions junk.

I'm just wondering what the whole Kleen Air System does, and if it would be beneficial to take it off?

Also what would taking off the snorkel do?

[Alex]

info on the kleen air system here:

http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=9948

[WarWolfX0]

first off alex do you realize that he has the same link in his post.

second walty87,
the link you posted has all the information in it

from what i got it is equivalent to the EGR valve in cars
aka more "emissions junk"
it dumps exhaust in to the intake. therefore cooling the exhaust.
what CA emissions junk did you remove as far as i know the Kleen Air System and the stock muffler is the only emissions on the bike.

since you have a aftermarket muffler you won't have any issue with it.

I installed the plate that is in post 24
still haven't finished working on my bike
won't know until spring how it will run.

and really all this info is in the first 2 paragraphs in the link, there even bold.

what isn't in the post is that it might improve fuel economy and power.
but in theory it would make the engine run hotter, too.

[walty87]

Originally Posted by WarWolfX0

first off alex do you realize that he has the same link in his post.

second walty87,
the link you posted has all the information in it

from what i got it is equivalent to the EGR valve in cars
aka more "emissions junk"
it dumps exhaust in to the intake. therefore cooling the exhaust.
what CA emissions junk did you remove as far as i know the Kleen Air System and the stock muffler is the only emissions on the bike.

since you have a aftermarket muffler you won't have any issue with it.

I installed the plate that is in post 24
still haven't finished working on my bike
won't know until spring how it will run.

and really all this info is in the first 2 paragraphs in the link, there even bold.

what isn't in the post is that it might improve fuel economy and power.
but in theory it would make the engine run hotter, too.

thank you for summing it up for me, i was confused on the DIY link.

The ca emissions thing I was talking about can be seen here: http://www.ninjette.org/forums/showthread.php?t=22296

I think it comes on CA Bikes only? idk.

I don't have a full system on my bike, I only have a slip on. So would taking off the Kleen air system be a good idea? Like I said, I did do the shim...

[Gorilla25]

i've done it. it helps cut down or eliminate back fire or popping.

[DSpinler]

But with only a slip-on, don't you run the risk of clogging the catalytic converter that's in the stock piping? (Haven't looked, just remember seeing that somewhere)

[Alex]

Originally Posted by WarWolfX0

first off alex do you realize that he has the same link in his post.

I skipped right past that....

[walty87]

Originally Posted by DSpinler

But with only a slip-on, don't you run the risk of clogging the catalytic converter that's in the stock piping? (Haven't looked, just remember seeing that somewhere)

thats what im asking!

[choneofakind]

I read that too, but I'm pretty sure it was with a stock can. There's plenty of people here with a slip-on and the kleen system gone. If there was an issue, we would have heard something about it in larger quantities before now.

@walty87 removing the snorkel allows a little more air into your airbox. More air = more gas/air mix. More gas/air mix = more power. The main jets on 250's are balls rich, so adding that little extra little amount of air leans the mixture a little bit so it's less rich, and it pulls just a little harder. It also sounds great under throttle and gives the exhaust note a new texture.

[leed]

For what it's worth, I've been running a slip-on (DanMoto) with the KleenAir system without any need to remove it. If you do remove it, though, don't just block off the hose coming from the engine head, make sure you get a breather, otherwise you'll create an area with excess pressure that can just blow seals.

Originally Posted by choneofakind

walty87removing the snorkel allows a little more air into your airbox. More air = more gas/air mix. More gas/air mix = more power. The main jets on 250's are balls rich, so adding that little extra little amount of air leans the mixture a little bit so it's less rich, and it pulls just a little harder. It also sounds great under throttle and gives the exhaust note a new texture.

Though I believe your end result is right, it's a minor technicality: More air =/= more gas/air mix.. More air means a lower gas/air ratio.. It also does not mean you will have more power. There is a peak ratio of gas to air (See: Stoichometric/Theoretical Air) that you have to satisfy for the engine to work at it's best. Adding more gas than air lowers your power and decreases your efficiency with unspent fuel, where as adding more air lowers your power and decreases your efficiency with too much heat.

Regardless, like I said before, I run a slip-on with the kleen air system without any issues, and have been for quite some time now. I saw no reason to take it off, though, as the popping/bubbling I have is only during hard deceleration, and it wasn't to the extent of backfiring so it didn't bother me.

[choneofakind]

Originally Posted by leed

More air =/= more gas/air mix.. More air means a lower gas/air ratio.. It also does not mean you will have more power. There is a peak ratio of gas to air (See: Stoichometric/Theoretical Air) that you have to satisfy for the engine to work at it's best. Adding more gas than air lowers your power and decreases your efficiency with unspent fuel, where as adding more air lowers your power and decreases your efficiency with too much heat.

yes but as has been stated on here before, the main jets are really rich with a factory setup. IE, gasoline is definitively in excess in the combustion reaction at the top end. So, adding a little more air means that there will be less gas in excess, meaning that more will be turned into usable mixture that can be burned. Even with the snorkel pulled, there will still be a safe excess of gasoline, so in this case, adding more air does mean more power up top. The OP just needs to remember to check his needle height so the midrange is not lean. I understand the concept of stoich ratios and burning excess air for economy vs excess fuel for performance and engine cooling.

I'm assuming that whenever someone makes an intake change, they're also going to change their jetting, because if they didn't the intake change would be pointless and negatively impact the engine. Under that assumption, more air = more usable gas+air mix because there would always the proper amount of fuel in the mix

A 14.7 AFR doesn't mean the best performance. It only means that all the air and all the fuel put into the mix will both be entirely used up.

Go look at a dyno print-off. The AFR at 10k-14k rpm is a lower number, usually in the mid to high 13's. Adding an excess of gas gives a smoother and more responsive throttle, and it also helps cool the valves.