How fast do you go on the highway when it's raining?

[kdogg2077]

I know the answer to this question depends on the exact conditions. If it's a heavy rain you'll slow down more than usual. On a really curve stretch of road you also slow down.

But what about on an "average" highway area with an "average" rain. Not a drizzle but not a downpour.

What's the ballpark you ride at? Keep to the speed limit? Maybe 5-10 mph under the limit? Go crazy and speed?

Today was my first time riding in the rain. I was on the highway for 20 miles. I kept the bike at 55mph....probably on the slow side for the road I was on. Although there are a few tight turns where that speed made sense. I just wanted to get this first time down with the bike and myself in one piece...then I'll get my speed up as I get more experience in what conditions will tolerate. I managed to get the bike home without even losing traction for a moment.

[ally99]

Never ride faster than you can see....or stop. Good question, but I've got a conditional answer. In rain, our stopping distance increases, braking changes altogether, so I leave PLENTY of distance between the person ahead of me and my bike. I also use my own visual cues. If I'm having a harder time seeing, I slow down to give myself more time to react with a shorter field of vision. If I can see clearly, I go pretty much right at the speed limit on easy highways if no one else is around. Reiterating though, it's conditional. If anyone's around, or if my gut is screaming at me, I slow way down, even pulling over if I need to. Go with your gut. Err on the side of too slow rather than too fast.

[Sirref]

I ride with the flow of traffic, to go slower is even more dangerous in the rain as you run the risk of being rear ended by someone who doesn't see you due to a lack of vision. I am fully comfortable with pinning it and topping the bike out mid corner on the highway in a downpour but I don't typically do so for obvious reasons. You have more grip than you think in the rain but you do need to be smooth to use it.

[crazymadbastard]

Originally Posted by Sirref

I ride with the flow of traffic, to go slower is even more dangerous in the rain as you run the risk of being rear ended by someone who doesn't see you due to a lack of vision. I am fully comfortable with pinning it and topping the bike out mid corner on the highway in a downpour but I don't typically do so for obvious reasons. You have more grip than you think in the rain but you do need to be smooth to use it.

What about wet sand? Semi-serious question.

Seems sand in more gritty when wet, then there is oil being brought to the surface at the beginning of the rain.

[Sirref]

Originally Posted by crazymadbastard

What about wet sand? Semi-serious question.

Seems sand in more gritty when wet, then there is oil being brought to the surface at the beginning of the rain.

I don't go on the back roads that contain hazards like that in the rain. I'd slow down though and hang off to keep the bike as upright as possible.

[fishdip]

Hey Unregistered never go faster than your brakes can be applied

[Sirref]

swerving works too

[capt_bugaloo]

Too broad of a question to answer easily. I usually stick to the slower lanes and go with the flow of traffic, while trying to maintain a larger buffer zone than normal.

[NevadaWolf]

Average highway with average rain and average traffic.... Still conditional as it really depends on how the road is responding to the rain and how traffic is behaving. I let my bike talk to the road, then have her tell me what she likes and I keep her happy by being cautious and smooth on everything!

If i had to take a guess....

Is it the first rain in awhile? Flow of traffic or about 10-15 under, avoiding the center due to oil and the tire tracks due to puddles. Keeping 3-4 second distance behind the nearest car.

Been raining for awhile? Probably closer to speed limit, maybe 10 under or flow of traffic if slower. Still keep a long distance from nearest car.

Deep desert remote highways with little to no traffic? Speed limit with a generous slowing distance for the curves and going through fairly upright even if it means slowing down to a crawl.

[Ninjinsky]

Move at cruising traffic speed but leave extra distance. I always (in the dry too) ride on the basis "Distance is control".
Too close and you are powerless, totally and completely powerless when sudden happens. Sitting further back, outside your stopping distance, you are master of all

[alex.s]

what i like to think i do:

light rain: be smoother and slow down
heavy rain: try to stay in the open, use your aeros to keep the wet off your eyes
heavy rain with traffic: find a new route... maybe sit it out with some coffee.

what i actually do: **** it. i want to get home. +25.

[misfitsailor]

Like all other times, don't ride beyond your skill level. There is no shame in slowing down when you just don't feel comfortable with the road conditions.

It's already been said, but be extra careful riding in the first rain after a long dry spell. Cars leave a lot of oil on the tarmac, especially going uphill.

[subxero]

normal roads just like to maintain a steady pace and leave more than enough room for well anything.

On the highway, in super slow/stopped traffic, ef it i'm not getting soaked i'm either splitting or rolling up the shoulder cautiously.

heavy but moving traffic, ride with the flow, give room, look ahead to avoid big trucks that kick up a lot of water

light traffic, goes on what kind of feedback i get from the tires and road. As long as water is not pooling in the road or forming mini streams i generally go over speed limit. Once you get going a little over 70mph find that sweet spot behind the screen and the wind is enough to keep the rain from beading up on the visor

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by ally99

Never ride faster than you can see....or stop. Good question, but I've got a conditional answer. In rain, our stopping distance increases, braking changes altogether, so I leave PLENTY of distance between the person ahead of me and my bike. I also use my own visual cues. If I'm having a harder time seeing, I slow down to give myself more time to react with a shorter field of vision. If I can see clearly, I go pretty much right at the speed limit on easy highways if no one else is around. Reiterating though, it's conditional. If anyone's around, or if my gut is screaming at me, I slow way down, even pulling over if I need to. Go with your gut. Err on the side of too slow rather than too fast.

Originally Posted by Sirref

I ride with the flow of traffic, to go slower is even more dangerous in the rain as you run the risk of being rear ended by someone who doesn't see you due to a lack of vision. I am fully comfortable with pinning it and topping the bike out mid corner on the highway in a downpour but I don't typically do so for obvious reasons. You have more grip than you think in the rain but you do need to be smooth to use it.

Originally Posted by NevadaWolf

Average highway with average rain and average traffic.... Still conditional as it really depends on how the road is responding to the rain and how traffic is behaving. I let my bike talk to the road, then have her tell me what she likes and I keep her happy by being cautious and smooth on everything!

If i had to take a guess....

Is it the first rain in awhile? Flow of traffic or about 10-15 under, avoiding the center due to oil and the tire tracks due to puddles. Keeping 3-4 second distance behind the nearest car.

Been raining for awhile? Probably closer to speed limit, maybe 10 under or flow of traffic if slower. Still keep a long distance from nearest car.

Deep desert remote highways with little to no traffic? Speed limit with a generous slowing distance for the curves and going through fairly upright even if it means slowing down to a crawl.

Originally Posted by Ninjinsky

Move at cruising traffic speed but leave extra distance. I always (in the dry too) ride on the basis "Distance is control".
Too close and you are powerless, totally and completely powerless when sudden happens. Sitting further back, outside your stopping distance, you are master of all

Originally Posted by alex.s

what i like to think i do:

light rain: be smoother and slow down
heavy rain: try to stay in the open, use your aeros to keep the wet off your eyes
heavy rain with traffic: find a new route... maybe sit it out with some coffee.

what i actually do: **** it. i want to get home. +25.

Well I see you are all generally on the same page, which is good. I see most of you think that your buffer zone is as important or more so than your overall speed. Am I getting that right?

Of course speed is important too but maybe I overdid it.

NevadaWolf it had rained here within the last few days so I wasn't too concerned about oil and other things. I get what you're saying about "letting the bike talk to the road". I'm just not there yet. Need a few more k on the road to get the experience to really get what the bike is telling me.

Sirref, I was getting passed quite a bit at 55. Maybe next time I'll up my speed to 60 in normal areas.

Ally99, I did try to be careful about stopping distance, especially in town. A couple times I had to stop on a downhill in rain, that was kinda hectic but it all worked out.

One other question, when riding in rain, it better to let the bike lug in high gears or keep it in low gears with high rpm?

[rojoracing53]

As long as there's no one I front of me I'll go as fast as I want in the rain in a strait line. I've hydro planed at well over 100mph many times before in racing and it's not all that scary. Although I can't in good conscience tell others slowing down isn't needed because like everything else it takes experience and practice and the streets no place to be tempting fate.

[Sirref]

I don't recommend going faster than you're comfortable under any circumstances. If you feel that a faster speed may be safer but you aren't comfortable doing it then it's time to find a way to practice. Maybe a track day in the rain would help. I consider myself to be more comfortable than most when it comes to rain. I know several people who refuse to ride in the rain due to fear.

Edit: I'm a bit like rojo in the comfort in the rain (on a 250/300 at least) I've taken some "corners" w/the speedo reading over 100mph in the rain

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by rojoracing53

As long as there's no one I front of me I'll go as fast as I want in the rain in a strait line. I've hydro planed at well over 100mph many times before in racing and it's not all that scary. Although I can't in good conscience tell others slowing down isn't needed because like everything else it takes experience and practice and the streets no place to be tempting fate.

no way jose. hydroplaning on a moto is scarier than a car. only thing that scares me more is an unbeaded tire at 100mph. never have had a front tire go out at 100+ though... what is that like?

[Kscreations08]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

One other question, when riding in rain, it better to let the bike lug in high gears or keep it in low gears with high rpm?

Warning: Another newbie here with only one day in the rain.

It was awful by the way. Flipped the visor up because it fogged and thought I was going to drown. But to answer your question, I prefer to keep the RPM's lower. You want changes in speed and direction to be as smooth as possible. Running the bike in its higher powerband will make things touchy for us new riders. Just as an example. Head out on the bike and run 3rd gear up to 11k and hold it for a minute. Now completely roll off the throttle. Just make sure your knees are gripping that tank. Keep the RPM's low and your transitions smooth

[csmith12]

Link to original page on Vimeo.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

...........Today was my first time riding in the rain. I was on the highway for 20 miles. I kept the bike at 55mph....probably on the slow side for the road I was on. Although there are a few tight turns where that speed made sense. I just wanted to get this first time down with the bike and myself in one piece...then I'll get my speed up as I get more experience in what conditions will tolerate. I managed to get the bike home without even losing traction for a moment.

Alex,

IMHO, six months of riding experience are not enough for riding in the worst possible environment.

Keeping distance and moderate speed is not enough; you need to master extreme changes in direction and speed on wet roads and surrounded by cars whose drivers are out of their comfort zone: some going too fast, some going too slow, none seeing well.

I have been riding on highways under heavy storms for years and I still feel vulnerable to any hydroplaning car that could start a chain reaction.

Yes, I have had more than a close call with hydroplaning cars and fishtailing pick up trucks.

I do not mean that you should not try mastering the bike on wet roads, but please do it in a safer environment.

[nickjpass]

I go to quick.

[CC Cowboy]

These bikes can get wet?

[capt_bugaloo]

If you live in the Pacific Northwest, if you aren't willing to ride in the rain, you won't do much riding at all.

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by Motofool

Alex,

IMHO, six months of riding experience are not enough for riding in the worst possible environment.

Keeping distance and moderate speed is not enough; you need to master extreme changes in direction and speed on wet roads and surrounded by cars whose drivers are out of their comfort zone: some going too fast, some going too slow, none seeing well.

I have been riding on highways under heavy storms for years and I still feel vulnerable to any hydroplaning car that could start a chain reaction.

Yes, I have had more than a close call with hydroplaning cars and fishtailing pick up trucks.

I do not mean that you should not try mastering the bike on wet roads, but please do it in a safer environment.

Yeah I did often regreted riding that day as I rode home. I knew there was a chance of rain I just hoped I'd get lucky. Didn't happen.

I'm gonna leave the bike at home for a while until this crappy PA rain weather clears up. I'm also going to be upgrade from the crappy IRC tires to some Michelins that are supposed to have good wet grip.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

Yeah I did often regreted riding that day as I rode home. I knew there was a chance of rain I just hoped I'd get lucky. Didn't happen.

I'm gonna leave the bike at home for a while until this crappy PA rain weather clears up. I'm also going to be upgrade from the crappy IRC tires to some Michelins that are supposed to have good wet grip.

This video shows the difference between ABS and regular brakes; nevertheless, a well trained rider can do as well as ABS in these conditions.

I want you to note how easy the front wheel locks up and loose steering capability.
That is what a new rider normally does during a dangerous situation and subsequent panic reaction: grab a lot of front brake and lose steering.

More training will teach you how to apply both brakes quickly but gradually, how to look ahead keeping your balance and controlling the steering, as well as how to let go the front brake immediately and briefly after each lock up.

Better wet grip will help, but your skills are all you will have when the dangerous moment comes.

Link to original page on YouTube.

Link to original page on YouTube.

As you can see, after rain washes away all the accumulated oil and debris, there is decent traction (~80% of traction in dry conditions) between rubber and asphalt as to effectively swerve and brake in any evasive maneuver (smoothness is the key):

Link to original page on YouTube.

Link to original page on YouTube.

[gantt]

I've been guilty of riding 140 mph on a straight stretch with now traffic. i generally ride 10-20 moh higher than traffic. with or without rain. i know its not the safe way but, YOLO. seriously, i ride at what i deam to be a safe speed.

[Ninjinsky]

Can't find a "Like" button but nice work putting that lot together Motofool.


Japanese cop is particularly impressive

[csmith12]

I am also guilty of going 130+mph in the wet but it was at the track.

Riding in the wet can be fun! Some of the things I have learned that haven't been posted yet;
Short shift - keeps the rpms in check during gear changes
Smooth roll offs that transition into smooth and progressive braking - no stabbing and poking at the brake lever
Take the time to look, a little common sense goes a long way - you will know when you see it, that sometimes, it's just not worth the risk
See ahead and predict (this will save your life many times over wet or dry)

When traction and traffic permits, I will ride normal speeds on the highway, although sometimes it's best to just take another route home.

Above all, ride with confidence and do not fret the rain so much, a little water ain't so bad.

[Ninjinsky]

Originally Posted by csmith12

See ahead and predict (this will save your life many times over wet or dry)

Yep, If possible watch the brake lights of car in front of the car in front, It can buy you one reaction time maybe half a second .

and try "talkthrough" like the police do constantly watching and speaking out hazzards "gas station, could be spilled diesel" "change to older road surface coming, different traction"
and signs, always note signs especially don't overtake after a left side junction sign (or right side in the States) Whilst you are three quarters to that truck someone will see that slow truck coming but not invisible you and pull out across it to face you head on half way through your pass. (So many people don't think about that one until it happens, Be the one who does )

[Kscreations08]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

One other question, when riding in rain, it better to let the bike lug in high gears or keep it in low gears with high rpm?

I GAVE BAD ADVICE!!! Your RPM question:

http://rideapart.com/2013/08/10-comm...-avoid-them/2/

Read the section about Rain

"Ron Haslam advocates keeping revs up in the wet. The thinking is that, should your rear spin up, you’ll be using a smaller amount of throttle opening, allowing you to regain traction much easier than if you’re riding at 30mph in 6th, at wide open throttle."

[Skullz]

I will always ride faster than traffic on the freeway rain or shine, with the small tail light we have on our bikes it can be difficult for motorist to see unless we apply the brakes.

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by Motofool

This video shows the difference between ABS and regular brakes; nevertheless, a well trained rider can do as well as ABS in these conditions.

I want you to note how easy the front wheel locks up and loose steering capability.
That is what a new rider normally does during a dangerous situation and subsequent panic reaction: grab a lot of front brake and lose steering.

More training will teach you how to apply both brakes quickly but gradually, how to look ahead keeping your balance and controlling the steering, as well as how to let go the front brake immediately and briefly after each lock up.

Better wet grip will help, but your skills are all you will have when the dangerous moment comes.

Link to original page on YouTube.

Link to original page on YouTube.

As you can see, after rain washes away all the accumulated oil and debris, there is decent traction (~80% of traction in dry conditions) between rubber and asphalt as to effectively swerve and brake in any evasive maneuver (smoothness is the key):

Link to original page on YouTube.

Link to original page on YouTube.

It is scary how quickly the bike loses traction with too much brakes, that guy isn't even going that fast. I had to stop on a sharp downhill when I rode in the rain and it made me nervous but the tires held.

Whenever I get another bike ABS is high on my list of wants. Until then I'll just try to practice self control when applying my brakes and keep a huge cushion on the highway.

That Japanese police officer riding his bike around those cones in the wet is pretty impressive. He's aggressive in his turns but the bike never slips. I guess after a while you know what you can get away with.

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by Kscreations08

I GAVE BAD ADVICE!!! Your RPM question:

http://rideapart.com/2013/08/10-comm...-avoid-them/2/

Read the section about Rain

"Ron Haslam advocates keeping revs up in the wet. The thinking is that, should your rear spin up, you’ll be using a smaller amount of throttle opening, allowing you to regain traction much easier than if you’re riding at 30mph in 6th, at wide open throttle."

I'm kinda torn on this one, it would seem to me that letting the bike lug in high rpms would make it less jerky and more smooth. But this advice would help with rear tire slip.

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

I'm kinda torn on this one, it would seem to me that letting the bike lug in high rpms would make it less jerky and more smooth. But this advice would help with rear tire slip.

This question can become more clear by understanding the technology of the bike you're riding. For example, Where is the high torque curve on your bike? Lower rpm or the higher rpm range? Is it a peaky bike? Which is why I short shift, no matter where it falls in the rpm range, you're just asking to get loose when shifting at peak torque.

What is pretty black and white is, keeping your rpms up will help when downshifting and rear skidding/lockup when the road speed does not match or cannot match the engine speed. ie, If you find yourself in the wrong gear at the wrong speed... which would explain why Mr. Haslam advocates higher rpms and I generally tend to agree.

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by csmith12

This question can become more clear by understanding the technology of the bike you're riding. For example, Where is the high torque curve on your bike? Lower rpm or the higher rpm range? Is it a peaky bike? Which is why I short shift, no matter where it falls in the rpm range, you're just asking to get loose when shifting at peak torque.

What is pretty black and white is, keeping your rpms up will help when downshifting and rear skidding/lockup when the road speed does not match or cannot match the engine speed. ie, If you find yourself in the wrong gear at the wrong speed... which would explain why Mr. Haslam advocates higher rpms and I generally tend to agree.

Wait a minute...you've confused my primitive new rider mind. At first you seem to advocate short shifting and letting the bike lugg at low rpms.

Then you mention you agree with Haslam and advocate for high rpms.

Are you saying there is no one perfect rain strategy and that you should change depending on the circumstances?

[Sirref]

he's saying that he advocates short shifting though in the event of a rear lockup or slide you have an easier time controlling it if your rpms are higher. I think

[csmith12]

Originally Posted by Sirref

he's saying that he advocates short shifting though in the event of a rear lockup or slide you have an easier time controlling it if your rpms are higher. I think

Not quite... see below.

Originally Posted by kdogg2077

Wait a minute...you've confused my primitive new rider mind. At first you seem to advocate short shifting and letting the bike lugg at low rpms.

Then you mention you agree with Haslam and advocate for high rpms.

Are you saying there is no one perfect rain strategy and that you should change depending on the circumstances?

As a rule of thumb, short shifting does not equal low rpms. It just means you shift before reaching peak torque. For example; my bike (250) reaches peak torque somewhere around 12.5k rpms. ie, it will pull a small wheelie during the shift from 1st to 2nd on clean, dry tarmac. In the rain... I will shift somewhere around 9k-10k rpms. So you see the rpms are up, but not at peak. Its a preventative thing, not a reactionary thing. Think about this too, a bike has 3 possible gyroscopes to help keep it shiny side up. The front and rear wheels are easy ones, what could be the third???? The engine... Keep it spun up and you will have a 3rd.

And yes, you should be adjusting to conditions. Not all surfaces are the same, and next year you could be on a different set of tires. The last time I tracked in the rain, EVERYONE (not joking here) on dot tires crashed but me. There were 3 riders on rain tires that obviously had more grip but you get the idea. I will dig up some vid of me on a wet track. I think I have some where I rode in what was left of a hurricane a year or so ago (not joking here either).

Going back to my original comment, a (mostly) stock 250's peak torque is somewhere around 12k, give or take depending on the tune. Don't shift there, shift before, pretty simple. But don't lug it either. Because for whatever reason, if you need the power... what little bit there is to be had will not be there.

Hope that helps, if not... I will try again.

[Kscreations08]

[kdogg2077]

Originally Posted by csmith12

Not quite... see below.



As a rule of thumb, short shifting does not equal low rpms. It just means you shift before reaching peak torque. For example; my bike (250) reaches peak torque somewhere around 12.5k rpms. ie, it will pull a small wheelie during the shift from 1st to 2nd on clean, dry tarmac. In the rain... I will shift somewhere around 9k-10k rpms. So you see the rpms are up, but not at peak. Its a preventative thing, not a reactionary thing. Think about this too, a bike has 3 possible gyroscopes to help keep it shiny side up. The front and rear wheels are easy ones, what could be the third???? The engine... Keep it spun up and you will have a 3rd.

And yes, you should be adjusting to conditions. Not all surfaces are the same, and next year you could be on a different set of tires. The last time I tracked in the rain, EVERYONE (not joking here) on dot tires crashed but me. There were 3 riders on rain tires that obviously had more grip but you get the idea. I will dig up some vid of me on a wet track. I think I have some where I rode in what was left of a hurricane a year or so ago (not joking here either).

Going back to my original comment, a (mostly) stock 250's peak torque is somewhere around 12k, give or take depending on the tune. Don't shift there, shift before, pretty simple. But don't lug it either. Because for whatever reason, if you need the power... what little bit there is to be had will not be there.

Hope that helps, if not... I will try again.

OK now I get ya. We'll see maybe I'll get to test this today.

[Ninjinsky]

Heavy rain I generally work around 4k to 7k in the wet, power begins to come on at around 8k and climbs (you can feel that, you don't need a chart) unlikely to spin a wheel under 8k. As for "when you need the power" (assuming that contrary to the previous it is somehow now safe to pile it on in these conditions) How long does a downshift take you?