Old guy runs biker off the road

[Ninjette Newsbot]

A DRIVER is caught swerving into an overtaking motorcycle, then saying ‘I don’t care’ in this helmet camera footage from Texas.

Eric Sanders and his pillion were thrown across the road and into a field when the car veered left and struck them as they attempted to pass.

In the second of the two-part video, the driver is approached by the filming rider, Brian Fisher, who asks: ‘What were you doing? You hit them.’

The driver replies ‘I don’t care,’ before pointing out the ‘double yellow stripes’ in the road. He adds: ‘I got stung by a wasp.’

He then repeats ‘I don’t care,’ to which Fisher responds, ‘I got it on tape. You will care.’

Sanders suffered abrasions in the crash, which happened on Saturday on a single-carriageway road five miles north of Granbury. He said his girlfriend Debra Simpson had to be airlifted to intensive care with a broken wrist and abrasions down ‘to the bone and tendon’ which will require multiple surgeries.

Sanders wrote on Facebook that he overtook because the driver was doing 40mph in a 60mph zone. He said the driver had not been arrested at the scene but police were investigating after seeing the video.

Dub Gillum, spokesman for the Texas Department of Public Safety, said the car driver could face felony charges.

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[reggae5]

Not only did this old guy run into a biker on purpose he doesn't care.
Might even be a ninja bike?
http://www.nbcnews.com/video/caught-...d-547049539748

[csmith12]

/sigh....

[thisisbenji]

...and folks say police are brutal.

[adouglas]

Sue the living **** out of that guy. It's all on video.... That was absolutely intentional.

[greg737]

I thought "Double Yellow" lines meant something like "don't pass here", am I doing it wrong?

[Suki2003]

Biker was in the wrong for passing on double yellow.... But yeah, drivers can't go around trying to kill bikers like that.
He'll be in some trouble.

[thisisbenji]

Originally Posted by greg737

I thought "Double Yellow" lines meant something like "don't pass here", am I doing it wrong?

Two wrongs don't make a right.

[greg737]

Originally Posted by thisisbenji

Two wrongs don't make a right.

I wasn't suggesting any such thing.

Just watching the early portion of this video made me cringe, seeing the obvious impatience of the riders and the presence of the double yellow. Why do people decide that the rules don't apply to them?

(Before you get up in my face over this observation you should know that I fly for a major airline. Who do you want up in the cockpit of the aircraft you're riding on: A rule-follower or somebody who thinks rules are for everybody else?)

[spooph]

@greg737 - that's my take as well. It's so easy for motorcyclists to jump on the band wagon against the driver, and no doubt, what the driver did was atrocious, but didn't the rider have the option to not pass, the whole time, and wait for a passing lane?

Just because he could comfortably pass, and maybe if he passed faster he could have avoided the crotchety old man, doesn't mean he has to.

Another reason why the ninjette is such a perfect bike. Not enough power to temp you into doing something like this. The ride is just fine in traffic. Need for speed? There are many places better suited to getting your lean on...

What I'm saying is that both parties are at fault.

If I were on scene, I would have asked the car driver why he didn't report the motorcycle to the authorities and instead attempted to take his life?

This brings up another point which is very uncomfortable: How do we, as friends of riders, talk about these situations? Obviously, we want to take the side of the motorcyclist, because it could easily have been us. We want to assign blame, as it makes the situation easy to understand, but that would require us to assign part of the blame to the rider, which feels like we're being traitors...

I just recently had a very opinionated, very stubborn friend suffer the same situation. All he can think about it retribution/revenge, but in the end, it seems to me he should be mad at himself for doing the wrong thing, and the driver should be charged with attempted vehicular homocide or something?

Or he could've just gotten a 250 and been happy with the ride as is?! :P Trying to add some humor to this difficult discussion .

[thisisbenji]

@greg737

I agree, motorcylist was reckless.

It's hard to feel TOO bad for him. It was an easily preventable situation.

The hard thing in situations like this is to place blame on both parties. I've found than whenever my riding buddies do dumb **** that bites them in their ass I can't exactly tell them it might have been their fault.

I'm not really sure how to tell motorcyclists that they're riding like a jackass.

For instance, guy does 100 mph down highway and gets busted (hypothetical). Guy gets pissed at cop for arresting him, guy doesn't understand what he did wrong. When one of his friends points out he should have been going slower he gets pissed at friend and still doesn't understand what he did wrong.

Now lets say he's going 100 mph and gets cut off by a car, this causes a crash. Of course it's the cars fault, if someone tells the rider otherwise he isn't going to admit he is in the wrong.

I hope at least someone followed that, I'm having a hard time putting it into words.

[TnNinjaGirl]

From what I understand they were wearing little if any gear and sustained some bad road rash.

3 wrongs don't make a right.

[adouglas]

<rant>

My $0.02:

In many areas there are double-yellow lines where they are not needed... long straight sections with plenty of visibility. It is very clear from the video that this was one of those places.

So legally... yeah, the motorcyclist should not have passed. From a practical/safety standpoint, the pass was legit.

In this instance, it's pretty much the equivalent of jaywalking, speeding, or not coming to a complete stop at an empty intersection. All of which are things we do every day and technically safety issues, but under the right circumstances, trivial.

So it was a wrong move, but no reason to TRY TO F*CKING MURDER SOMEONE.


m'kay?

Had one of the people on that bike died, the guy would be tried for vehicular homicide. It was premeditated action intended to cause injury or death. Period.

</rant>

[snot]

the guy was slowing down and driving unsafe. You can pass in double yellow if you are passing a driver who is driving unsafe. My opinion is he baited them. The girl was not guilty of anything but yet she ended up with the most injuries. The driver should go to jail for attempted vehicular manslaughter.

[Motofool]

Originally Posted by reggae5

Not only did this old guy run into a biker on purpose he doesn't care.
.........

The old guy was a few screws short of a hardware store, and we riders should be aware that such type of persons share the public roads with motorcyclists every day.

The rider had no reason not to use the left portion of the lane, not to see the crazy eyes of the driver in the left mirror and to be so noisy and evident during his attempted pass.

It may become a bad thing not to be able to swerve and brake better than a non-sport car.

That is just my opinion, of course.

[greg737]

Originally Posted by thisisbenji

@greg737

I agree, motorcylist was reckless.

It's hard to feel TOO bad for him. It was an easily preventable situation.

The hard thing in situations like this is to place blame on both parties. I've found than whenever my riding buddies do dumb **** that bites them in their ass I can't exactly tell them it might have been their fault.

I'm not really sure how to tell motorcyclists that they're riding like a jackass.

For instance, guy does 100 mph down highway and gets busted (hypothetical). Guy gets pissed at cop for arresting him, guy doesn't understand what he did wrong. When one of his friends points out he should have been going slower he gets pissed at friend and still doesn't understand what he did wrong.

Now lets say he's going 100 mph and gets cut off by a car, this causes a crash. Of course it's the cars fault, if someone tells the rider otherwise he isn't going to admit he is in the wrong.

I hope at least someone followed that, I'm having a hard time putting it into words.

I think I understand you. Sounds like you're saying a lot of people's ideas, expectations and reactions just don't make sense in a sober final analysis.

The results are often messy and emotionally charged and as such very hard to debrief in anything like a constructive manner.

Riding is fun and there's no doubt that freedom = exhilaration. For a lot of people those things are so attractive they're willing to engage in and cling to some very flawed thinking/reasoning.

[fry1024]

I really feel bad for the pillion. She took the blunt of it and never had a choice in the matter.

[Panda]

I don't understand why some of us as motorcyclists try to rationalize/justify somebody breaking the law/making a poor decision just b/c they are on a bike.

The dude passed on a double yellow. You're not supposed to do that.
The old dude tried to kill him. You're really not supposed to do that.

Old dude is really wrong.
Motorcyclists is also wrong.

Everyone can still be mad at old dude without making excuses for the biker's ill-advised move.

[thisisbenji]

Originally Posted by Panda

I don't understand why some of us as motorcyclists try to rationalize/justify somebody breaking the law/making a poor decision just b/c they are on a bike.

The dude passed on a double yellow. You're not supposed to do that.
The old dude tried to kill him. You're really not supposed to do that.

Old dude is really wrong.
Motorcyclists is also wrong.

Everyone can still be mad at old dude without making excuses for the biker's ill-advised move.

I suppose, sure the biker was wrong. No argument there.

Problem is the cars wrong was just so much worse that it's easy to forget what the bike did wrong.

The bikers wrong wouldn't have ruined anyone's day.

The drivers wrong ruined more than just one day for more than just one person.

Ask yourself, if the car didn't do what it did would we be having this conversation?

[alex.s]

Originally Posted by greg737

I wasn't suggesting any such thing.

Just watching the early portion of this video made me cringe, seeing the obvious impatience of the riders and the presence of the double yellow. Why do people decide that the rules don't apply to them?

(Before you get up in my face over this observation you should know that I fly for a major airline. Who do you want up in the cockpit of the aircraft you're riding on: A rule-follower or somebody who thinks rules are for everybody else?)

rules are for the weak minded.

[greg737]

I was wondering where you were.

You should remember from our prior dealings that I'm liable to and quite capable of hurting your little feelings. And then you use your pull here on this website to have me banned for yet another year (not that I can't handle it, you've done it to me twice so far).

[snot]

I see the issue... the video in the OP is not the full video. Video is NSFW language

http://lanesplitter.jalopnik.com/dri...nik%29&ref=yfp
https://www.facebook.com/eric.sander...6338559935597/

Link to original page on YouTube.


now you can see why it was understandable to pass. the guy in the car slowed way down for no reason.

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by thisisbenji

@greg737

I agree, motorcylist was reckless.

It's hard to feel TOO bad for him. It was an easily preventable situation.

The hard thing in situations like this is to place blame on both parties. I've found than whenever my riding buddies do dumb **** that bites them in their ass I can't exactly tell them it might have been their fault.

I'm not really sure how to tell motorcyclists that they're riding like a jackass.

For instance, guy does 100 mph down highway and gets busted (hypothetical). Guy gets pissed at cop for arresting him, guy doesn't understand what he did wrong. When one of his friends points out he should have been going slower he gets pissed at friend and still doesn't understand what he did wrong.

Now lets say he's going 100 mph and gets cut off by a car, this causes a crash. Of course it's the cars fault, if someone tells the rider otherwise he isn't going to admit he is in the wrong.

I hope at least someone followed that, I'm having a hard time putting it into words.

Y'know, I'd agree with you if the rider was riding like an a$$hat and going 100 mph, or sharing the lane with a car, or any of the other common squid moves.

But he wasn't.

The ONLY thing he did that wasn't perfectly on the up-and-up was pass in a double-yellow zone. He wasn't going fast. He wasn't riding erratically or aggressively. I just don't buy the "reckless" tag. That was a controlled pass on a clear road at a reasonable speed.

One of my commuting routes is along a winding two-lane road. Every day I follow people -- INCLUDING COPS -- who pretty much ignore the double yellow if there's nobody coming the other way.

Does that deserve attempted homicide? Because that's what this was. Nothing less.

[choneofakind]

Snot, I gotta disagree. That video just shows how fast the riders were going. My guess is that road get buzzed by fast riders all the time. This one just happened to be the unlucky one when the old bastard decided to finally act on his building annoyance



That said, he should have been a functioning member of society and called the police to report idiot motorcyclists and used his horn like every other driver who's displeased by fast motorcyclists. The riders were wrong. But that's not justification for the old man to become a vigilante with a 2 ton weapon. The fact that he came out saying he didn't care just makes it that much worse. I hope he gets sued for every penny in his retirement fund. That inexcusable; all road rage is.

As a rider who occasionally interprets the markings incorrectly, I have to imagine this old man isn't the only one with his attitude. It's always in the back of my mind when I pass. When I do, I do my best to get around quickly and back in the lane so as not to be a nuisance. But holy crap, this was sobering to watch.

[snot]

@Alex
can you add this to the other thread?

[snot]

it does give more of the story, right or wrong. the article has more information, that is where it is stated the guy is going 20 mph less than the speed limit.

But, for the sake of argument... no matter what you always make sure you can pass safely. If at anytime you are questioning how someone is driving, a void them. The other vehicle they passed was not trying to go around him, there must of been a reason for that.

what is done is done. An innocent girl was injured, a driver intentionally hit the bike, cops and lawyers need to sort it all out now.

[ninjamunky85]

This is why I very rarely pass in double yellow, you just never know if you're gonna piss the wrong person off. If and when I do pass someone in the double yellow I'm gonna make the pass as quickly as possible and be watching the other driver like a hawk.

Basically, don't even give them a chance to hit you.

[cbinker]

For those that are saying it was legit for the motorcyclist, you are wrong. he should not have been that close to the line to begin with if he was going to pass in a no passing zone. stay far left to make that pass to prevent situations like this or if that car has to make a legit sudden move you have room to react.

[csmith12]

Hmmm, looks all too familiar to me. If it goes anything like how it went in my little town. The riders will get nothing, maybe a ticket for an improper pass. The old gent is most likely going to jail. You simply can't do stuff like that unless your life's in danger. And clearly, the video does not show that. His attitude is going to be hard to defend. :\

[Jono]

You all will be happy to know,

William Crum, the Texas driver who hit two motorcyclists as they tried to pass him in a no-pass zone and whose “I don’t care” statement afterward in went viral over the weekend, has been arrested and charged with two counts of aggravated assault with a deadly weapon.

However, the biker is also in some trouble...

They also cited Sanders for passing in a no-pass zone and driving with an invalid license.

Read more here: http://lanesplitter.jalopnik.com/dri...-ag-1737478401

[TnNinjaGirl]

I stalked Sander's Facebook for awhile. Apparently he's been in several accidents and has a f*** the world attitude.

I hate that he and his passenger had to go through that experience and I personally believe the driver of the car was absolutely wrong in hitting them...

However, the guy has a history of mischief and he and his girlfriend are both old enough to know they need to be wearing gear. She knew the consequences of her getting on the back of the bike and he knew the consequences of riding the bike.

They're starting a go-fund-me because of the accident. I highly disagree because he should have been licensed and carrying insurance enough to take care of most of the situations he might find himself in. Apparently he didn't even have a license. So why are people paying for their bad judgement? Those surgeries could be avoided by a $300 suit from Cycle Gear.

[cbinker]

Originally Posted by TnNinjaGirl

I stalked Sander's Facebook for awhile. Apparently he's been in several accidents and has a f*** the world attitude.

I hate that he and his passenger had to go through that experience and I personally believe the driver of the car was absolutely wrong in hitting them...

However, the guy has a history of mischief and he and his girlfriend are both old enough to know they need to be wearing gear. She knew the consequences of her getting on the back of the bike and he knew the consequences of riding the bike.

They're starting a go-fund-me because of the accident. I highly disagree because he should have been licensed and carrying insurance enough to take care of most of the situations he might find himself in. Apparently he didn't even have a license. So why are people paying for their bad judgement? Those surgeries could be avoided by a $300 suit from Cycle Gear.

link to his Facebook?

[TnNinjaGirl]

https://www.facebook.com/eric.sanders.585 @cbinker

[cbinker]

Wow, he needs to be eliminated from society. worthless piece of ****.

[spooph]

Originally Posted by adouglas

One of my commuting routes is along a winding two-lane road. Every day I follow people -- INCLUDING COPS -- who pretty much ignore the double yellow if there's nobody coming the other way.

Does that deserve attempted homicide? Because that's what this was. Nothing less.

Why so aggressive?

Over simplifying the issue to prove an emotion-based argument provides clarity, however, it does not encompass all of the information which in turn changes the issue.

Life isn't about what we deserve, it's about what we get. I think the point being made here is the rider had the option and ability to avoid this situation completely. This is not a rationalization of what either party did, simply an identification that there was a better option - along with carrying insurance and wearing appropriate gear.

I agree it was attempted manslaughter though.

Glad to hear about the ruling - wish there was coverage of this guy in prison...

[allanoue]

I have no sympathy for anyone involved except the girl on the back maybe. Cager needs to go to jail. Rider needs to learn to ride and were protective gear.
I do love it when asshats butt heads with each other.

[adouglas]

Originally Posted by spooph

Why so aggressive?

Over simplifying the issue to prove an emotion-based argument provides clarity, however, it does not encompass all of the information which in turn changes the issue.

Life isn't about what we deserve, it's about what we get. I think the point being made here is the rider had the option and ability to avoid this situation completely. This is not a rationalization of what either party did, simply an identification that there was a better option - along with carrying insurance and wearing appropriate gear.

I agree it was attempted manslaughter though.

Glad to hear about the ruling - wish there was coverage of this guy in prison...

Would you feel differently if the driver had pointed a gun out of his window and shot the motorcyclist?

Poor driving, aggressive driving, stupid driving, yeah, fine. Chalk it up to stupidity. But willful intent to kill... that goes over the line. Even if the cyclist HAD been riding like a jerk, which he was not.

The guy on the bike was just trying to go about his business and wasn't riding aggressively. He didn't try to zoom past at warp speed. He didn't crowd the car. He was just making a normal pass around slow-moving traffic, and someone tried to kill him for it.

Am I the only one who finds that completely outrageous?

The guy in the car was going 20 mph under the limit. I dare say that most here would have made that pass, double yellow or no. I would have.

Tell me... if you happen upon a farm tractor trundling down a two-lane, do you wait for a passing zone? Be honest. If that's a different situation than coming up on a car going 20 mph under the limit, then how is it different?

I don't get torqued up that often, but this one really got to me.

[thisisbenji]

Originally Posted by adouglas

Am I the only one who finds that completely outrageous?

No, your just being overly emotional. Is it that time of month?

[ninjamunky85]

Originally Posted by TnNinjaGirl

I stalked Sander's Facebook for awhile. Apparently he's been in several accidents and has a f*** the world attitude.

Isn't it funny how bad things seem to happen more often to people with this kind of attitude. Coincidence or something more?

Also doesn't surprise me that a gofundme campaign was started. Didn't have insurance cause that's for losers, so now I'll ask random friends, family, and strangers to pay for my mistakes.

[VaFish]

Originally Posted by adouglas

Am I the only one who finds that completely outrageous?

The guy in the car was going 20 mph under the limit. I dare say that most here would have made that pass, double yellow or no. I would have.

Me riding by myself (ie daughter not with me on her bike) I would have made the pass too if the car was 20 mph under the speed limit.

While the bike rider is no choir boy, the car driver intentionally ran his car into the bike. I'd say it was attempted murder, but that's probably harder to prove and probably why they charged him with 2 counts of assault with a deadly weapon (the car). So in the eyes of the law it is the same as if he had pointed a gun at the biker and his passenger.

The car driver should, and probably will, go to prison for several years.

The biker sounds like an asshat and should go to jail for a couple months on the invalid license, no insurance, and illegal passing. I won't be donating to him for his surgery costs.

So I'm outraged at both of them.